Need to vent about SIL...

[Marie]

For a brief intro, my SIL and I do NOT get along. She's never accepted me as part of the family and when my husband had emergency surgery she came up here despite him asking her not to. When she landed (now realize, I've been up about 24 hours at this point waiting through the night and had almost lost my husband) she said to me, "well I had to come, he has no family here right now and you need family to get through something like this." Um, what does that make me????

So about 45 days ago I contacted her via email about doing a roast for my husband's 40th birthday at the annual camping suck fest this year (a lot of his friends will be there). It is something I had been kinda planning on doing for his 40th for about a year and since we didn't have a house (long story, in the middle of moving) I wasn't sure I was going to be able to pull it off until I thought of camping. I did it for a couple of reasons. First of all, it was far enough in advance that I didn't think he'd expect anything that weekend. Second, we will be out of town the weekends before and after his birthday. Third, I didn't want her to feel left out of his 40th birthday celebration. #3 is going to become quite ironic quite fast...

So she just sends out a mass email to all camping participants about the planned roast. According to the email the one that her and her friend planned. They've already lined up someone to MC and obviously have a plan of how it will happen. Um, this is the first I've heard of it. In fact, since she hadn't responded to me (not unusual unless it is she who wants something) I thought she didn't want to do it and had just contacted another friend about planning something.

Now, to top it off she sent the "super secret" email to my husband as well.

So now, not only has she taken credit for an idea I've had for just over a year about how I want to surprise my husband on his 40th bday, but she has planned it without consulting me in the slightest AND ruined the surprise part completely.

You only turn 40 once.

I'm so mad and hurt and upset right now. This has obviously been building for quite a while and frankly I'm tired of stepping back, biting my tongue and being the better person. So I called her on it. I wasn't mean just matter of fact. No name calling. She replied several times and since it took me a while to figure out how to block an email addy it continued for a while. Ends up with an email from her warning me to back off because I "don't want to go there with her" and out of respect for her brother she doesn't feel he needs to know anything about us disagreeing. WTF?

My husband understands that his sister can be a nutcase and incredibly mean and manipulative. Additionally she has forwarded some stuff to her little clique who will be at camping this year. My husband supports me, understands that his sister is out of line and wants to confront her. I think it would just make it worse.

I have no idea what to do or how to deal with this woman.

[ShelbyMay]

I think you should let your husband confront her. I don't know what her problem is with you, but she obviously doesn't intend to listen to what you say. At least if it comes directly from her brother then she won't be able to claim that she's doing things "for him".

[Neen]

I'd let you husband confront her. You are family!

Is there any way you guys can at the last minute not go on the camping trip?

[Marie]

They actually just sent out the annual evite for camping, requesting a response by next Friday. It is in 2 weeks and I hate camping. 50% is because my SIL acts like queen bee the entire time and just makes it miserable for me. She's so snippy to me whenever hubby is out of earshot. And this year is obviously going to be SO much worse.

Hubby suggested just going up on Saturday. I don't know. :(

[isign]

I think you have my SIL, just a few years older. I don't really have any advise, but I'm a good listner.

[Boopy]

I agree with letting your husband confront her. It is his sister and she is out of line. He needs to let her know where he and you stand on this. I don't get along with my SIL either, but thankfully my DH knows she's crazy and manipulative and has no problem calling her out on it.

[AKA Poohgirl]

I think you should have hubby talk to her about it. I think if you try and talk to her about it, it will just make her mad, or feel like you're just causing trouble. Trust me on this one. Have him talk to her, and if need be, un-invite her.

[Marie]

Well, didn't realize I needed to block her friends as well and have gotten some rather sarcastic, snippy emails from them. It is quite obvious from the contents that emails are flying between them about this.

We may not even go - it would just be too miserable. We're going to talk about it and see. If we don't go everyone is going to blame me and have the entire weekend to talk about me. If we do go...yeah.

Sounds like he will have to confront her. I just know that in the short term at least that will make it SO much worse.

:(

[GeekGirl]

I'm so sorry you have to go through this. It's really tough when family can't be glad for each other's happiness. :(

I would definitely let your DH have it out with her, if that's what he wants to do. I also think it would be a great idea if you didn't go on the camping trip - and don't worry about what other people will say about it! People always need something to talk about. Plan something special for his 40th for just the two of you, the rest of his family be damned. In fact, I would allow your DH to let his family know that the two of you won't be attending any family functions until this catty warfare against you desists, apologies are made to you, and you are made to feel welcome. It's incredible how people are willing to put up with so much BS from family simply because they are "blood relations" - when if it were anyone else on earth, you'd tell them to shove it! There comes a point where enough is enough - and this definitely sounds like it to me.

[AKA Poohgirl]

How old is this girl? Jeezus, grow up already, people drive me nuts when they play stupid games.

If you don't want to show, don't show. Plan a new party for yourselves and YOUR friends, and let her and her friends talk about you. Who cares? Screw 'em, that's what I say.

[Marie]

For the record she's 37. Didn't see that coming did ya? :p

The problem is that we are all part of a large group of friends. Quite hard to avoid her completely - or her friends who have so obviously joined her in thinking I'm evil.

The good news is that my husband is being totally and completely supportive of me. I'm not sure she's expecting that.

And we are doing something really nice. I planned a vacation to San Francisco and Napa Valley - we're huge food and wine people - so that is my main thing for him but I was trying to do something to include his friends. *sigh* I guess I can do a great party for his 50th, right?

Thank you all for listening to me vent! I needed to get this out.

[Chimichanga]

If she (and her cronies) can't accept you as DH+Marie, then they don't get to spend time with you.

My SILs did similar stuff when DH and I were engaged. They didn't want to include me in family stuff (ummm - hello?!?) and the like.

DH told them they need to accept us as a team. We're no longer DH and Chimichanga. We're DHChimichanga. We're a package deal.

They didn't get it. He stopped going over there/hanging out with them (his choice, not mine). They got the message.

They still aren't super receptive to me, but it's much better.

I know you said everyone is friends. Maybe it's time to find a new group of friends who won't talk about you behind your back.

[Marie]

Yeah, I think we will probably be limiting our exposure to these particular people in the future. They aren't ones we see all the time anyways.

Of course, I just remembered that SIL and her friend (the main two people behind this entire thing) are supposed to come with us to a concert in a month. UGH! Maybe we can univite them.

On a positive note, my husband just sent me flowers with a note saying he hoped they brightened my day. He's a sweetie. And it made me cry all over again. :o

[Irish Elf]

The answer is very simple. You and DH decide what is tolerable and what isn't. Communicate this to SIL and tell her that she can either abide by your wishes or not. If she doesn't then you will be limiting contact of any kind with her. Strss that it's her choice. And then stick to your guns.

The hardest thing tio do is stand up to friends and family and then stick with it, but it works. I have a semi-strained relationship with my ex-stepfather. We disagree on certain topics and in the past he has used topics to bait me and see how mad i will get. Nwo that I have my own house and can set my own rules, I do. The first time you make a racist/sexist/bigoted etc comment you get a warning. The second time you are asked to leave. The third time you aren't invited back. It's harsh but I am willing to live with the consequences. Once people realized how serious I was they have stopped making offensive comments in front of me. I let them know it's their choice. I can't change them or how they think, but I can control what is said in my house. Would something like this work with her?

[ysolde]

Honey, your husband is a sweetie. Your SIL is off her rocker! As for the concert, either uninvite them or don't go yourselves. Disentangle yourselves from SIL and HER group as much as possible. Your life togther, as a NEW family, will be much more enjoyable.

And a very happy birthday to your DH!!! :D

[Marie]

*update*

Well, my DH called my SIL. If anyone is interested in the ongoing drama...

So DH is a man. Men like to fix things and believe they can fix everything. So he called his sister. Now, trying to get a blow-by-blow of a conversation out of a man is like pulling teeth but here's the general gist of the entire thing:

DH: SIL, this has to stop

SIL: but it was just a mistake, I didn't mean to send the email to you. I was feeling horrible about that all day.

DH: Not talking about that. I don't care what happened yesterday. This has been going on for a long time, she's my wife and you need to deal with that and apologize and figure out a way to get along with her.

SIL: starts arguing

DH: I'm not going to argue with you. You are my sister. She is my wife. You need to figure out how to get along and extend an apology to start doing that.

He then called me to tell me to take her off my block list in case she actually decides to apologize. :rolleyes:

He does agree that the base problem is that she does not accept me as his wife and therefor has absolutely no respect for me and that her apologizing (if she does) isn't going to magically fix that but he hopes it will be a first step. So I guess we'll wait and see.

[Amaye]

Wow...this is just insane. She sounds like a brat and your DH is handling this the best way possible.

I have the exact same problem with my SIL. She feels that l "stole" her brother away from her and was usually very nasty/snippy with me. I kept on trying to be nice until the day her own mom called DH to tell him that her sister was trying to cause problems between DH and I. From that day, I was done dealing with her. We stopped talking to her and life was very good.

A couple of months later, she was very rude to DH's best friend and wife. DH had a conversation with her basically telling her that for them to have any type of relationship, she had to apologize to me and stop acting like a brat. I guess she did not want to hear it so it has been a year since we stopped speaking.

Not having to deal with her toxic personality has been the best thing ever and I am sure it will be the same for you.

Please enjoy yourselves on his birthday and don't give her and her petty friends a second thought!

[Marie]

***Update - Received an Apology***

Damn I don't know what hubby said to her but if I thought for a moment it was sincere it is really nicely written:

I’m sorry this misunderstanding has lead to hurt feelings. It was not my intention to leave you out of the planning at all, or to take credit for any ideas of yours, I promise. To be honest, there was really no planning aside from the email. I figured that after asking everyone to write something, which I thought you had wanted me to do, we would just figure it out once we got up there and were all together. And I am truly sorry the surprise was ruined. I hope you know that I want Jeff’s birthday to be as fun as possible for everyone. I hope we can put this incident aside and enjoy the celebration and kamping.

Now how the heck do you respond to that? I don't think she means it. It took her several hours to send so I'm assuming her and her friends worked on it together. And the issue isn't just the planning of the birthday party but her complete and utter lack of respect for me.

Any suggestions?

[Boopy]

If it were me, I would thank her for the apology and forgive any "misunderstandings" that happened and agree to have a good time celebrating your husband's birthday. But I wouldn't go out of my way to be nice to her or try to pursue a friendship, at least not at this point. Like you said, this probably isn't very sincere on her part and there's a much bigger issue here then just the birthday party. I would give it time and see if/how her behavior changes over the long term.

[Twylla]

Oh, this is a stinky situation! I'm so sorry.

Maybe an appropriate reply would be,

Dear SIL,

I accept your apology about DH's birthday party. I really hope that we can all enjoy the party, and celebrate my wonderful DH, your wonderful brother.

I'm upset that we don't get along better, I really wish we did. This is bigger than DH's 40th birthday pary, but I hope camping can be the first step. I love DH and we plan to be together for the rest of our lives, so you and I better get used to being around each other without any furhter "misunderstandings."

Marie.


BTW, I really wanted to also put "shove it" into the letter, but i figure you're more interested in being proactive. ;)

[nordey]

I agree with Twylla - You should accept the apology but also I think you really need to let her know that this issue is bigger than the 40th b-day, otherwise it's going to keep happening again and again.

Good luck to you!

[Irish Elf]

My MIL has done several nasty intrusive things over the years and every time she gets caught she uses the "But i was only trying to help" card. I don't buy it and I am ever watchful of her.

With your SIL I would accept the apology knowing it's just for show. I wouldn't hang out with her or do anything proactive. If y'all are in the same place, be polite but don't go out of your way to be friends.

My SIL was a little like this but we now have a great relationship. It's taken almost 5 years but we get along. With my MIL, it's still as tense as ever and she won't change.

[PG-rated]

I think that if you want your relationship with her to get any better, you have to take the apology at face value and accept that it's the best you're going to get. I would leave anything about how "this is bigger than just the birthday party" or a larger discussion of past issues out of your response. That just gives her an excuse to say that she tried but you wouldn't meet her halfway. Focus on what she said, not what she DIDN'T say. Put everything that's past in the past and move on. If she continues to treat you badly, you'll have every excuse in the world for withdrawing, but if she starts being more respectful then you have to try for the sake of your DH.

[mb1197]

I'm so sorry you are going through this. I know it is tough to *forgive* someone when you don't think they are being sincere, but in this case I would take her apology for what it is and try to enjoy your weekend celebrating your DH's 40th.

For some reason this particular situation reminds me of the old saying "Keep your friends close and your enemies closer".

[Marie]

I think I've worked out what I want to say. See, here's the thing that is bothering me about her "apology" ....

I was married to a verbally and emotionally abusive man for over 6 years. I know the signs when I see them. SIL was quite abusive in this manner towards J (her soon to be ex husband) on several occasions. Blaming the hurt party and apologizing by saying "oh you misunderstood" is a classic warning sign.

When I left I vowed that I had had my last misunderstanding apology, that I realized I was NOT crazy and did NOT make this shit up and did NOT take things too personally. If I accept her apology I'm right back there and she knows she can do it again in the future. Hell, it is giving her permission to do so. It is telling her that she did nothing wrong and it was all my fault because I overreacted. I refuse to do that.

So I explained all that to DH and he agreed that her apology wasn't meant and didn't touch on what was really going on so I didn't have to say I accepted it but I needed to reply in some manner. He agrees she's a manipulative bitch who will not only backpeddle when caught and will truly believe the lies she tells. We thought of something like this:

My feelings were very hurt when I received the email about the roast since you never responded to me it looked like you took my idea and ran with it - even going as far as to decide who would MC. That was something I had been planning for a long time and you seemed to take it over without even thinking of consulting me when I had included you originally so you wouldn't feel left out.

You and I need to get along because we have a common bond that will last for a long time to come - we both love DH. We don't have to agree but please consult with me on things involving DH. We are each important to DH in our own way and I need you to respect my role as his wife and as a part of his family.

Now, let's see to it we give DH a great birthday celebration because you only turn 40 once!

Some friends are saying I'm harboring resentment and not moving towards a peaceful relationship. I AM harboring resentment and the manipulative wench needs to realize that this is not just about the birthday thing but about her respecting me in general. DH agrees with that. If we let this slide it is going to continue or get worse. I'm not accepting her "apology" and I'm not letting her off on a "misunderstanding" - not gonna happen. Yes, I want peace but I also want to respect myself and stand up for myself and never be someone's emotional punching bag again.

[Amaye]

I really like your response. It is mature but at the same time, makes the point that you guys might never be friends but that she needs to respect you and your relationship with her brother.

I totally agree that you have to make it clear that it's not just about the party and that you can see through her "apology". If you let it go, it will definitely continue.

Good luck!

[AKA Poohgirl]

I’m going to go against the grain here, and please don’t flame me for it. I’m going through an incredibly similar situation, except I’m the "evil" SIL in this one. Well, except I’m not evil….or I’m not trying to be. I’ve done everything possible to get along with my SIL, and I certainly don’t create any problems like the ones described here, but for some reason, my SIL insists that I’m playing favorites with their kids, and doing things to cause trouble. And I’m not.

My brother and SIL have two kids, one is his, and the other is hers from a previous marriage. When she first came into the picture, only the first baby was around. We all doted on her, and played with her, love the little girl, no hesitation just because she’s not my bro’s. Well, then my nephew came into the picture. He’s the new baby, and he’s absolutely adorable. So, now he’s getting all of the attention. All of a sudden, my SIL is accusing everyone of playing favorites. It started with my mom, and my bro stopped talking to her for 7 months. I worked hard on getting them to mend their differences, talking to my mom, and convincing her that they wanted equal treatment of the two children, and she needed to respect that, regardless if my niece was my bro’s biological child or not. Finally, that feud came to an end, and we thought everything was worked out, except not 1 month later, she started claiming I was doing the same. We hashed it out, I spoke to my brother, we cried, I spoke to her, we cried, I tried to make her see that I was not playing favorites, there was just no way! I love the little girl to death, as if she were my real niece, I see no difference between them, except that my nephew was the new baby, and he was the one everyone wanted to cuddle with.

Well, she accepted my apology as such, but I think she didn’t truly believe me. After that, I felt like my every move was scrutinized, to the point that if I spent a mere $5 more on my nephew for Christmas, it was pointed out. If I played with him 10 minutes more than her, it was pointed out. It was exhausting to constantly be watching what I said or did, for fear of upsetting her. It all came to a head a few months back, when my brother and his wife decided they wanted nothing to do with me. And a huge family feud has ensued, involving parents. It’s ugly. My heart is broken, and I honestly don’t think I did anything wrong.

The point I’m trying to make is, if she’s apologized, take it for what it’s worth, an apology. Don’t go looking for what she didn’t say, or scrutinizing her every move. If she does turn out to be manipulative, nobody can blame you for not trying. If she’s sincere, than you’ve managed to avoid an ugly situation like the one I’m in. Be upfront about your feelings, but don’t go looking into her every move. Make an effort, because regardless, she’s still your hubby’s sister, and he’ll be trapped in the middle, and I don’t think that will be a comfortable place for him either.

Just another point of view. Don’t hate me!!!!

BTW, I think your response to her email is perfect. Sorry for the book. :D I hope you guys can work through this.

[Marie]

Just another point of view. Don’t hate me!!!!

BTW, I think your response to her email is perfect. Sorry for the book. :D I hope you guys can work through this.

Don't hate you at all! Honest. If this was the first instance of something like this I wouldn't have jumped to conclusions and wouldn't have thought anything about it. I would have assumed it was an honest mistake.

However, my SIL has a LONG history of doing this sort of thing to anyone she doesn't like. She has told lies to her parents about her Uncle's side of the family and now she and her parents are not speaking to any of them and won't listen to my DH when he tries to tell their parents the truth. This is to the point where her parents won't let the cousins up to see their grandmother who is really not doing very well and they've changed their will --- all because of her lies and manipulation.

Without the history it was a simple mistake. With the history I think we need to let her know that we're not putting up with it before she talks to her parents about me in a similar way. She's already turned a few friends against me and I really don't want to let it go any further. She has flat out told me I'm not family.

Does that make sense?

[AKA Poohgirl]

Oh, you never said she said that! That's just plain rude!

It makes a ton of sense. Stand your ground. If she loves her brother she'll try. If she doesn't care, then no one can say she wasn't warned.

[PG-rated]

OK, with that new information out there, I'm going to split the difference and say that the substance of what you're saying is good, but the tone needs work. The way you have it written now, it's clear that you're still angry. While you don't have to let yourself be treated badly, you also have to get past your anger if you're going to have a productive relationship with her. I would add something to the second paragraph about how you appreciate her apology and would like to consider it a step forward in your relationship.

[Twylla]

I don't mind the e-mail. It seems to get to the point quickly, then turn light-hearted and point toward the fun of a 40th birthday part. I do understand what PGRated is saying about the tone, but I'm at a loss of what to suggest to soften it. Good luck with it!