Obviously, I am guessing that you think this means she doesn't have the right to be offended by the comments in the c-section thread then.
Did that seem like a big leap?
Hopefully so, because your mention of that thread here, referencing a specific poster participating in both threads, as though the two have ANYTHING to do with each other is equally ludicrous.
You are picking on someone who is standing up for her opinion AND trying to educate people so that her son (and other people, as well) are protected from ignorant use of language by ignorant or incompassionate people.
ETA: I just got a notice in my email that you replied to my post...how is suggesting that we ask OMB which one of two situations is more painful DEFENDING her, which is what it would appear you're saying you're trying to do??
The point is that there have been countless threads here about comments that some of us find offensive. Most of the time, almost everyone here will bend over backwards to avoid offense, but in this case there seem to be a number of people who shrug their shoulders and say, oh well, everyone else is saying it! If you can be sensitive enough to avoid saying "you should be grateful you have a child" to someone who had a c-section, you should be able to think of a substitute for "that's sooo retarded" to mean something you don't like.
I hesitate to even post, but hey, I'm a glutton for punishment.
No one here, that I've seen, has either NOT condemned the comment by Obama, or said that they use the term. The worst that's been said is that they don't feel the same outrage when they hear it, because the term has become more vernacular than actually used in the way it was originated.
I'm not going to debate that. However, it's been said that "lame" and "crazy" aren't as bad because THEY are so much in the mainstream. That people wouldn't use those words in front of someone who is lame or crazy or fat, but that it is not as bad as retarded. The problem with that rationale is, if that's why it's o.k. to use those words, then if people use the term "retarded" MORE, wouldn't it become - not o.k., but not worth arguing over?? And why is it o.k. to use a term like crazy as long as someone crazy or related to crazy isn't around?
The funny thing is, if this were a thread about using the "N" word, many of you would say you NEVER, but some would ask why it's not o.k. if WE say it. Well, is it o.k. for the mentally disabled (BTW, I know many who don't want to be called disabled, so is that now off the table?)?
This is a good point, and it kinda goes along with this statement.
Originally Posted by rehoboth
I avoid using the words fat, lame, crazy, psycho, etc, around people who either are (in the purest senses of those words) or if I know they have family who are. But I would use these words in a joking manner, or as a colloquial part of the English language.
You know how words begin to have colloquial meanings? Because we use them that way. If the word "retarded" was continued to be used to mean "stupid" then that would become a colloquial meaning.
Just something to think about. We give words meanings.
To be honest Wendy, sometimes I can't figure out whether you are playing devil's advocate or poking deliberately. Either way, you seem to do an awful lot of 'but that's not what I meant!'. And I say to myself: "Wendy can't have meant that, can she?"
Perhaps your delivery is off?
I dream in emails, worn-out phrases
Mile after mile of just empty pages
The point is that there have been countless threads here about comments that some of us find offensive. Most of the time, almost everyone here will bend over backwards to avoid offense, but in this case there seem to be a number of people who shrug their shoulders and say, oh well, everyone else is saying it! If you can be sensitive enough to avoid saying "you should be grateful you have a child" to someone who had a c-section, you should be able to think of a substitute for "that's sooo retarded" to mean something you don't like.
Yes, I realize that. Are you quoting me to disagree, or agree with me? I think we have the same point of view on this one. I just think that if Wendelah was suggesting that particular question to OMB in order to AGREE with her point of view, then it was a pretty obtuse way to do it, because it certainly read to me (and it would seem, several others) like an attack.
Originally Posted by wendalah
If you think I dragged the c-section thread in here on my own, then I fully understand you calling me a bitch. I didn't though.
I never called you a bitch. I don't really know you well enough to make that statement. Also, I did read the whole thread, but I was skimming from time to time, so if you weren't the first to bring it up, well, hooray for you and boo on me for missing whoever did. However, I stand by my telling you to STFU with that crap, because I certainly read it as an attack on Betsy.
It is particularly disgusting to me, in this era where one would literally need to *work* to not encounter a person with mental disabilities, not have access to information about what that life is like, not have freaking seen a movie or read a book or watched an episode of Oprah, to see people who truly have zero burden of appreciation for the astonishingly great physical and emotional challenges that come with those disabilities for not only a person with disabilities, but my God, for the mother of a living breathing child with disabilities. That *anyone* would then call her a smart ass, because she pointed out your ignorance in using a word that is blatantly offensive, not only to her but to me and everyone I know, and it has been proven to most people in this thread, is the height of ignorance.
This whole argument of "lame" and "gay" and "crazy" is just static to the over-riding issue, which is that the President made a remark that was unintentionally disparaging but nonetheless hurtful and inappropriate. And in this thread, people are actually trying to defend the remark, and a similar (worse) remark that is directly insulting to the very young children of 2 women posting. I'm a very big fan of Obama's. I wish he hadn't said what he did, because it is wrong, and because it offended people like Sarah and OMB who bear a burden that folks as ignorant as some of you are acting here could never begin to be able to imagine, let alone carry yourselves. At least he proved that he knows better, by apologizing for his mistake. Why can't you show that you know better? Because you can't, or because you won't?
Right on. I am way behind but this thread is absolutely astonishing. Truly.
Either way, you seem to do an awful lot of 'but that's not what I meant!'.
I give up. I said I was angry and posted as such last night.
The comparison to the "grateful" thread, which was about c-sections and people saying things like "You should be grateful," to me seemed like a ridiculous parallel. The person who has come in here and said she was hurt (OMB) also commented in the "grateful" thread that those comments were irritating. In complete exasperation at what I considered to be a ridiculous parallel I said--ask her which "hurtful" situation is worse.
That's what I meant.
"Every man is my superior in some way. In that, I learn of him" - Emerson
However, I stand by my telling you to STFU with that crap, because I certainly read it as an attack on Betsy.
It is NOT meant as an attack on Betsy. I am friends with Betsy. If she considers this an attack then I wholeheartedly apologize to her. I was pointing out the complete ludicrousness of trying to compare the "you should be grateful" sentiment to offensive use of the term "retarded."
"Every man is my superior in some way. In that, I learn of him" - Emerson
Originally Posted by amy_awesome
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