crying

[emschwar]

We've got some obnoxious behaviour from the (almost) 3.5 year old, and I really want to get it to stop.

Whenever Noah doesn't get his way, he cries. Not fake crying, he actually produces tears. Minor things we can usually get him to stop, but if he's really mad/upset/whatever, he's totally hysterical and insists he can't stop crying. Last night, he was crying for probably 15 minutes because we told him he had to drink milk with dinner.

I'm sick of this. It's been going on for months (so it's not baby related). Anyone dealt with this and found a successful method of getting it to stop?

Thanks!

[JenniferEC]

Anyone dealt with this and found a successful method of getting it to stop?
We are dealing with this now, and I wish I knew how to stop it. DS had a full-blown crying fit this morning because the Fisher Price catalog got left at grandma's. He did it the other night because the pair of pj's he wanted to wear was dirty. DH and I decided that we're just going to let him cry it out. DS isn't ready to believe that the world won't come to an end if he can't wear Cars pj's, so he's going to have to cry it out. I wish there was something else to do, but I haven't figured it out.

[FoxyBlue]

I don't have a kid (yet), but I had 3 brothers and sisters and have been around a LOT of kids at church.

Ignoring the behavior is usually the first step. Frankly, this before is unacceptable. Kids need to be told it's unacceptable or "not ok." My family always gave an explanation to us.

However, this usually doesn't solve anything (kids are persistent!). It has to be followed up with reinforcement.

I don't know your theories on punishment, but in our family if you continued to cry hysterically and it was determined that there was not a legitimate reason, we got punished.

Whether it merits a time out or worse, it should be punished. Crying inappropriately is not a productive, healthy, or socially acceptable behavior.

[pixielou]

dd (3 in a few days) tries to pull crap like this at times. we ignore her for about 30 seconds. then she is told that she has to the count of 10 to stop crying or else she is going straight to bed. at 10 - she is brought to her room, placed on her bed, and she is not allowed to get off her bed until she stops crying. she then has to ask in a nice girl voice for permission to leave her room. and she has to clean all the tears off her face before she leaves her room.

when she started doing this, i think she was getting sent to her room daily. now it happens maybe once every 2 weeks - usually when she is overtired.

dh and i are pretty hardcore when it comes ot discipline. we don't let dd "argue" with us, or try to use her own logic. when i tell her to sit at the table to eat, i'm not going to let her tell me that the living room coffee table is a table. and if i give her a choice at lunch - apple or pear - she knows she has about 5 seconds to make her choice or else mom is going to choose for her. and if she's going to cry about it, well up to her room she goes.

~pixie

[dana b]

my dd will cry hysterically over the craziest stuff lately. she knows that if she cries like that she has to go to her playroom. she can go in there to play, i don't care, she just has to go there until she's done. most of the time she'll stop crying half way there. sometimes she wants a "big hug" and of course i'll give her a hug, she'll stop after that as well.

[Delta]

Ignore.

I think punishing them for crying like that (time out, straight to bed, etc.) is a little over the top and somewhat mean. It's OK to cry even if it's for something you think may be silly or stupid. Now, it should not be rewarded, obviously.

I find that most of the time when my child does this is because he's overtired or hungry.

[Adam's Pi]

When Colin does this we either send him to his room to calm down or if he's in time out when he starts it, I remind him that his time in time out doesn't start until he calms down.

We've also been discussing lately how it's ok to be sad and cry but not ok to whine. When he starts in on the whining we tell him he's whining and remind him to stop.

I agree, punishing isn't the answer, but trying to help him calm down seems to work for us. He can't handle his emotions sometimes, ya know. Now, with D around, you may have a harder time since he sees you responding to....D's crying. N is smart though, I'll bet if you talk to him about D being a baby and can't talk to let you know, etc. that might help.

[prudies]

If it goes on longer than a couple of minutes, I will usually say he should go to his room to calm down. It sort of depends on the nature of the freak out. If it's a tantrum thing, I sound more punitive. If he just needs to calm down, I might pick him up and place him in his room and tell him to take some time to himself or something.

My overall thing is it's okay to cry, or even tantrum, in your own room. That's your space to lose it. But in the rest of the house, you need to use your words.

[cynder]

We do a combination of ignore, give him a choice (depending on what the situation is) and then if the crying is spiraling out of control, we sit him in the "cool down" pillow in our empty dining room until he is ready to use words and behave. I usually say "It's too bad my mommy can't help DS when he's crying like this. Once he's calm and takes deep breaths, I can help". After a 2 minutes, he's contrite and normal and comes for a hug. Mind you, we got to this point only after some doozy crying tantrums where I had to sit and read something and let him work it out that I meant business. Judging on the episode though, I sometimes let him sit on my lap and just hold him tight while he works it out.

After any crying episode, I make sure he takes deep breaths to calm down and give him tons of hugs. At his eye level, I talk about why I was sad but then focus on the positive -"I am so glad you decided to calm down and do X". Mostly for us, we just try to give DS choices to avoid any situation. And I mean choice for EVERYTHING. Which bowl do you want, what shirt do you want, do you want water or milk. Finding choices that you can live with is hard but worth it! Giving DS the power to make his own choice makes him feel like he's in control versus asserting his demands over us and has cut our tantrums to maybe one a week. The ones that we get are mostly from no nap days. When he's having a crying fit or tantrum, we try to do empathetic consequences "it's too bad you can't listen, so no this toy will have to be put away for now. It too sad that you can't stop crying, because I wanted to play with you outside. etc"

I don't ascribe to any particular theory but I have learned a lot of "tricks" from Positive Discipline books (Jane Nelson and Barbara Colosco are awesome) and a little from Love Logic (I pick and choose from there because I don't buy all of it). Hope it helps.

[FoxyBlue]

Delta We didn't get punished for crying over a REAL issue.

Crying out of hunger, frustration, etc needs to be REDIRECTED, not punished. Children do need to learn appropriate communication.

Crying to get your way, however, is different. If you know your child, you know it when you hear it.

Anyways, it kept us from being whiny brats. I only wish more parents did it. I've babysat kids who were holy terrors- upsetting other kids and being needlessly inconsolable. It's a disservice to everyone, kid included.

Oh, and 'punish' is relative. I didn't say beat them. But being sent to their room alone is punishment to a kid that age. And yes, sometimes it is called for.

[emschwar]

Thanks for the opinions.

I don't think it's related to being tired or hungry, because if it is, then Noah is tired and hungry all the time.

I'm also not sure if I can really ignore it. First, it's driving me up the wall. Second, he's loud enough that he's waking up his brother. (Today, we were driving back from the library, and Noah started wailing because I wouldn't let him peel the library labels off the library books. And his previously sleeping brother got woken up because of the crying.)

We use 1-2-3 Magic for discipline, and it's been working well for us, except not so much for this issue (since the arrival of 3 and the consequence frequently leads to the crying, or more crying). I like the idea of sending him to his room to calm down, except that right now I'm not always in a position to get him into his room (it frequently involves my carrying him up there), and it doesn't really help if we're out of the house when he starts up. At least I've got some new ideas to think about. :)

[KiKi'sMommy]

Our DD (who will be 3 in February) started doing this too. We have a new baby in the house too, so I can completely understand the frustration. I don't mind the crying over things that are upsetting, but she seriously cries over the most insane things. She gets mad at me and screams because I gave her the wrong sippy cup or I didn't do something the way she thought it should be done. The other day, she threw herself in the floor and screamed (with real tears) because I gave her a sippy cup after she spilled gatorade all over the floor with the other cup. This went on for about 5 minutes and we just ignored her. She finally quit and came over to me for hugs, so we cuddled for a little while and she was fine. I KNOW how hard it is to ignore, but that and sending her to her room to calm down is the only thing that works. Crying over real emotions (such as sadness, disappointment, etc.) should not be ignored, but crying for manipulation and attention should result in some sort of discipline. I do not like the word "punishment" because I think it has very negative connotations. I do believe in disciplining my children, because if they lack discipline later in life, it will lead to much greater consequences.

[Delta]

Ah, yes. Those without children are always the experts. ;)

[cynder]

Hang in there emschwar! I have no idea how to juggle two children so I am so out of my realm there though I better learn fast :) I'll be honest - I have no idea what I would do in your car situation (I know DS is so going to do this when DC#2 comes along).

[catmom]

Just wondering- from what you're describing, is his "crying" really more like a tantrum? Maybe I am misreading, but that's what it is sounding like to me.

[pixielou]

Delta clearly you and i have different child rearing philosophies. yes it is ok for our children to have feelings, and cry when they are upset. but (to use emschwar's example) 15 minutes of crying when you are asked to drink your milk - to me that is point blank unacceptable behavior. i really think we are doing our children a disservice to let them grow up thinking this is appropriate behavior.

yes, foxyblue may not have children. but i agree with her 100%. as evidenced by the number of ill behaved children in this world, clearly not all parents are experts at parenting either.

~pixie

[emschwar]

Just wondering- from what you're describing, is his "crying" really more like a tantrum? Maybe I am misreading, but that's what it is sounding like to me.

I think emotionally, it's a tantrum, but physically, he's crying. Sounds about the same as if he'd just fallen and skinned his knee. Tears and all. But emotionally, he's doing it because he doesn't get his way or because I've told him something he doesn't like.

[Delta]

but (to use emschwar's example) 15 minutes of crying when you are asked to drink your milk - to me that is point blank unacceptable behavior. i really think we are doing our children a disservice to let them grow up thinking this is appropriate behavior.


I don't think it is appropriate behavior and I never reward it by giving in or giving positive attention, but I absolutely think that giving a child a punitive time out for it (sending them to another room in the house can be appropriate) or sending them to bed and making them wipe their tears off before coming out is very, very harsh.

yes, foxyblue may not have children. but i agree with her 100%. as evidenced by the number of ill behaved children in this world, clearly not all parents are experts at parenting either.
I admit that I automatically repel from childrearing advice that includes words such as 'pulled that crap', 'whiny brat', or 'when I babysat.'

[MrsBeckyLP]

Ah, yes. Those without children are always the experts. ;)

I agree with pixielou and FoxyBlue, and Delta, your comment was completely unnecessary. I'm not yet a parent (so I guess my suggestion can't count either), but I feel this type of behavior warrants discipline. I don't feel that ignoring it is the ticket, because emschwar seems to be about at the end of her rope.

[Delta]

I suppose it can count, it just usually gets an eyeroll from me.

[NicoleWisconsin]

No suggestions, just commiseration. Up until about a week ago, I was thinking how lucky we are because we didn't have any problems like the rest of the moms in the "Is 3 worse than 2?" thread... Got my wake up call.

[Delta]

You know what, MrsBeckyLP? That was really rude of me. I apologize for that snarky comment. You didn't deserve it. What I was really worked up about were the disrespectful words being thrown about regarding kids.

[bluebunny]

emschwar, congrats on your new son!

I feel your pain with this issue. My DS has started in with the crying lately, too. Sometimes it is because he is hungry or tired but a lot of times it is because he doesn't want to obey, like in your library book label example. I usually ignore the behavior if I can. I've found that distraction sometimes works. I've also said something like cynder suggested:
"It's too bad my mommy can't help DS when he's crying like this. Once he's calm and takes deep breaths, I can help".