Paper or plastic?

[LittleFredPunkinHead]

Which one is better? I was at a grocery store, they asked me, and I realized, I have no idea which is better. Is one environmentally better than the other? I guess that ideally I'd be carrying reusable shopping bags of my own, but if I have to choose between the two, which is better?

[Ericka_Jarett]

I get plastic, I use the bags for trash cans in the house, sending DH's lunch to work in one, use them for trash when we have a picnic at the park. Paper is offered as well, but honestly I would never use paper for anything but book covers and since my kids aren't in school, no need for book covers right now. I couldn't see getting the enviro bags, I would need too many of them and to remember to take them out to the car on shopping day, I would forget them for sure. I never remember to take my Aldi bag with me when I go to Aldi

[KK812]

I guess the argument is that paper is the lesser of two evils because trees are a renewable resource, while plastic requires the use of petroleum. I, like Erika_Jarrett, usually get plastic because I use them as garbage can liners. If I got paper, I'd end up getting rid of them instead of reusing them.

I have 6 or 8 cloth sacks I usually use, though. I only get plastic once every couple months to stock up for my garbage cans. I like the cloth sacks better anyway because they hold more and I can sling them over my shoulders since I live on the top floor of my apartment building.

[chortles]

KK812 - you're absolutely right about the paper bags use recycled paper vs. petroleum product bags.

Buy cloth bags. The fabulous snowzilla did a blogpost on them. (http://www.constantchatter.com/2007/07/31/put-a-bag-over-it/302) that contains URLs of some places to buy.

I never get plastic, unless I'm at a place that has to give them (i.e., a drugstore that doesn't carry paper). In many places where I live, they've banned plastic shopping bags, so you can't get them even if you want them. I put all my paper recycling (magazines, toilet paper / paper towel rolls, boxes, junk mail) in the paper bags to recycle them.

Re-usable are so much easier. I stash them in my trunk, and some of the small folding ones I can carry in my purse.

[Niobe]

If I have the choice (and don't have my reusable bags with me), I get paper. Like chortles, I use them for collecting paper recycling. If I end up with plastic, I use them for trash can liners, but I try to avoid these as much as possible.

[kugrrly]

Well I live on the third floor of an apartment building with stairs. It is much easier for me to use plastic since I can throw them on my arms. I use these bags as trash bags and in to my lunch in.

[tenofcups]

Dh insists on getting paper for the reasons others have listed. BUT now that we have 2 cats again, I think I'm going to insist that we get at least half plastic ones. I'm constantly using plastic bags to dispose of litter and I've been using the ones that we buy for our kitchen trash can to do it. I'd rather get the plastic at the supermarket and reuse them than essentially throw out the paper ones we are getting, but have to buy plastic for other purposes.

ETA: He always takes his own mesh bag when he goes to the farmer's market so he doesn't need any bags at all from there.

[Scooter]

I guess that ideally I'd be carrying reusable shopping bags of my own, but if I have to choose between the two, which is better?

Just thought I'd point out that I've seen people reusing plastic bags before. So if you just haven't invested in cloth ones yet and have plastic lying around, you still have that third choice. Bring the plastics that don't have holes back to the store and reuse them until they fall apart. :)

[Mrs. M.]

Environmentally, I think paper is better.

I bring my own cloth bags.

[Ericka_Jarett]

Our grocery store use to give .02 for each bag (paper or plastic) you brought in to reuse. I never brought any in since we used them for trash and other things. I only toss out the ones that get holes, had meats in them from the store or cold/wet stuff, otherwise we reuse the same plastic bag until it gets holes.

[bethnjim]

Use cloth bags...they are the BEST!! Honestly, I couldn't believe how much stuff fits in them and they are MUCH easier to carry!!:D:D

I got mine from Trader Joe's!!

[LIZNKEITH]

I converted to Whole Foods reuseable bags about 6 months ago and LOVE them. I only paid $1.99 each for them and bought 3. I find they are large enough to fit our entire week of groceries in. Great for the environment and as an extra added bonus, I've never had groceries spill out in to my trunk.

I still have my meats bagged in plastic though so they don't leak all over the place. I usually only walk out with one plastic bag that gets dropped into the recycling bin at the grocery store when I'm there next.

[meganth]

Diane Rehm just did a show on this subject yesterday (http://wamu.org/programs/dr/07/08/13.php#13297).

[kindermom]

Our local Whole Foods says their plastic is better but I forget why. I have to beg for paper ones as I like to reuse them as lunch sacks.

[Standrea]

I bought reuseable bags at our grocery store. Like Liznkeith said, it fits so much more stuff in them. We get .05 per bag that we bring in. I have four, but usually only fill 2-3.

[salysaturn]

We have the canvas bags. Sometimes we get plastic for greeting cards, magazines...but for the most part, the canvas ones.

[Happy1]

I would think the paper would be. We reuse the paper bags for the kitchen garbage can and then our local church will take any extra paper bags because they give them to the school to use as book covers, art projects, ect.. If you think about it, a paper bag will break down easier in a landfill than plastic and an animal can't get entangled in it like they can in the handle of a plastic bag (or if the plastic bag gets shredded somehow).

Nikki :D

[mkredhead]

Like the others have said, paper is the "friendlier" choice. However, I get plastic and use them as pet walking bags. They're the perfect size and are easy to carry and dispose of when finished.

[Lauren23]

Yup, paper is technically better. But good luck finding a grocery store around here that actually has paper bags available. We bought canvas bags as well. They were .99 cents each ($2 for the freezer bag) and they're GREAT. They hold so much stuff. DH scoffed at me at first but now he loves them. The only hard part is remembering to bring them to the store.

[LittleFredPunkinHead]

I'll definitely listen to the Diane Rehm show when I get home tonight.

Does it make any difference if you recycle the plastic bags? There are a few groceries near my house that have recycling bins specifically for plastic bags.

We generally use the plastic bags we do end up accumulating for scooping our kitty litter- but maybe there's a more environmentally friendly way to deal with that as well...?

[paiger]

Our work weekly email had an article about plastic bags once, but I can't find it in the archives. It was scary, though.

As much as it helps to recycle or reuse them, it doesn't really counter all of the people/companies that don't do that. Not to mention the amount of energy it actually takes to produce and recycle the bags. You can google it and find some bad facts about all the plastic bags in the ocean and landfills right now. This is an example article, but the one they sent out at work was much better and more scientific.

http://news.nationalgeographic.com/kids/2004/04/pasticbags.html

Obviously, best case scenario is that everyone would use cloth bags and decrease the amount of plastic bags being produced, but I think everyone just has to do what they can to help so if you have to use them (which we do some as well) definitely recycle or reuse them.

[lovebugs2003]

I am never offered paper bags, always plastic or reusable. I have bought 3 of the reusables and constantly forget them, i will have to work on that. But i do like the plastic because i, like other posters, use them for lunch, garbage liners and dog poop pickup.

I don't even recall my grocery store having paper. I am going to have to look next time.

[snapdragon]

For those of you that use cloth bags do you still buy garbage bags for your trash? We use the plastic grocery bags as our garbage bags. Are the plastic garbage bags sold in stores more environmentally friendly than the plastic grocery bags? I just assumed they were made the same way.

[Hello Kitty]

I use cloth bags, but through recycling, composting, and food disposal-ing I create a very small amount of trash each week. That fits into a grocery store sized plastic bag - I don't use bags as liners, rather I dump the trash from each trashcan into the bag and cat litter goes on top. I still have a ton left, but I keep getting them from people bringing things in them, or forgetting at the grocery, DH going to the store, etc... I know it's not perfect, but it's better than getting plastic bags all the time. I do believe that buying them in the store is roughly the same as using what they offer in the store.

I know there are biodegradable bags made from corn - and while they may not compost perfectly in a landfill, I believe they're gentler for the environment to produce (and I think use less fossil fuels).

Reusablebags.com has a pretty neat Q&A section (http://www.reusablebags.com/facts.php).

[villanelle75]

The reusable bags at both of my local stores are only $.50 each. You don't need nearly as many as you might think. I'd estimate that I use half or even 2/3 as many reusable bags as I would plastic or paper. They hold so much more!

Of course, I am still struggling with remembering to bring my bags into the store. I am mostly trained now to put them back in the car after I unload them, but still more often than not, I leave them in the car and don't remember them until after I've checked out.

[KrissyCat7]

We get plastic and reuse them for different things around the house.

[snowzilla]

I'll definitely listen to the Diane Rehm show when I get home tonight.

Does it make any difference if you recycle the plastic bags? There are a few groceries near my house that have recycling bins specifically for plastic bags.

We generally use the plastic bags we do end up accumulating for scooping our kitty litter- but maybe there's a more environmentally friendly way to deal with that as well...?

A good comprehensive explanation on recycling plastic bags can be found here (http://www.reusablebags.com/facts.php?id=5).

[lil_geek]

Believe it or not... we don't have a single store in our area that has paper bags! That would be my first. But a lot of our stores have resorted to charging for plastic ($0.05). And one of our main chains has cardboard boxes out to pack your groceries in (leftovers from unpacking the groceries) so we tend to use those.


That said, plastic get's used for trash, lunches etc. when we have them anyways.

[Ilovemygeek]

We are only offered plastic where we shop and we reuse the bags around the house (lunches, trash bags, etc.).

[May27JnJ]

We get plastic and reuse them for different things around the house.

Ditto. Lots of places around here have bins for recycling plastic bags too.

[LittleFredPunkinHead]

A good comprehensive explanation on recycling plastic bags can be found here (http://www.reusablebags.com/facts.php?id=5).
Geep! That's scary! Thanks- good to know!

[SiValleySteph]

I'm really surprised that people can reuse ALL the plastic bags you accumulate shopping. That seems amazing to me!

We use 2 bags per week for trash. One trip to the grocery store can generate 5-6 bags! Not to mention any stops at Target or the drug store. Even with reusing, plastic bags were adding up like crazy!

I've been using cloth bags for about a year and it is really easy. After I empty them in the kitchen, I throw the bags in the path out to the car. That way, I remember them on my next trip out to the car. Then I always have them ready to go!

I do like to use paper bags for my recycling. We use 1/week for that.

[chortles]

we use the biodegradable plastic bags for the kitchen - in general they're great - the only thing you need to be aware of is not to let damp things (e.g., coffee grounds) sit in them for a long period of time (a week). that can weaken the bag.

We do use the grocery plastic bags for bathroom trashbags.

[salysaturn]

SiValleySteph- That's exactly why we bought our canvas bags. We would easily get like 6-8 plastic bags a pop, plus Target...and so on. We only had 2 small trash cans, and honestly, they took froever to be filled! We bought 4 blue canvas bags, and we got 2 canvas as a "thank you" at the store we used to shop at(before we moved). We use 3...4 at the most, it's great. We want to buy more, just to store in the cars, cause we forget so often :(

[jenjunum]

I used reusable bags from Trader Joes and Whole Foods. My Ralphs even sells them now but they appear to not have the same long handles as WF & TJs. They really are so much easier to carry things in. I can carry 2 gallons of milk in one bag over my shoulder and carry it up to my 3rd floor apartment without dying (and carrying other stuff).

I accumulate enough plastic from other sources, CVS, Target, etc for the minimal uses I have for it.

I've heard horror stories about bag recycling. I've hear that grocery stores dump the plastic bags out of the plastic bag recycling bin into the trash because it's easier. I've also heard that paper bags (and paper in general) gets shipped on a barge to China to be recycled and then shipped bag--probably not very energy-efficient.

I was happy to see that Ikea has started charging for plastic bags. I think 20 cents/bag. Ralphs gives me 5 cents for each bag I bring in.

My husband takes his lunch in a soft-sided cooler. I take my lunch in small paper handled shopping bags. I'm currently using a Starbucks bag that I got around Christmas (I only know because it's a Christmas-themed bag). I just use it until it starts falling apart. Lots of stores use that small sized bag--I currently have a Bluefly bag and a PF Changs takeout bag waiting for rotation.

I've always thought someone should make a diaper genie for cat litter. I think it would take up a lot less plastic than one bag per scoop. I used to scoop into a paper bag though. I would dump my bathroom trash in the bag, scoop the cat litter, then scoop the bunny litter, then dump it.

[Rico'sAlice]

I am terrible at remembering things. However, I have accumulated almost a dozen tote bags from different sources- I only bought two of them. Even when the shopping cart is extra full I still never need more than four since they can hold so much. So that gives me three trips to remember to put the bags back into the car.

[Niobe]

For those of you that use cloth bags do you still buy garbage bags for your trash? We use the plastic grocery bags as our garbage bags. Are the plastic garbage bags sold in stores more environmentally friendly than the plastic grocery bags? I just assumed they were made the same way.

We end up with some plastic bags from unanticipated trips (I need one of those bags that folds up tiny into a pouch for my purse) and use those. When we're out of plastic grocery bags, we just don't line the small cans. We empty them into the large kitchen can frequently and rinse them out.

[snowzilla]

I'm really surprised that people can reuse ALL the plastic bags you accumulate shopping. That seems amazing to me!

We use 2 bags per week for trash. One trip to the grocery store can generate 5-6 bags! Not to mention any stops at Target or the drug store. Even with reusing, plastic bags were adding up like crazy!


Exactly. And it was driving me crazy how the cashiers were bagging my groceries - one or two items in a half-empty bag, so I'd end up with twenty bags at the end of a grocery order! With a family of five and a weekly grocery trip, it was ridiculous.

Even now, with the reusable bags, I still have to reassure them every single time - load them up. They're far sturdier than plastic bags. They can be packed full. Yes, they're heavier - I'm ok with carrying heavier bags.

[JamBray]

For the most part I use my TJ canvas bags, or my Chico Bags (http://www.chicobag.com) which I love. If I do happen to forget them or they're being used for something else at the time, I'll either go for paper or nothing at all.

We generally use the plastic bags we do end up accumulating for scooping our kitty litter- but maybe there's a more environmentally friendly way to deal with that as well...?
Well you could always just flush the solids and then, if your litter is compostable, compost the rest and use it for flowers and plants.
For those of you that use cloth bags do you still buy garbage bags for your trash? We use the plastic grocery bags as our garbage bags. Are the plastic garbage bags sold in stores more environmentally friendly than the plastic grocery bags? I just assumed they were made the same way.
If I find myself getting a plastic bag at the store or a restaurant, I'll use them to line the trash. When I run out I use Bio Bags (http://www.biobagusa.com/) which are made from corn.

As far as the environmentally friendly part of it, are you asking if Glad Bags (for instance) are better than the grocery bags? If so, then no, they're not. They're all petroleum based.
Exactly. And it was driving me crazy how the cashiers were bagging my groceries - one or two items in a half-empty bag, so I'd end up with twenty bags at the end of a grocery order! With a family of five and a weekly grocery trip, it was ridiculous.

Even now, with the reusable bags, I still have to reassure them every single time - load them up. They're far sturdier than plastic bags. They can be packed full. Yes, they're heavier - I'm ok with carrying heavier bags.
This drives me crazy too! I can't count the number of times I've gone up to the checker with 1-2 items which they immediately go to put in a bag! I'm always having to say "I don't need a bag for that", and then thinking "I can't believe they were going to put bar of soap/toothbrush/Advil in a bag!" :rolleyes: I guess it's mostly automatic pilot for them, but still. I'd prefer to be asked if I'd like a bag for whatever it is if I don't have my own.

[Larissa]

I bring my own. They are some kind of plastic that the grocery stores in the area offer for 50 pence (about $1). They're pretty large and the grocery store replaces them when they wear out. We need about 2-3 for our weekly shopping for 2 people.

We don't get a paper vs plastic choice here. And they are looking to start charging - like Ireland does at 5 cents/bag - very soon.

I wish more people would use reusable bags.

[Kimberland30]

We get plastic more often, and I store them at home to use for other things (trash mostly). I get paper bags around the holidays and unfold them and lay them flat to use as cooling stations for breads and cookies (soaks up the oils, and so much easier than racks!!). We have a small recycle bin in our laundry room that we empty into our large one outside, so we don't need paper for storing recyclables.

Our store has a bin to recycle bags, but I don't use it. When we have a ton of bags, I just put them in our recycle bin. I haven't considered canvas/reusable bags because I know we won't use them.

[Niobe]

This drives me crazy too! I can't count the number of times I've gone up to the checker with 1-2 items which they immediately go to put in a bag! I'm always having to say "I don't need a bag for that", and then thinking "I can't believe they were going to put bar of soap/toothbrush/Advil in a bag!" :rolleyes: I guess it's mostly automatic pilot for them, but still. I'd prefer to be asked if I'd like a bag for whatever it is if I don't have my own.

I ask! I'm a sales clerk and I always ask people with one or two items if they want a bag. I can't believe how many people will want shopping bag for one tiny item when they already have a big purse or other shopping bags. :rolleyes:

I hate having to hold things in my hands when I'm out, so I just bought a really big messenger-style purse and toss as many small purchases in there as possible. Even if it's 4 or 5 things, if I can get them in my purse, I skip the disposable bag.

[jnettie]

If I find myself getting a plastic bag at the store or a restaurant, I'll use them to line the trash. When I run out I use Bio Bags (http://www.biobagusa.com/) which are made from corn.
How cool! I didn't know such a thing existed! I am going to buy these and use them from now on!

I've been thinking about all the waste and, really, it's only been like the last 20 years that things have seemed to really get out of hand. I remember when I was a little girl, and this was only in the 80s, there weren't any plastic bags at the grocery store, only the paper bags. Also, remember the glass bottles of soda? We'd always save them, put them back in their cardboard crate, and return them to the grocery store. It was recycling, but it's also just what you did. It seems like now, not only do we generate so much more trash, but it's also so much more permanent.

[Standrea]

Those garbage bags are so cool! I'm going to order some myself!

[chortles]

Those bags are great - those are the ones I use - my only caution is to be careful of putting things like coffee grounds first thing into the empty bag - they can start degrading and by the time you've filled up the trash bag, you lift it out and the bottom of the bag can be weakened. Very minor, once you're aware of it.

In our (California) town, they've almost banned styrofoam as well - most takeout comes in paperboard boxes.

[jennylou]

I've always thought someone should make a diaper genie for cat litter. I think it would take up a lot less plastic than one bag per scoop. I used to scoop into a paper bag though. I would dump my bathroom trash in the bag, scoop the cat litter, then scoop the bunny litter, then dump it.

You could just get one. My sister uses one, they bought their house and the old owners had left it. It keeps the smell in and works like a dream for them. :)




I re-use plastic bags that I get at the store. But, I will say that I have a very large drawer full and can't use them as quick as I get them. I keep meaning to sew some cloth (I even have the fabric) but haven't gotten around to it. Soon. :)

[Niobe]

In our (California) town, they've almost banned styrofoam as well - most takeout comes in paperboard boxes.

Which I'm thrilled about, except that soup containers are now made of that starch stuff and your soup thickens if you wait too long to eat it. The paperboard works pretty well for regular foods though.

I haven't tried the garbage bags yet. I'll have to look into those.

[maniach]

I actually just read an article on this. It said that the plastic bags obviously take longer to biodegrade and are worse for the environment post-production, but paper bags take WAY more energy to create and are worse pre-production. I believe the result was actually that plastic bags are better. Although they DID say that using reusable bags is best.

[1MegMeg]

Between conferences, professional meetings, and my industry in general I get a lot of swag. :p Swag in the form of canvas tote bags. I have found that these work great for reuseable grocery bags. I leave them in my car all the time. Every once in a great while I forgot them and I get plastic bags to use as garbage bags at home.

[Niner]

As much recycling as we do, it's sad to say that I hadn't given much thought to the "paper or plastic" question and always just went with plastic because they were easier to carry. Then I was visiting my sister about a year ago and we hit the grocery store and when asked I said "plastic." You should have seen the look of horror on her face! "Oh no, we use paper." Then I looked into it to find all of the scary plastic bag info. So we only use paper now. After reading this thread, I'll be buying bio bags for the bathroom trashcan and will stop at Whole Foods to get the reusable canvas bags. I actually saw one for the first time a couple of days ago (we don't shop at WF) and was amazed at how big the bag and handles were.

Can anyone suggest something more environmentally friendly than the little sandwich/ziplock bags? For those of you looking for lunch bag ideas and don't want to carry a bulky cooler, I've found paper bags with handles (that I've gotten at JCrew when buying something small or deli's sometimes give them out) and can reuse one bag for months and months on end.

[snowzilla]

Can anyone suggest something more environmentally friendly than the little sandwich/ziplock bags? For those of you looking for lunch bag ideas and don't want to carry a bulky cooler, I've found paper bags with handles (that I've gotten at JCrew when buying something small or deli's sometimes give them out) and can reuse one bag for months and months on end.

You betcha. Wrap-n-mats (http://www.reusablebags.com/store/wrapnmat-set-of-3-p-137.html?osCsid=63fde43a784c32aaca0123d2cced2e39)w ipe clean, and you can use them over and over and over again.

[salysaturn]

We just bought more bags. We had 4 blue (leaving in DH's car), we bough 4 green (for my car). We bought 2 for my mommy cause she always walks to work. Also, we have 2 random brown ones that we use for other things.

[phoenics]

I finally bought a ton of Trader Joe's reusable bags and I take them EVERYWHERE! I feel so helpful to the environment.

Now if only I could stop driving everywhere. Eh - baby steps. Ya'll don't know how hard it was to overcome my fears of taking the Trader Joes' bag into Target... but I did it. I took one, in hopes of not buying much, but the SALES! But that salesgirl managed to stuff that one bag full. Awesome.

[TOMama]

I'm really trying to do my part, so when I went to Whole Foods and forgot my reusable bags, I asked for paper. I didn't realize it until I got to the car, but they gave me paper bags stuffed inside plastic bags :confused:.

Maybe the bagger person was new? Also, he accidentally gave me about 30 extra plastic bags (sigh).

[Niner]

Thanks Snowzilla!

[meganth]

I was so excited because when i was at Ace Hardware they had a bin of reusable bags from 1 Bag at a Time. (http://www.1bagatatime.com) The checkout lady said they've been selling super fast. I picked up a couple for $2.49/pc.

I'm a little annoyed though because on the tag it's got their message about why not to use plastic, yet the tag was good to the big with a nice plastic ring. I'm about to email them as to why they don't use hemp or string to attach the tag because i'm so curious!

[Foley42]

When take your reusable bags to the grocery store, does the bagger look at you like you're crazy (or do you bag your own groceries)? What do you do about meat or items that crush? I'm new at this, but I'm really interested in getting some reusable bags.

[Hello Kitty]

The baggers at the local store used to look at me like I was crazy, but I've been using them for awhile now and they're okay with it. I think they're supposed to do the bagging, so that part is still kind of awkward (I'd just rather bag my own)

I don't have any qualms about putting meat in with other things, but then I don't buy meat that has oozy packages, either.

As far as items that are crushable (chips, fruit) - I just pack carefully like I would with regular items - I put solid things on the bottom and then top off each bag with the more fragile things. No difference to me there.

[salysaturn]

When take your reusable bags to the grocery store, does the bagger look at you like you're crazy (or do you bag your own groceries)? What do you do about meat or items that crush? I'm new at this, but I'm really interested in getting some reusable bags.

DH tries to go to registers w/o baggers and does it on his own. If there is a bagger, they have never looked at us like we were crazy, though DH raves on how much the bags hold:rolleyes:

For meat, we always use those plastic bags by the meat. We usually bag those in their own plastic bag. Same thing with bread, unless we get a lot of fragile things, then we put them all together.

[Ohana]

Inspired by this thread, I got some reusable bags last week. When I was at the store Saturday, they even gave me a credit for bringing in my own bags. At this rate, the bags will pay for themselves in just a couple of months.

[salysaturn]

Our store used to give us credit, then they stopped. I don't know why though, the more bags I use, the less they have to spend on buying paper and plastic.