Thoughts on putting animal down

[gayle]

I we all of you a huge apology. Somehow I deleted the whole original thread here. I have no idea how I, in responding to this thread did that, but I owe you all deep and sincere apologies.

I will do my best top get the original O orinal post in tact.
I am sooo lame,

I deeply apologize,
g

[mrs_pell]

I see a sound reason to put ANY biter down.

Sorry if that sounds cold, but those of you that know me, and know my love of dogs, should undersatnd my thinking...

I will say it again. I don't really give a shit WHY, the dog bites, if it bites, conscsitently, and multiple times, it ( IMHO) is a candidate to be moved on.


You honestly think that there's a sound reason to put any biter down? If a dog is biting consistently, there may be a reason for it. If everything has been tried, and the dog's still biting, then yeah...maybe putting it down is appropriate. But, I just don't think that any biter should automatically put down.

I love our dog, and I *like* most dogs, but I don't consider myself a huge "dog lover," and I gotta say, I'm a bit shocked at your post.

eta: I'm also really wondering why you felt the need to start a whole new thread about this?? Not that you certainly don't have that right, but I was just curious why you didn't just post this in the other thread, which is about just this.

[gayle]

"
You honestly think that there's a sound reason to put any biter down?"

Yes, I do.

However, we could debate, nips and bites.
But, I think we are all discussing "bites"...

I will try to qulalify..

Any dog which ever bites (me) out of agression, and attack, that is not motivated by momentery reactionary fear,..

AND.. this animal has history of REACTIONARY fear ( undependabale dog beast), IF, that animal bites, more than once, and lives in a situation of kindness, and does it yet, again...

Sorry, I am all for the put down.

[PookiePrincess]

I don't think a dog should be put down because he/she is a consistent biter. I don't have tons of experience with different types of dogs, but we've had a few biters.

When I was little we had a cocker spaniel who bit me a couple of times, once in the face. He wasn't an aggressive dog and I think he bit me because I aggravated him.

My mom has a dog who was VERY aggressive. He was fine as a puppy, but when he went to obedience school and was around other dogs, his aggression came out. He bit me, my brother, other family members, and friends who would come over to our house. When family would come visit, he would have to be put in his cage in the garage because he couldn't behave. A lot of his aggression with us was caused by him being possessive of his toys/treats. These were stopped. As he's gotten older, he's mellowed a lot. People can come over and he will behave himself. I can't tell you the last time he's bit someone...it's been many years.

I think that just because a dog bites, that doesn't mean he should be put to sleep. If that was true, my mom's dog would have been put down by the time he was 2 years old. He's 11 years old now and isn't aggressive.

[gayle]

Mrs. Pell, I can only say you might be shocked, to hear how a dog breeder(lover) might speak.

Pet owners and breeders, sometimes are differnt breeds.

[claribella]

Gayle..as the previous poster said..I am shocked that you felt the need to start a whole thread about your anger on our thoughts on someone putting their dog down.

I ask you did you READ the LJ entry that that thread was talking about?

The lady who put down that dog did NOT try all the options and from what she posted was very shady about the whole thing. But I also kinda feel that she was just trying to rile people up but that would be a whole other issue.

The poster of that LJ entry said the dog bite her but then that SAME DAY puts the dog down. I got the feeling she just didn't like the dog and didn't want to deal with it anymore.

Of course, if a dog is a CONSTANT biter and is a menace to society, that would be a valid reason but this PARTICULAR LJ entry that that thread was talking about did not seem this way.

[claribella]

Oh and for the record...the thread that Gayle is referring to is:

http://www.constantchatter.com/showthread.php?t=8564

And the LJ post that THAT thread is referring too is...
http://www.livejournal.com/community/jrterriers/296282.html

[mrs_pell]

Mrs. Pell, I can only say you might be shocked, to hear how a dog breeder(lover) might speak.

Pet owners and breeders, sometimes are differnt breeds.

Huh?? I gotta say, Gayle, usually your posts are very well thought out and eloquent, but tonight, I'm kinda having a hard time understanding a lot of what you're saying. :confused:

[claribella]

Huh?? I gotta say, Gayle, usually your posts are very well thought out and eloquent, but tonight, I'm kinda having a hard time understanding a lot of what you're saying. :confused:


Mrs. Pell...what you typed here were my thoughts exactly....But before I let it get to me...I wish Gayle would answer my question...if she read the LJ entry that thread was referring too..

[gayle]

Actually, bad temperament is the ONLY reason to put a dog down...

Personally I see any extensive biting, or fear incidents, or any other example of agression, as being questionable. And justifieable for euthanasia.

Flame me if you want, but my views are based on 20 years of breeding, and experience.

To me, agression, is the big issue (and I am pretty flexible, I know what I see after years of experience)

Sorry, a chronically aggresive, biting dog, gets a one way ticket ( and I am sorry if that offends)

I have ZERO tolerance for dogs that would bite humans...

[gayle]

Just so you know Claribella, I do not do LJ, so I have no clue what your LJ references are about.

[claribella]

Just so you know Claribella, I do not do LJ, so I have no clue what your LJ references are about.

Well I posted it here..a couple of posts above.

I know that you are referring to the other dog biting thread in this pets forum.

Read the LJ entry...in that thread. The woman I am referring to in that LJ entry did NOT try everything she could for her dog and obviously hated the dog and just wanted to kill it.

But why would you start this thread and say this:
I have read the thread about anger, toward the dog owner who would put a dog down for biting.
If you obviously haven't read the whole thing...and the LJ entry it was referring to?

However, you have your opinions, no prob. I just disagree.

[gayle]

Well, Claribella if that was the case, and I apologize for not neing very well read ( on Lj and such)

Just so you all know, I am NEVER, an advovate of randomely putting an animal down.

And I DEEPLY, believe that every animal deserves a chance. BUT, I will state again, biting, in any aggressive form, deep fearfulness, hiding, timididty, hostility, over-alpha behaviour.......

These are ALWAYS things to watch.

Man, I just realized, you guys mostly, have never been dog breeders.'

I apologize, dog breeders, ARE different than dog owners.

I still say, an aggressive biting dog, without LOTS of secondary circumstance to support his reasoning of biting, should probaly be put down.

Hate me if you want, but my judgement IS based on experience.

[claribella]

Gayle, Hate you? who said that...I certainly didn't...

And yes, you are right. You are getting your opinions from being a Dog Breeder. I understand that. My opinions are coming from being very upset at the woman who murdered her dog because she didn't want it anymore.

Just different experiences here...but no hating. Not from me anyway. Don't accuse me, or really anyone here of that.

[gayle]

I never said you hated me.

Good grief.

This is about what is right in terms of valueing animals. And part of valueing them, is not allowing them to suffer by being passed home to home. And IF, they are inherently agressive, that in pasing that on, to a new home, you are FULLY honest. My esperience is that p[eople are NOT honest/ A secnario..

"he only bites around men:... "he only bites around women" He only bites around alpha dogs"...

He only bites children, under 3.......


Is anybody getting my point here?

I LOVE dogs, beyond belief. But I will not excuse unneceptable behaviour, from them. I will NOT make excuses for them.

I will also not jusitfy consistent bad behaviour from a dog.

Like it or leave it, some dogs are just made of bad stock (whole other thread, what makes a good breeder)..

If you, as a pet owner, want to put up with any level of trauma, that is your bis.

But if you make a thread, asking for opinions. You might get em.

[gayle]

I never said you hated me.

Good grief.

This is about what is right in terms of valueing animals. And part of valueing them, is not allowing them to suffer by being passed home to home. And IF, they are inherently agressive, that in pasing that on, to a new home, you are FULLY honest. My esperience is that p[eople are NOT honest/ A secnario..

"he only bites around men:... "he only bites around women" He only bites around alpha dogs"...

He only bites children, under 3.......


Is anybody getting my point here?

I LOVE dogs, beyond belief. But I will not excuse unneceptable behaviour, from them. I will NOT make excuses for them.

I will also not jusitfy consistent bad behaviour from a dog.

Like it or leave it, some dogs are just made of bad stock (whole other thread, what makes a good breeder)..

If you, as a pet owner, want to put up with any level of trauma, that is your bis.

But if you make a thread, asking for opinions. You might get em.

[claribella]

I never said you hated me.

Good grief.


Uh, well all I saw was this:

Hate me if you want, but my judgement IS based on experience.

Sounds like your saying it there...


And Gayle, I can't follow your postings here...so I'm just gonna leave it at that. The LJ post is all I'm referring to and I thought you were referring to that post too and that is why you started this thread. That woman Murdered her dog. That is what upsets me, I've said that already.

[gayle]

Clairibella. that was a generalized statement. "You", was a generalized statement, not directed at "you" personally.

But OMG, I owe all of you participants in this thread an apology. Somehow I merged the thread wrongly, and completely wrecked the OP's original post. I deeply apologize.
Funny, I have been avoiding responding to this thread for several days, because I knew, my view would not be read right.

And then I do, an f' it up somehow by scrambling the original posts (NOT intentionallY..

At any rate, I am an idiot mod (but my thoughts on canines stand) I DEEPLY apologize, and I Will do my best to see to it the thread is restored properly.

I am SO sorry.

[claribella]

Gayle...YOU aren't the one who started this thread? You were the first poster...

Now I feel like a horse's butt...but I'm seriously confused as all these posts that have been Gayle's all refer to the OP which is Gayle...:confused: :confused:

[gayle]

I will say it again Claribella, I do not do LJ. And, Lj has no part in dicussions here.

I WILL do my best to get this thread righted to it's origin.

Other than that, I am sorry, that you can't see my point (it's a valid one).

[claribella]

I will say it again Claribella, I do not do LJ. And, Lj has no part in dicussions here.

I WILL do my best to get this thread righted to it's origin.

Other than that, I am sorry, that you can't see my point (it's a valid one).


Gayle, you are right..I just can't follow your postings at ALL here as they are contradicting each other. I referred to LJ because YOU referred to the Thread HERE IN PETS FORUM about an LJ thread...that is why I referred to the LJ thread. I never said you did or did not use LJ and I saw you post that the first time....you don't have to repeat it.

As for your point..never said it was or wasn't a valid one. I just hold a different view on it.

I don't know who I'm posting too because your posts are so confusing...

[ejs]

What is going on with this thread? Is it supposed to be part of the thread on biting? Or is it not because Gayle said she deleted the original thread? How does that happen? And hasn't it happened before? I'm confused.

[Katy]

Sorry guys, as a mod the EDIT and the QUOTE buttons are right next to each other. Every once and a while you (general "mod" you) accidently hit the wrong button. Sometimes you catch it before you hit send, and sometimes you don't.

So Gayle wound up accidently deleting the original OP in both name and in post. Sadly, to the best of my knowledge, and I did some poking around. Once you've changed it, you can't go back to the original.

Sorry for any confusion this may have caused. It happens some time :o

[Witty Username]

Sorry guys, as a mod the EDIT and the QUOTE buttons are right next to each other. Every once and a while you (general "mod" you) accidently hit the wrong button. Sometimes you catch it before you hit send, and sometimes you don't.

So Gayle wound up accidently deleting the original OP in both name and in post. Sadly, to the best of my knowledge, and I did some poking around. Once you've changed it, you can't go back to the original.

Sorry for any confusion this may have caused. It happens some time :o

Well, now I'm even more confused because I've yet to see Gayle actually use the QUOTE function. So how she is confusing "quote" with "edit" is beyond me.

The other thread is not gone, nor is the OP in the other thread. The only thing that is gone is Gayle's OP, since she 'accidently' started a new thread instead of replying to the existing thread. Maybe I am still confused. :confused: Or maybe this thread is best viewed late at night after a bottle or two of wine instead of first thing in the morning after too much coffee.

On topic - I don't understand this statement you made Gayle.
Actually, bad temperament is the ONLY reason to put a dog down...


The ONLY reason?? Seriously? What about a dog that is in constant pain? Are you saying it is not okay to put a dog down that is suffering with no hope of relief but it is okay to put them down if they are BAD?

Is it too early to start drinking? ;)

[mrs_pell]

Yikes...this got even more weird after I went to bed last night.

[claribella]

Hmm...well yeah..hmmm...accident? Hmmm...hasn't it happened before? Oh and Is it too early to start drinking? ;)


When it comes to "accident" threads like this...its NEVER to early! :p

[gayle]

Of course there are other sound reasons to put a dog down. I didn't phrase that right. Constant pain is certainly one.

I meant that if someone just wanted to get rid of a dog, of course putting it down is no solution. Chronic biting is a reason, and a valid one.

And Mrs. Pell, this did get weird, and it is my fault, as katy explained, I screwed up and hit the wrong control buttons and did not realize it until this had fully taken off. For that I truly apologize to all of you.

Katy will be closing this thread so it doesn't cause any more confusion.

[gayle]

Yes it has happened before, by a couple mods.

It was an accident, my OP was intended to be part of the original thread about putting a dog down.

Either way, it seems best if Katy closes this one, and I go reply to the other one, lest this thread cause even more confusion than it already has.

[jesvet]

Closed by request of op.