What is going on with this forum? [Archive]

Scooter

06-24-2007, 01:25 PM

It seems like lately the majority of stories people bring to post here are horrific stories of violence to/the death of/medical problems of children and women.

Is it just me to notice this? On the first page of 20 posts, 11 of them fit this category (only 6 are political and 3 are other news stories). It's getting to the point where I don't even want to come into this forum because who knows what horrific headline is going to assault my eyes. The title about the 17 yr old rapist was one of the worst things I've ever read, although thankfully that was changed.

mrs_pell

06-24-2007, 01:35 PM

Well...I think it just kinda goes along with what you see when you go to cnn.com, foxnews.com or watch the evening news. It's not just what people are posting in here, it seems to me that it's what the majority of the headline news is these days.

It's sad...

LittleFredPunkinHead

06-24-2007, 02:09 PM

That's what the majority of headline news always is. There's a reason for the saying, "if it bleeds, it leads."

If the stories posted don't interest you, then post something that does.

mimieliza

06-24-2007, 02:16 PM

I think it's a few things... many of these headlines are posted by the same few people, so that's somewhat self-selecting. Also, I agree with the pp who said that this is what is pushed on us by CNN and Fox News. If they keep us outraged over evil criminals who hurt women and children, medical malpractice, and deadly amusement park rides, we won't notice the real atrocities that are much more pervasive and insidious than one-time incidents of crime and accidents.

A news article about woman dying on the floor of an ER causes us to blame the 911 operator or the hospital. A news article about people without health insurance, the ways they suffer, and the reasons why they are uninsured might cause us to blame and question our elected officials or corporations who employ people without providing adequate insurance. Fox News sure isn't going to let that happen!

Aimee

06-24-2007, 04:17 PM

It's the "News and Politics" forum, not the "Puppies and Sunshine" forum. If you don't like it, don't read it.

lawyerlee

06-24-2007, 04:25 PM

Feel free to start discussions on other topics. The more people who contribute, the more diverse the representation of subjects.

Sophia

06-24-2007, 04:34 PM

The reason I don't usually post political threads is because I haven't been in the mood for the debate those threads usually generate. I do keep up with politics, though.

I guess I'm more likely to post the horrific threads because I have such strong reactions to those stories and thus am more likely to share them. I actually pass on posting quite a few stories and those stories are usually posted, often days later, by someone else, so I guess those happen to be the kinds of stories that many people find compelling.

snowzilla

06-24-2007, 05:00 PM

Feel free to start discussions on other topics. The more people who contribute, the more diverse the representation of subjects.

I think this bears repeating. More participation will likely warrant a larger cross-section of stories and discussion.

am_81

06-25-2007, 07:40 AM

Well, that *is* whats news these days. I'm sure once we start getting closer to the election this forum will be about 95% politics. Like when the Iraq War started (WC days), there were dozens of threads about it. Or when Hurricane Katrina hit, this forum was full of related threads.

Asha

06-25-2007, 07:59 AM

A news article about woman dying on the floor of an ER causes us to blame the 911 operator or the hospital. A news article about people without health insurance, the ways they suffer, and the reasons why they are uninsured might cause us to blame and question our elected officials or corporations who employ people without providing adequate insurance. Fox News sure isn't going to let that happen!
well, we are too smart for them here on cc. the 911 thread actually started talking about lack of health insurance.

Scooter

06-25-2007, 11:20 AM

Well I should have been able to predict a few of the responses, LOL. I really wanted to open it up for discussion, see if anyone else had observed this trend, it's not really helpful to hear just don't come read this forum. If you don't want to discuss it, likewise, you don't need to come read this thread. I believe it's reasonable to discuss the threads and titles that are often posted.

Several of you say that this forum is just a reflection of the news headlines that are out there. But that's exactly my point--I don't think they are a real reflection of that. There are plenty of news stories right now that aren't represented on this forum--even on foxnews.com, which I just went to for the first time ever (!) to double check.

I know it's not just me who's been shocked by some of the thread titles, because several of them have had to be changed over the last month or so. Look back even a couple months ago, you'll notice there was a larger variety of topics posted here.

I find it interesting that out of all the possible stories to talk about, a forum filled with pretty well-educated, intelligent women/mothers ends up filled with stories like this. Are we drawn to this for some reason? Maybe because it is too close to home for us? Is it just one group of posters who's drawn to it?

Asha

06-25-2007, 11:31 AM

sorry i didn't reply to your original question.

well, i think a lot of the stories that get attention here on cc play into the fear that the media perpetuates. fear of our children being molested, fear of being murdered by, fear of child getting hurt on roller coaster, etc. in addition, its easier to imagine these things happening to us bc the news stories are about an individual person being affected. a lot of people don't feel the impact of problems like the war in iraq, global warming bc the effects are more large scale.

another possible explanation is that these are usually rare events that we don't hear about too often. we hear about the war in iraq, strife in darfur, global warming, presidential election every day on the news. these are all very imp't issues, but people may get desensitized to their importance hearing about it everyday.

jesvet

06-25-2007, 11:42 AM

I think people tend to post about the topics they are particularly touched, shocked, or affected by. There are some "regulars" who always post about a variety of current topics of the day, issues and the like, but many people are intermittent posters who come by here and there.

wendalah

06-25-2007, 11:48 AM

I agree with the OP that the news seems a little oversaturated with women-in-traumatic-situations right now. But, at the risk of sounding heartless, it doesn't really concern or disturb me particularly. The news loves anything having to do with that kind of stuff. (ETA, and by nature, so do we here in CC. See, there is a reason the media LOOOOOVES these stories! We as news consumers buy right into them!) Look how long the Lacey Peterson and OJ Simpson stories went on. So--again, not to sound heartless--but the media just got lucky and a bunch of these cases popped up at once.

BTW, I think the woman dying in the emergency room and the girl getting her feet cut off at Six Flags would have made compelling news stories regardless of whether it was a woman or a man. There might be some more sympathy for a woman in the ER story than a man, but I really don't think the gender mattered in the Six Flags story. The key point in that one was the person was a young teenager.

LittleFredPunkinHead

06-25-2007, 01:18 PM

Well, sort of OT, but I personally thought it was odd that that recent thread title had to be changed. Changing the thread title didn't change the fact that it happened. Are we really so delicate that we have to be shielded from a brief, non-graphic thread title?

BTB

06-25-2007, 01:30 PM

I find it interesting that out of all the possible stories to talk about, a forum filled with pretty well-educated, intelligent women/mothers ends up filled with stories like this.

It's true that there's a certain "flavor" of news story that you just know will yield multiple threads here that are later merged.

Are we really so delicate that we have to be shielded from a brief, non-graphic thread title?

Glad I'm not the only one - I find this forum's refrain of "please change the title, I just can't stomach it" bizarre. It's like it's a competition to see who's the most sensitive, the most delicate - it's just a thread title. Often it's the most concise, accurate description of the situation that ladies say their eyes can't handle, so it's a loss for the rest of us when it's changed to something blander. If you can't stand to see it, go to other fora.

kugrrly

06-25-2007, 01:39 PM

I started a thread about a girl who was kinapped in my town. It hit home to me since it happened less than 5 miles from my house. I needed a place to let out some of my feelings.

jajacobsen

06-25-2007, 02:07 PM

I also want to venture that there have been some pretty tough debates based on news threads here - and a little blood was shed between posters (me included). I would venture sometimes we're just not up to the challenge of such topics, so then we as a group retreat back to safer topics where the good and bad are easier to discern. I know sometimes I don't post because I just am not up to the onslaught I might receive (yes, really).

Give us a few weeks - we'll be back to slogging through some tough topics where the shades of gray are many. I know that I personally have been not posting as much at all because of personal health issues/lack of time but hope to be up to my usual daily post count and fearless belief in the certainty of my opinion in a few weeks or so.

When I lived in the UK, this time of year was called the "silly season" for news, because so many legislators, etc are on vacation the political front dies and news bureaus resort to sensationalist topics to get coverage/ratings.

Sadly, we have had ample material in the brutal murder of women and children to fill the void. I think when the campaigns kick in again in late August/September we'll see more diverse topics.

msnicolea

06-25-2007, 02:24 PM

I would never ask for a title to be changed, but I do prefer seeing "girl seriously injured" than to read, without warning, what actually happened to her--I am trying to avoid really horrific stuff, so as not to feel so anxious (just new parent anxiety, I think), so for me, less graphic titles are appreciated!

pocket

06-25-2007, 02:37 PM

I noticed it too, actually. That kind of fearmongering news is so manipulative! These horrible things are not very likely to happen to you and me, but news stories about them really contribute to a false atmosphere of fear and insecurity.

Rico'sAlice

06-25-2007, 02:40 PM

Scooter-

To answer your question, Yes I did notice this particularly in the last week or so. But I didn't start a thread on it because, well, you see.:p
I do agree with others that it is a reflection of the type of atmosphere most mass media sources encourage. But I also think that we can each take responsibility as individuals to try and create a different one.
Sooo.... I found something to post for you that wasn't along those lines but it's not the most exciting thing either.
San Francisco Mayor vs. Plastic (http://www.constantchatter.com/forum/showthread.php?p=1401928#post1401928)

msnicolea

06-25-2007, 03:49 PM

Here's an example--on yesterday's local news there was a lead that went something like this: "Could soccer kill your child?"

Now, the story was about how in the past 10 years, 8 youth have died NATIONALLY because of a faulty, non-secured soccer goal. And that's tragic, but hardly an epidemic. The story was presented as though our children are in immediate danger of "death by goal," and it was unbelievably alarmist and fear-mongerinsh!

mimieliza

06-25-2007, 04:16 PM

I also want to venture that there have been some pretty tough debates based on news threads here

Ah, yes, I can certainly see that. One reason I don't start threads here is that the stories that touch or outrage me the most tend to be fairly politically charged, and I don't like dealing with debates.

msnicolea - I hate that type of fear-mongering! It is rampant in internet-land, too (including our beloved CC). Evil plastic baby bottles, maiming Baby Bjorns and Exersaucers, chemical-laden sunscreen, everything is dangerous if spun in a certain way.

LittleFredPunkinHead

06-25-2007, 07:37 PM

And remember the summer there were all of those killer shark stories, but statistically speaking there were no more shark attacks that year than any other?

j*east

06-25-2007, 08:14 PM

Call me delicate, whatever, but I agree that this forum seems kind of alarmist lately. It reminds me a little bit of those articles in magazines like Cosmo that say, "10 Things an Attacker Looks For" or "The New Health Hazard: Is Your Kitchen Killing You?" For some of these stories, it seems like there's nothing to say except, "Yeah, that's terrible." The authors and editors are trying to sell magazines. What are the posters here trying to sell? Or communicate?

BTW, the thread titles pop up on a new posts search, so it's not as easy as avoiding the forum.

I also know that I *am* more sensitive to violent stories than the average person, due to having experienced it myself, and it does have a real effect on me to read nasty stories--or even headlines or thread titles. Go ahead and call me a nervous nelly, but there it is. I imagine the same is true of some PG women/some new moms/some moms of small kids--which could mean a lot of people around here. OTOH, it's everyone's prerogative to post whatever threads and thread titles they want, and read or not read them. It does make me want to spend less time on here, though, while the bloodthirstiness dies down.

Bottom line, I wonder if we contribute to the fearful mentality of women by posting so many stories about women as powerless victims. And from the looks of the "Do you walk alone?" thread on chitchat a while ago, a lot of women are scared already.

sue-bert

06-26-2007, 01:22 AM

LyLMyssChaos

06-26-2007, 07:57 AM

I really hadn't noticed a trend (and yes, I'm aware I'm one of the offending posters.) As far as threads that I post, I choose to post threads about topics/stories that get my attention and/or are of interest to me. I am the mother of young children, so stories involving them do get my attention.

I'm interested in politics, but there are not many here that share my political views, so I do try to avoid posting political topics. The few times that I do post a political topic, it often gets viewed, but not commented on. When it comes to politics, this board is extremely polarizing and I will admit that sometimes it is easier to post a thread where you know the majority of people will "get along."

LittleFredPunkinHead

06-26-2007, 08:33 AM

I also know that I *am* more sensitive to violent stories than the average person, due to having experienced it myself, and it does have a real effect on me to read nasty stories--or even headlines or thread titles. Go ahead and call me a nervous nelly, but there it is. I imagine the same is true of some PG women/some new moms/some moms of small kids--which could mean a lot of people around here. OTOH, it's everyone's prerogative to post whatever threads and thread titles they want, and read or not read them. It does make me want to spend less time on here, though, while the bloodthirstiness dies down.
I can be a massive hypochondriac, to the point where I've simply read a story about some scary illness or another and become physically ill. But it doesn't really make sense for me to expect others to censor themselves because of my hypersensitivity, does it?

Scooter

06-26-2007, 10:06 AM

Some very interesting ideas and theories, thanks for that! The posts have definitely helped me see it slightly differently. I think the point that this is a slow time of year for news and so the media like to focus on this type of thing makes sense. Maybe it's just that the other news stories out there aren't grabbing our attention enough to want to discuss.
I started a thread about a girl who was kinapped in my town. It hit home to me since it happened less than 5 miles from my house. I needed a place to let out some of my feelings.
I haven't pointed out any one poster, so don't worry, no need to defend yourself. :) I have just observed a trend and wanted to discuss it, I am not interested in pointing fingers and calling people out.

One thing that is surprising is that some of you who say the thread titles don't bother you are moms. Honestly, the original thread title for the 17yr old rapist didn't bother you? It made me literally sick, and I'm shocked that other moms of young children wouldn't be affected by it. There are some details I don't want to know, which is why I wouldn't click on the thread.

I've wanted a couple thread titles changed in the past, but that was because they were incorrect (eg "Vegan diet kills baby", or "Breastmilk kills infant" --those were factually incorrect titles). This is different. It's not asking for "censorship" though (to quote you, LFPH), it's more about keeping some goriness out of the thread titles. You can say whatever you want to in the thread, but making other people see the title is one step past that.

LyLMyssChaos

06-26-2007, 10:39 AM

One thing that is surprising is that some of you who say the thread titles don't bother you are moms. Honestly, the original thread title for the 17yr old rapist didn't bother you? It made me literally sick, and I'm shocked that other moms of young children wouldn't be affected by it. There are some details I don't want to know, which is why I wouldn't click on the thread.

I'm really surprised that the original title I had was so offensive. I used the same title as many news stories that I've read about it. I didn't see anything wrong with the title because honestly, I wanted people to know what the thread was about. Yes, it was a disgusting incident, but I did not go into details in the title. I wanted people to see that this was not the "typical" assault case, if there is such a thing. Assault happens every day, but it's not every day that it involves an infant and IMO, that is what made it news worthy. I could see if the thread title had been graphic and said something more specific about what happened, but I don't think it was offensive to simply state the charges and information about the people involved. Would it have been viewed as so offensive if it had said "17 year old arrested for raping 15 year old?"

Scooter

06-26-2007, 11:05 AM

LMC, yeah I had thought about that earlier. What would have been a better title? How could it be worded to show it was different than other assaults, without including that information? I don't know, honestly. Just having to read the 2nd half of it was really the problem, for me. And I know I'm not the only one who was bothered, judging by the posts in that thread.

I'm sorry to use that as an example, repeatedly, because I don't want this thread to turn into an attack on you and your titling skills. ;) It's just that for me, that one is the best example. Others may have problems with different ones, I don't know.

pocket

06-26-2007, 11:11 AM

All of these alarmist threads make me think of Stephen Colbert's Threatdown - Bears = Godless Killing Machines.

msnicolea

06-26-2007, 12:39 PM

Bears are DTM.

LittleFredPunkinHead

06-26-2007, 12:46 PM

One thing that is surprising is that some of you who say the thread titles don't bother you are moms. Honestly, the original thread title for the 17yr old rapist didn't bother you? It made me literally sick, and I'm shocked that other moms of young children wouldn't be affected by it. There are some details I don't want to know, which is why I wouldn't click on the thread.
So, are you saying you wouldn't have clicked on the thread after the title had been edited?
I've wanted a couple thread titles changed in the past, but that was because they were incorrect (eg "Vegan diet kills baby", or "Breastmilk kills infant" --those were factually incorrect titles). This is different. It's not asking for "censorship" though (to quote you, LFPH), it's more about keeping some goriness out of the thread titles. You can say whatever you want to in the thread, but making other people see the title is one step past that.
I don't think anyone's asking for censorship. What I said was, it's asking people to censor themselves. Which is not a problem, except I think that perhaps, before we ask someone to censor what they are saying because of our own sensibilities, maybe we should consider that we might need to adjust our own behavior (reactions) instead of expecting others to adjust theirs.

Sophia

06-26-2007, 01:03 PM

These sort of news items are less contentious than political debates. If someone gets mauled by a mountain lion, or shot by their jealous ex-boyfriend, or brutally murdered by their psycho neighbor, we can all agree that the incident is horrific and that the victim deserves our sympathy.

Perhaps many of us are weary of bickering, and look toward these sort of gory news stories to find a point of common opinion with their fellow CCers.

Exactly. I'm not posting or commenting on those sorts of threads because I'm getting caught up in the hysteria (and I agree that the media does create hysteria to an extent, although I disagree that all the threads mentioned fall into that category). I post/comment because I feel for the victims and know that others here will feel the same way.

One thing that is surprising is that some of you who say the thread titles don't bother you are moms. Honestly, the original thread title for the 17yr old rapist didn't bother you? It made me literally sick, and I'm shocked that other moms of young children wouldn't be affected by it. There are some details I don't want to know, which is why I wouldn't click on the thread.

I've wanted a couple thread titles changed in the past, but that was because they were incorrect (eg "Vegan diet kills baby", or "Breastmilk kills infant" --those were factually incorrect titles). This is different. It's not asking for "censorship" though (to quote you, LFPH), it's more about keeping some goriness out of the thread titles. You can say whatever you want to in the thread, but making other people see the title is one step past that.

I'm a mom of three, and yeah, that story was horrific and I had a moment of identifying with the mom and imagined how devasted I'd be if something like that happened to my child, so it made me figuratively sick. But it didn't make me literally sick or keep me from reading about it, and I didn't think the thread title was out of line. The new title doesn't even hint at the specifics of the story, and I have to wonder if others have opened the thread and read the actual story with no warning as to what actually happened and had the same extreme reaction to the story, coupled with an additonal feeling of being upset they weren't even prepared for it. I don't see how having an accurate, not graphic, title here is any different from going to CNN's home page and seeing the same headlines/links there.

Scooter

06-26-2007, 02:34 PM

LittleFredPunkinHead

06-26-2007, 03:26 PM

I see what you're saying about us having to be responsible for our own reactions, but there are certain things that are really upsetting for most people, especially on a board of almost all women and mothers. And like I said, people can put whatever they want in the threads, but the titles show on the forum, on the main forum page, and in new posts, so if someone choses to avoid it they really would have to avoid CC altogether. And that is asking too much.
I understand that there are certain topics that are upsetting for most people; I disagree, however, that there are that many people who are going to become really so upset at simply reading a thread title referencing the very basics of a topic.

I say this as someone who has honestly been there (in the sense of being hypersensitive to certain issues or subjects)- it is not a "normal" reaction, and as such, I don't think a community's rules should be based on it. I absolutely think that people should try to be sensitive to the feelings of others, but there's a difference, IMO, between being sensitive and coddling.

j*east

06-26-2007, 04:16 PM

I can be a massive hypochondriac, to the point where I've simply read a story about some scary illness or another and become physically ill. But it doesn't really make sense for me to expect others to censor themselves because of my hypersensitivity, does it?

I don't expect others to censor themselves, as I said--I know it's everyone's choice to post whatever, and read or not read it.

Sophia

06-26-2007, 04:56 PM

LFPH, Yeah, I wouldn't have clicked on it at all. I chose which threads to read based on the titles and subject matter--I have no interest in reading about that particular one. The only reason I clicked on that thread was to request a title change--I skipped the news story contents.

I didn't say you were asking for censorship, I was quoting you only for using the word "censor" in your post. I fully understood your point. I think it's just a semantical misunderstanding. I see what you're saying about us having to be responsible for our own reactions, but there are certain things that are really upsetting for most people, especially on a board of almost all women and mothers. And like I said, people can put whatever they want in the threads, but the titles show on the forum, on the main forum page, and in new posts, so if someone choses to avoid it they really would have to avoid CC altogether. And that is asking too much.

And really I didn't want the thread to go in this direction, I was hoping for more of a discussion about the trend of these stories in general. It's funny, though, because now a bunch of new threads have been started that are more varied.

Sophia, It really did make me feel sick, I felt nauseated and my stomach hurt. It was just too disgusting. But like I said in my post above to LMC, I honestly don't know how it could have been worded better. As for the cnn or fox websites, I get my internet news other ways specifically because I am not interested in hearing this type of thing. I'm not interested in sensationalistic fearmongering.

Bold mine.

Scooter, I can understand where you're coming from, even if I disagree about these particular thread titles. I've always thought the "Do you spit or swallow?" thread title (from Sex & Intimacy) is a bit much and always hope my teenaged kids aren't reading over my shoulder when it crops up in New Posts. It's not really work safe, either. It's never bothered me enough to complain about it before, though. I'm sorry you had such a strong reaction to the rape thread title. But like LFPH said, I don't think that strong of a reaction is typical. And I had never seen most of the headlines on CNN, etc, as being fear-mongering. Maybe it's because I read them as stories, maybe feel badly for the people involved, but don't get paranoid or fearful myself.

wendalah

06-26-2007, 05:21 PM

I'm not a mom (yet), but I don't expect upon becoming one that my sensitivity level will rocket to the degree that I'm unable to handle a disgusting news story involving children. I found that particular story nauseating but I've read stories like that before. I hope I do not become hypersensitive, because I do like to read or watch the news (all of it).

Scooter

06-26-2007, 05:39 PM

I say this as someone who has honestly been there (in the sense of being hypersensitive to certain issues or subjects)- it is not a "normal" reaction, and as such, I don't think a community's rules should be based on it. I absolutely think that people should try to be sensitive to the feelings of others, but there's a difference, IMO, between being sensitive and coddling.
Oh believe me, I am not looking for any rules to be made!! I just thought I'd open these ideas up for discussion. And FWIW, it's been very interesting to see the variety of reactions to it. I agree, some sensivity is important, although sometimes what is grey for some people will be black and white for others, so there's really nowhere to draw the line.

Bold mine.

Scooter, I can understand where you're coming from, even if I disagree about these particular thread titles. I've always thought the "Do you spit or swallow?" thread title (from Sex & Intimacy) is a bit much and always hope my teenaged kids aren't reading over my shoulder when it crops up in New Posts. It's not really work safe, either. It's never bothered me enough to complain about it before, though. I'm sorry you had such a strong reaction to the rape thread title. But like LFPH said, I don't think that strong of a reaction is typical. And I had never seen most of the headlines on CNN, etc, as being fear-mongering. Maybe it's because I read them as stories, maybe feel badly for the people involved, but don't get paranoid or fearful myself.That's funny, when that S&I thread title comes up I often think, 'I'm so glad no one is looking over my shoulder.' I don't think that's really work safe, either. And I know I'm probably more sensitive about the rape thread than most people, but I have a baby girl (like you) and have worked with a lot of survivors of rape and incest, so it just gave me a more visceral reaction than some of you.

I'm not a mom (yet), but I don't expect upon becoming one that my sensitivity level will rocket to the degree that I'm unable to handle a disgusting news story involving children. I found that particular story nauseating but I've read stories like that before. I hope I do not become hypersensitive, because I do like to read or watch the news (all of it).
Hahaha, you obviously haven't experienced PP hormones yet, have you? :p I think I cried everyday for the first month, happy tears usually, but still tears. Being a parent does change you, but the hormones sure add to it!