LOST - Season Three - Volume Two

[udsweetpea]

I think I'm all hormonal right now, but I totally cried when Hurley wanted to go on the boat with Charlie and Desmond, and Charlie told him he couldn't.

I'm regretting a read the episode spoilers, but I'm looking forward to next week's episode!

[jenji]

did anyone watch the special Thursday night that the producers did after Grey's? I missed it. just curious if there was anything I missed

[Secret_Squirrel]

I saw it. There wasn't anything new, but they did a good job of connecting story lines from season to season and synopsizing the show.

[Jenyfer9]

I *think* that is the same thing that is on this Wednesday before the season finale starts. Nothing too exciting was in it...

[Sazoo]

I *think* that is the same thing that is on this Wednesday before the season finale starts. Nothing too exciting was in it...Yes, they are one and the same. I missed it on Thurs too, but TiVo is recording it for me this Wed. instead. ;)

[heather1029]

HAPPY LOST DAY!!!!! WHOOOHOOOO!!!!

[Reebs]

You beat me Heather!! :p

Happy Lost Day...too!

So is everyone excited for THREE hours of Lost tonight???

[Jenyfer9]

Well I think that since I saw the special last Thursday after Grey's, I'm only getting 2 hours of LOST tonight. ;)

[MidwesternGal]

YAY for LOST day.

DH and I have to call ILs to have them tape it for us--because there is supposed to be a severe, MASSIVE thunderstorm starting this afternoon and staying until ohhh, 10 p.m. We have satellite television, so chances are, it'll get cut off. GRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR.

[udsweetpea]

OOOOH! The special is on tonight too? I missed it last week and was so upset I missed it. Yay for 3 hours of Lost!

My dad said the funniest thing the other day. He's wondering if the Losties will find Tom Hanks ala Castaway in a cave on the island. I laughed so hard. My dad has never even watched Lost!

[heather1029]

Gah, I'm so excited! :) :) :)

I'm glad I never read that big long spoiler!

[yby1]

heather1029 - me too!! :)

[SQ2]

Ooo...I too missed the special last week. I'm so excited for tonight!!! :D

[villanelle75]

For thos eof you excited about the special with the producers, don't get your hope sup too high. I didn't think it was anything special and they didn't say anything we didn't already know.

[Jenyfer9]

For thos eof you excited about the special with the producers, don't get your hope sup too high. I didn't think it was anything special and they didn't say anything we didn't already know.
ditto. But I am very excited for the finale. Quite glad I didn't read the spoiler/synopsis. Is tonight's a Jack-centric flashback episode?

[maggieb]

I did read the spoiler and I'm still excited! I can't wait for tonight. I keep counting down the hours.

[Rancid13]

I did read the spoiler and I'm still excited! I can't wait for tonight. I keep counting down the hours.

Me too!! I started watching the recap from Thurs last night and intend to finish it tonight before the finale. :D :D :D But I'll be bummed once it's over and we have to wait so many months till next season!!

[Sazoo]

ditto. But I am very excited for the finale. Quite glad I didn't read the spoiler/synopsis. Is tonight's a Jack-centric flashback episode?Yep!

ETA - I did read the spoiler/synopsis and kind of wish I hadn't...it's cool, but I am a little annoyed that I spoiled the surprise for myself. Oh well - I know I'll still enjoy the episode tonight. ;)

[mel7dog]

ooooh I can't wait for tonight!! Going to the store to get snacks and everything :D

PS: this is my 5000 post and I made sure it was in this thread, lol

[Jenyfer9]

Wtf?????

[maxandmolly]

I missed the first half hour-someone wanna recap?
Also-WTF?

[ihearttx]

Well the spoiler was totally accurate, which is sort of shocking to me.

I'm not sure what to think but I hope the next season of Lost isn't all about them getting back to the island...

[Rancid13]

I can't wait!! Another hour till it airs here!! Glad to hear the spoiler was correct, at least lostfan108 wasn't totally trying to pull a fast one on everyone with that.
I was especially wondering (in white) if Charlie is killed.

[ihearttx]

Yes, Rancid. It did. :(

[maggieb]

The spoiler was completely correct.

[Islandbride1025]

Well, as far as finale's go, this was by FAR the BEST one. I couldn't believe the stuff that was happening. I'm still juiced, I can't fall asleep.

I gained a new respect for Jack, he just seemed so much stronger tonight. I guess, if you've been lied to enough times by Ben, you start to man up. Go Jack....

This was an exceptional episode. They def saved the best for last. Although the "flashback" had me confused at first.

Hurley, Charley, all were great.

[Jenyfer9]

SUCKS that we have to wait until JANUARY!!!!!!!!!

[maggieb]

My favorite parts were when Rousseau punched out Ben, when Jack kicked the crap out of Ben, when Hurley ran over the Others, Charlie's last scene and when Jack told Kate he loved her. It was the best episode yet.

[jesseybell]

SUCKS that we have to wait until JANUARY!!!!!!!!!

I wouldn't count on it. If there are only 16 episodes, I bet its sometime in February :(

The spoiler was right on, though I read it really fast so I only knew a few things, but did know about the "flashbacks". I didn't tell DH - that was really hard. He said the Razor phone Jack had did give it away though.

The episode was really good. I did feel bad for Charlie, though I was waiting for him to go.

The fact that Penny didn't know Naomi is the part that makes me intrigued for next season. I just don't see a rescue happening, at least any time soon.

So do we assume the "he" Kate was referring to was Sawyer? And who do we think died?
I am sorry, but Evageline Lilly is much more pretty on the island with no makeup on that all dolled up.

[Rancid13]

So do we assume the "he" Kate was referring to was Sawyer? And who do we think died?


I haven't seen it yet (ack! 12 more min!) but from what I've heard it may be Michael who was in the coffin.

[charliezangel]

I was pretty sure what we were seeing was a "flash forward" and seeing the razr phone solidified it for me. Honestly, i don't think it was that great for a finale. I didn't feel like it answered any questions and i'm starting to feel more and more that this is going to turn out to be some unexplainable alien crap. Maybe i'm naive to think that this can be explained and still be this good, but i hate thinking it ends up being a "monster" on some "haunted" island. I'm not really looking forward to next season right now. I'm pretty aggrivated with this episode.

[yby1]

I haven't seen it yet (ack! 12 more min!) but from what I've heard it may be Michael who was in the coffin.

My guess would be Locke. He seemed like he was in the Los Angeles area when he went to the funeral parlor. Locke is from Southern California. No one went to see him - that really made me think it was Locke.


eta: Now I'm thinking that it's Ben. Actually, I'm almost sure it's Ben

[yby1]

So what the heck was Jack implying when he said "Call my father in and see who's drunker?"

Hmmm... :p

[Rosebud]

WOW!! Loved the finale. The last 15 minutes were awesome. Thoughts:

- I *loved* seeing Penny!! I like the Penney/Desmond love story better than the Jack-Kate-Sawyer triangle. It's just awesome that she's still out there looking for him.

- I hate to believe anything Ben says, but the people on that boat can't be good. Otherwise, why would Naomi lie about who they were and why she was there? Maybe it's some of the original Dharma people out there?

- After the Naomi deception was revealed, I kept thinking that maybe Desmond's vision was going to be accurate-- a helicopter would come and take Claire and Aaron. But maybe it's not a rescue, maybe it's a kidnapping. Maybe the people on Naomi's boat want Claire and Aaron for some reason.

- The flashforward to Jack and Kate... something's not right there. Jack tells the pharmacist to call his father. His father is dead! And why wouldn't Kate be in prison? Have they come back to some kind of alternate reality? I was actually wondering if we were seeing one of Desmond's visions. If that was the case, maybe there is time to somehow alter the future and change Jack's sad fate.

- I freaking love Sawyer. I really do. I love that he just took out Tom.

- The Alex/Danielle reunion was great. I just wish Ben had explained how he ended up being Alex's "father."

- The kid who plays Walt is SO much older! So, I guess Locke wasn't actually seeing Walt-- it was one of those weird island visions? Like the polar bear? Because Michael and Walt should be long gone. Also, it seems like there was a Walt/Locke conversation we weren't privvy to and that's what sent Locke charging up to the tower. Curious.


My guess would be Locke. He seemed like he was in the Los Angeles area when he went to the funeral parlor. Locke is from Southern California. No one went to see him - that really made me think it was Locke.

eta: Now I'm thinking that it's Ben. Actually, I'm almost sure it's Ben

Hmmm... I was thinking Locke, too. Somehow I can't imagine that Ben makes it off the island. But it would be super interesting either way. And we're meant to assume that Kate is with Sawyer in the future, right? (Yay!)

[Rose]

Wow. Glad I didn't read any spoilers for the finale.

The water death scene was just like the sydney/vaughn scene in the S1 of Alias but Vaughn ended up living. I guess the stole the idea from themselves.

I hated seeing Jack so screwed up in the future flashbacks but it will make for some interesting storylines. I still feel like they really didn't answer anything.

[yby1]

WOW!! Loved the finale. The last 15 minutes were awesome. Thoughts:

- I *loved* seeing Penny!! I like the Penney/Desmond love story better than the Jack-Kate-Sawyer triangle. It's just awesome that she's still out there looking for him.

- I hate to believe anything Ben says, but the people on that boat can't be good. Otherwise, why would Naomi lie about who they were and why she was there? Maybe it's some of the original Dharma people out there?

- After the Naomi deception was revealed, I kept thinking that maybe Desmond's vision was going to be accurate-- a helicopter would come and take Claire and Aaron. But maybe it's not a rescue, maybe it's a kidnapping. Maybe the people on Naomi's boat want Claire and Aaron for some reason.

- The flashforward to Jack and Kate... something's not right there. Jack tells the pharmacist to call his father. His father is dead! And why wouldn't Kate be in prison? Have they come back to some kind of alternate reality? I was actually wondering if we were seeing one of Desmond's visions. If that was the case, maybe there is time to somehow alter the future and change Jack's sad fate.

- I freaking love Sawyer. I really do. I love that he just took out Tom.

- The Alex/Danielle reunion was great. I just wish Ben had explained how he ended up being Alex's "father."

- The kid who plays Walt is SO much older! So, I guess Locke wasn't actually seeing Walt-- it was one of those weird island visions? Like the polar bear? Because Michael and Walt should be long gone. Also, it seems like there was a Walt/Locke conversation we weren't privvy to and that's what sent Locke charging up to the tower. Curious.




Hmmm... I was thinking Locke, too. Somehow I can't imagine that Ben makes it off the island. But it would be super interesting either way. And we're meant to assume that Kate is with Sawyer in the future, right? (Yay!)

- I think that it's Dharma too!

- I thought Jack didn't want the pharmacist to call his father's office? I really think that Christian is dead.

[Rosebud]

I thought Jack didn't want the pharmacist to call his father's office? I really think that Christian is dead.

That could definitely be. But he did also tell the other guy at the hospital to get his Dad down there and they'd see who was drunker. It could just be Jack drugged out and off his rocker, but it struck me as odd.

eta: Actually, now that I'm thinking about Ben vs. Locke in the coffin more carefully.... it really could be Ben! Didn't Locke say once that he was never going to leave the island? Maybe he reallly doesn't. I'm wondering who else Kate would be angry at in the future...

[Katy]

I haven't read anything yet, but holy cow, that was just awesome!! They did a great job! I can't believe we have to wait 7-8 months!!! That's just painful!

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
the Razor phone Jack had did give it away though.I didn't realize it was a flash-forward at first, but I definitely caught the phone and commented to the hubby that cells weren't that thin back then.

The fact that Penny didn't know Naomi is the part that makes me intrigued for next season. I just don't see a rescue happening, at least any time soon.how in the world did Penny get *right* through is what I wonder about. But this is a great storyline. I like what Rosebud said about how maybe they were just after Claire and the baby as well. Interesting.

So do we assume the "he" Kate was referring to was Sawyer? And who do we think died?I noticed that the coffin seemed shorter than your average coffin, but I'm not sure how many others would realize that. I think it must be Ben or Locke in the coffin.

After the Naomi deception was revealed, I kept thinking that maybe Desmond's vision was going to be accurate-- a helicopter would come and take Claire and Aaron. But maybe it's not a rescue, maybe it's a kidnapping. Maybe the people on Naomi's boat want Claire and Aaron for some reason. This is a great theory. They said on the news that Aaron is/will be very important from here on out.

And we're meant to assume that Kate is with Sawyer in the future, right? (Yay!)I think it's Sawyer that she's referring to. I think this is cool if it's true.

The hubby and I went for a walk right after the show and outside of our vacation plans and some basic work talk, we spent most of the hour talking about who we think is in the coffin and who Kate's he might be. I guess the two key questions, at least for us.

[ktdelsur]

I am going to watch it again online - I missed the first half hour, plus DH and I felt like idiots because we were sitting there trying to figure the "flashbacks" out and didn't realize until we saw Kate and heard Jack say "We never should have left" that it was a flash-forward. I honestly spent a second looking at Kate and thinking, "How could they have known each othe rbefore??" Duh.

Jack also implied when he called Kate to meet him at the airport that the meeting place was a "usual" meeting spot for them...hmm. I think Jack's dad really is dead too - and I think ... could it have been Juliet in the coffin? I just am remembering Kate's "why would *I* go to the funeral?" comment.

[jenji]

I love love LOVE this show!!!!
I was so confused and happy and mad the whole time. It was crazy!
thoughts:

1) So Jack's dad's alive in the future?

2) and... walt?!

3) Yay Locke's not dead

4) Way to go Hurley and the VW van! I was so upset when Sawyer was the second person to use his size as to why he couldn't go even though both he and Charlie did it because they care about him.

5) I think it was Sawyer that died. anyone else would have had SOMEONE there, I would think and Jack seemed pretty sure that Kate would be there. I don't see Sawyer being the "him" that Kate would be with in the real world

6) I was so amazed and excited that Jack actually told Kate he loved her... right after he kissed Juliet - what was that?!

7) I was proud of Charlie for dying doing something good and saving desmond in the process and still making sure he knew it wasn't Penny's boat.

8) So is Mikail immortal because how many times has he been "killed" now?

oooh, I just am so excited about next season. The forward flashes were so sad. You have to know that if they get rescued it's going to be so traumatic for them. I think every single one of them has a better life on the island than they had before (except that Sun'll die if she stays there). so happy about this episode

[krbb]

Wow! So I wonder where this takes the show next season? Will it start with them still on island and do flashbacks or will it be in the present/future with flashbacks to the island?

- Why did Charlie not leave the room and close the door? I told DH they need to watch Patchy since he seems invincible.

I am thinking Ben was in the coffin. I don't think Locke would leave the island alive

- I also got the feeling that the "HE" Kate had to return to was Sawyer.

[heather1029]

- The flashforward to Jack and Kate... something's not right there. Jack tells the pharmacist to call his father. His father is dead! And why wouldn't Kate be in prison? Have they come back to some kind of alternate reality? I was actually wondering if we were seeing one of Desmond's visions. If that was the case, maybe there is time to somehow alter the future and change Jack's sad fate.

And we're meant to assume that Kate is with Sawyer in the future, right? (Yay!)

I think maybe they time-traveled to a few days before the crash, and were able to alter the future. But, altering the future didn't work out the way they thought it would (what with Jack wanting to kill himself and all).

I thought maybe we'd see Boone or Shannon walking around in the hospital!

What about the baby Kate was pregnant with many episodes ago? Did she give birth to that baby long before the crash? Maybe that's the "he" who is waiting for her.

[heather1029]

P.S. I completely MELTED when Jack told Kate he loved her!!!! Yes! Bring back that love story and do away with Sawyer!

[chefker]

What is with Mikhail? He regenerates like an earthworm, lol. Charlie COULD have escaped by opening the door, getting himself out and shutting the door. I think he got it in his head, thanks to Desmond's visions, that he would have to die in order for Claire to get rescued. :( I HOPE that the island's 'healing power' will somehow bring Charlie back to life. Or maybe Des will be able to get the hatch opened and get Charlie out & resuscitate him.

I don't know if what we saw (with Jack on the bridge, etc) was a flash-forward, or more of an alternate reality. Like they were totally ripping off Dickens' Christmas Carol with the 'Ghost of christmas yet to come' type scenario. So much doesn't add up - Jack's father being alive (maybe), Kate NOT being in jail, etc. Maybe something to do with time travel or something?

I think Michael and Walt are being held prisoner somewhere in the Looking Glass station. I wonder if Des will explore the rest of the place, though I imagine he'll try to save Charlie if he can, first.

Hurley kicked ass! That was so funny. "Yeah dude, I saved them all!" Now how did the Others know to 'bluff' and NOT shoot Sayid, Jin & Bernard? Ben clearly told Tom on the walkie "shoot them!" and instead they shot bullets into the sand. They must have worked out the scenario beforehand.

I wish Ben had answered Alex's question a little more; "why can't you just let them leave?" "Because I CAN'T!" He doesn't want the island to be discovered, and does everything 'for' the island, etc. Hmm.

That exchange between Danielle & Alex was great. "Alex, this is your mother."
"Will you help me tie him up?" :p I still don't think Ben is really Alex's father. Either he adopted her (after stealing her from Danielle), or Danielle was inseminated with Ben's sperm.

I can't wait until February 2008!!!!!

[udsweetpea]

I'm thinking it was Ben in the coffin as well since Jack said he was neither a friend or family member. If it were one of the Losties, it would have been a "friend".

I'm hoping the "he" was Sawyer.

Why didn't Charlie swim out of the hole? It looked big enough for him to fit through. Or why didn't he run out of the room and close the door behind him?

I laughed out loud several times in this episode, especially when Danielle knocked out Ben.

But the scene when Sawyer told Hurley he couldn't come along made me cry just like when Charlie told him he couldn't go. But good for Hurley for running over the Others!

[ummserious]

Naomi had that photo of Desmond with her when she was found in the parachute, I'd think that whatever her mission was it still would involve him, right?

We were wondering why the group on the beach didn't kill Sayid, Jin and Bernard. My guess is that Ben was losing more and more credibility.

I wish we knew more why Locke was so against Jack making that phonecall. (unless I missed something?)

[chefker]

I wish we knew more why Locke was so against Jack making that phonecall. (unless I missed something?)


I would guess that it's because Locke doesn't want to be rescued - he believes that if he leaves the island and goes back home, he'll revert to being paralyzed again.

Speaking of Locke, it's interesting how he was shot point-blank in the stomach, yet seems to be healing nicely. Maybe he's got 9 lives like Mikhail. :)

[diam124]

Hmmm...I really think the guy in the coffin is Sawyer. I could see Jack & Kate getting together in a future episode and Sawyer never getting over it. (I loved it when Jack told Kate he loved her - I still think they have way more chemistry than Kate + Sawyer).

I thought Sawyer really seemed changed and very "dark" this episode.

I also loved it when Hurley saved the day - he is my favorite character.

I was also confused as to whether Jack's Dad is still alive (not the comment to the pharmacist, but the comment to the other doctor).

The only lame part was how Walt went through puberty in the month or so that he's been gone. Apparently he has the opposite problem as eye-liner guy. I think they need to find a new Walt.

[ummserious]

I would guess that it's because Locke doesn't want to be rescued - he believes that if he leaves the island and goes back home, he'll revert to being paralyzed again.

But he doesn't have to go, right? I just don't understand why he would care if other people wanted to leave. There might be a reason but he wasn't saying so.

[Anna Low]

A couple of thoughts.....

When Kate boarded the flight at the beginning, she was a wanted criminal, being returned to the States by a US marshal. Why is she now free to come and go as she pleases? What happened to the murder charge? How is she able to return to anyone - wouldn't she be in jail?

Jack suggested to the doctor that they call his dad's office to do a "who's drunker" test. If his dad is dead, then why would he suggest that? I'm pretty sure he faked the prescription, but his calling the office comment was quite odd.

The funeral home appeared to be in a less affluent section of town and no one came to visitation. That lead us to think it might have been Locke. He wasn't wealthy, had no real family and wasn't a friend or family member of Jack's.

I wonder if the departure from the island is driving them to suicide? Jack was certainly ready to take the plunge and maybe that is why he feels they need to go back? He doesn't appear fearful - in the sense that people are chasing him - so I don't think the rescuees are being picked off.

If he does go back to the island, would there be a "reset", much like what happened to Desmond when he got blown out of the hatch?

[heather1029]

I think maybe they time-traveled to a few days before the crash, and were able to alter the future. But, altering the future didn't work out the way they thought it would (what with Jack wanting to kill himself and all).

I thought maybe we'd see Boone or Shannon walking around in the hospital!

What about the baby Kate was pregnant with many episodes ago? Did she give birth to that baby long before the crash? Maybe that's the "he" who is waiting for her.

ETA: I think maybe they time-traveled to a long time before the crash, maybe over a year or two? That would explain Kate not being wanted by the cops and Jack's dad not being dead (although I think he died only a week or less before the crash).

[chefker]

I'm all posty today, but I can't stop spinning my theories. Gawd, what will I do for the next 9 months until Lost returns! ;)

I think Ben was telling the truth in that Naomi 'isn't who she says she is." She's either working for Dharma, or maybe even for Penny's father Charles Widmore. Maybe Charles knows that Penny's trying to find Des (who he believes to be 'unworthy' of his daughter), and is trying to locate Des before she does, in order to kill him.

Or, this is just a funky Dharma operation, and the object is to get Claire & Aaron (not to rescue them, but to kidnap them). I read somewhere that the show's creators say that Aaron will be 'very important' in upcoming seasons. Hm, wasn't the biblical Aaron a prophet, IIRC? Another related theory, they figured out that Ben exterminated the original Dharma people, and have been trying to locate the island in order to retaliate/capture Ben.

Locke seems to 'disappear' when Jack is on the phone talking to the Minkowski dude. I believe Locke is back tinkering with the radio tower to disable it, so the rescue team will not get a lock on the signal, and the rescue attempt will be thwarted.

Man, I love this show!

[heather1029]

Or, this is just a funky Dharma operation, and the object is to get Claire & Aaron (not to rescue them, but to kidnap them). I read somewhere that the show's creators say that Aaron will be 'very important' in upcoming seasons. Hm, wasn't the biblical Aaron a prophet, IIRC? Another related theory, they figured out that Ben exterminated the original Dharma people, and have been trying to locate the island in order to retaliate/capture Ben.


Man, I love this show!

The Aaron in the Bible was Moses' brother and his spokesperson.

[chefker]

The Aaron in the Bible was Moses' brother and his spokesperson.

Ah, yes. And Jack is being referred to as "Moses" leading his people (I think Naomi called him that?) Interesting stuff.

[c'est la vie]

ETA: I think maybe they time-traveled to a long time before the crash, maybe over a year or two? That would explain Kate not being wanted by the cops and Jack's dad not being dead (although I think he died only a week or less before the crash).
I see a lot of possibilities for this theory! It does explain a lot of last night's conflicting parts. But Kate also said when they met at the airstrip, something to the effect of "still pulling people from burning wreckage", which would let us believe that that was the future.

I don't know who could haven been in the coffin, since neither Ben nor Locke would want to leave the island. (Only if they were forced to - then I'd say it was Ben.)
The big "twist" next season could be that Ben was actually the good guy, and Naomi’s people are the bad guys, who now took over the island.

[southerner]

Haven't processed all of it yet. A few initial thoughts though:

1. I wonder if that note from Charlie about his ten greatest moments makes it out alive? :rolleyes:

2. Desmond and Patchy are on the wrong show. Their abilities to see the future and immortality belong on Heroes!

3. I'm leaning toward Ben in the coffin. He's short. He's neither a friend nor family. He would have no one there. He would be the type of person Kate would say why would I be at his funeral about. I think Jack is so torn up about the death b/c he's admitting he (the dead person) was right about how they should have never left the island.

Here is a link to the screencap (http://bp0.blogger.com/_8HhjIy50yEY/RlUOKWnofdI/AAAAAAAAALw/2oyx2_B2Wq4/s1600-h/a04.1-full.JPG) of the obit. The name in the obit isn't the name someone is going by on the island.

4. Another key biblical reference last night about Jack being Moses.

[udsweetpea]

I don't think they time-traveled to a time before the plane crash simply because of the Razr phone. I don't think they came out in 2004 or earlier.

[LeslieR]

The Aaron in the Bible was Moses' brother and his spokesperson.

Ah, yes. And Jack is being referred to as "Moses" leading his people (I think Naomi called him that?) Interesting stuff.

That would be almost close since Aaron is Jack's nephew. Interesting.



1. I wonder if that note from Charlie about his ten greatest moments makes it out alive?

Charlie put his top ten list in Desmond's pocket. He pulled it out just after he woke up and before he started getting shot at by Mikhail.




Last night's epi was seriously the best episode of Lost ever! My wheels are still turning trying to figure everything out. DH and I had no clue it was a flashforward until we realized it was Kate. I really don't get the the comments Jack made about his father, though. That is what threw (and still throws) me off.

I guess I could sortive see how Kate ends up with Sawyer in the future. I do believe Jack is the one she loves, but perhaps since Jack is so messed up in the future, she turns to Sawyer? From his comment to her about meeting at the usual place, it's clear they've met there several times before...

I was seriously laughing my ass off when Hurley came crashing through the camp in the VW. That was the best Lost moment ever.:D

I wish Jack would have killed Ben. How I hate that f*cker! I do want to know more about how Ben became Alex's father, though.

So many questions still. I can't believe we have to wait until February. :whah:

[udsweetpea]

By the looks of the obit, it looks like the person was from New York.

[tippy]

i don't know what to think of the finale. it left me with more questions than answers :(

here are my thoughts:
- if naomi wasn't with penny then who is she and why did she act like she was there to rescue des?

- i didn't realize it was a flash-fwd until the very end. when he said "we should have never left"

- couldn't locke have opted to stay on the island if he didn't want to leave?

- that said, i do think it was him in the coffin

- are they *really* off the island? i watched the lost special before the finale, and the producers were talking and said "they can't get off the island - the show would be over". now did they just say that to throw everyone off, or was the flash-fwd a vision?

- i also thought i had read somewhere that there were going to be "mass casualties" on both sides? i almost feel a little lied to again - not that i'm complaining b/c i didn't want any 'losties' to die anyway.

i don't know, i was just a bit disappointed with how they left things. but maybe i expected too many answers. :p

[heather1029]

- i also thought i had read somewhere that there were going to be "mass casualties" on both sides? i almost feel a little lied to again - not that i'm complaining b/c i didn't want any 'losties' to die anyway.



Me too!!! My friends, husband and I all made bets and wrote out who we thought would die. I was annoyed that nobody we cared about really did! It would have made it much more interesting... (I'm glad Sayid didn't die, though. He's in my top three characters of the show.)

[udsweetpea]

Better view of the newspaper clipping and you can zoom in (http://www.lostpedia.com/images/d/d4/Newspaperclipping2.jpg)

Lostpedia says this- "A closer look can suggest that the name of the dead party has a first name beginning with J and a last name ending with antham. He died in "The Tower" (Apartments?) on Grand Avenue in downtown Los Angeles, possibly a reference to the as-yet-unbuilt Grand Avenue Project."

[mel7dog]

Wow I thought it was a great episode. I am kicking myself for reading the spoiler because I kept thinking how cool it would have been if I didn't know the shole Jack/Kate in the future

Favorite parts:

-Alex finally meeting her mother
-Jack telling Kate he loves her
-Hurley with the VW van
-Sayid killing that dude with his feet

I'm pretty sure Charlie didn't escape even though he may have been able to because it was his detiny to die and save Claire and Aaron. I also believe he is dead for good.

My first thought at the funeral was that it was Ben. I agree with whoever said anyone else from the island would have been a friend.

[cocoa_femme]

My thoughts on last night's season finale...

- I think it was Michael in the casket. The neighborhood seemed to be an African American one, as did the funeral home. Plus, Michael didn't have any friends and/or family except for Walt. I can see why Kate (and all the other Losties) would be mad at him. He sold them out to get off of the island. But, I'm not sure how why Walt wouldn't be there.

- I think the "he" Kate was referring to was Sawyer. I hope so, because I *hate* Jack.

- I do not think there was any time travel involved. Remember Jack told Kate that he was flying a lot, with those "golden tickets" the airline gave them? This tells me that they were rescued in and remained in real-time.

- I think Jack talking about his father was just the insane rantings of a drugged-out drunkard.

- Someone mentioned Moses...when Jack was leading his people across the beach (on their way towards the tower), both the music playing and the visual totally reminded me of Moses leading his people away from Egypt (in the Ten Commandments).

Man, I can't believe we have to wait until next year for the next season...

[tippy]

My thoughts on last night's season finale...

- I think it was Michael in the casket. The neighborhood seemed to be an African American one, as did the funeral home. Plus, Michael didn't have any friends and/or family except for Walt. I can see why Kate (and all the other Losties) would be mad at him. He sold them out to get off of the island. But, I'm not sure how why Walt wouldn't be there.


my question about this theory is, didn't michael die a long time ago? where was his body all that time? also, the part of the newspaper clipping that you can make out said that a body was found in a hotel/apt hanging from a beam, which to me suggests suicide. it couldn't have been michael considering that. to me it had to be someone that had no family/friends, nothing to live for, and no money. also, someone that meant something to all of them, but that people didn't necessarily like. kwim?

Me too!!! My friends, husband and I all made bets and wrote out who we thought would die. I was annoyed that nobody we cared about really did! It would have made it much more interesting... (I'm glad Sayid didn't die, though. He's in my top three characters of the show.)

i did that too. i made a list of everyone i thought they could afford to kill off. :) i am really glad sayid didn't die either - he's the best!!

[heather1029]

I saw this theory on Lost.com and I think it's pretty good (way better than mine!):

"When the plane crashed on the island, there was a disruption in the "space-time continuum". They actually "crashed into the future" when then landed on the island. They think it was still September 2004 and is still just a few months after the crash when in reality, they have spent a few months some where in the future. Perhaps that would also explain that very advanced looking "phone" Naomi has. Last season's ending electromagnetic pulse allowed them to be located not only in place but also in time. That's how Naomi was able to locate them. I'm still trying to figure out how Naomi (and whoever she is with) were able to travel through time once they found the time and place.

When the Lostees are rescued, they are brought back to the "Present Day." That would explain why things that you thought have already happened, such as Jack's dad being dead, are seemingly not true - because they have not happened yet as of the time that Kate and Jack are talking. They're discussing "going back" because the island's events are in their past, but not in the world's past. " -- by poster JGlostee

[chefker]

also, the part of the newspaper clipping that you can make out said that a body was found in a hotel/apt hanging from a beam, which to me suggests suicide.

I didn't make out that part of the article, but that's interesting. A suicide leads me to believe someone who was feeling guilt/depression over something, decided to take their life. Guilt over something they did on the island perhaps (Michael?) We don't know what happens to Walt, either. Maybe he dies on the boat, and Michael feels he has nothing left to live for after. Or maybe Walt somehow returns to the island, and Michael returns to the U.S.

I don't think Ben has an ounce of remorse in his body, I can't see him killing himself. However Locke might. He was about to, when the vision of Walt appeared telling him not to.

[udsweetpea]

Just reading on Lostpedia.com- Michael is from New York, and the article said the person who died was from New York... interesting!

[tippy]

my question about this theory is, didn't michael die a long time ago? where was his body all that time? also, the part of the newspaper clipping that you can make out said that a body was found in a hotel/apt hanging from a beam, which to me suggests suicide. it couldn't have been michael considering that. to me it had to be someone that had no family/friends, nothing to live for, and no money. also, someone that meant something to all of them, but that people didn't necessarily like. kwim?


wow, i just remembered...michael didn't die on the island - he was allowed to go "home". if he in fact made it back, that's the question. but wouldn't at least walt have been there?

[tippy]

I saw this theory on Lost.com and I think it's pretty good (way better than mine!):

"When the plane crashed on the island, there was a disruption in the "space-time continuum". They actually "crashed into the future" when then landed on the island. They think it was still September 2004 and is still just a few months after the crash when in reality, they have spent a few months some where in the future. Perhaps that would also explain that very advanced looking "phone" Naomi has. Last season's ending electromagnetic pulse allowed them to be located not only in place but also in time. That's how Naomi was able to locate them. I'm still trying to figure out how Naomi (and whoever she is with) were able to travel through time once they found the time and place.

When the Lostees are rescued, they are brought back to the "Present Day." That would explain why things that you thought have already happened, such as Jack's dad being dead, are seemingly not true - because they have not happened yet as of the time that Kate and Jack are talking. They're discussing "going back" because the island's events are in their past, but not in the world's past. " -- by poster JGlostee

hmmm, interesting!

[LIZNKEITH]

I thought it was agreat episode as well. Even having read the spoiler in advance. A coworker sent me an even closer picture of the obituary. I tried to post it, but the links not woking anymore. I'll keep working on it. Anyway, the name clearly starts with a J folllowed by what appears to be either an "a" or an "o". It's been suggested it's either James (Sawyer), John Locke, or even Jacob in the casket.

Couple of other thoughts...
-Did anyone notice the couple behind Jack on the plane? It looked very much like Jin & Sun.
-Anyone think that possibly the woman who was in the accident on the bridge was Sawyers old girlfriend and his son? She looked very much like her (though it's hard to tell when she was pretty banged up and in ICU) and the age of the child could be about right. They mentioned the patient's last name, but I haven't been able to find what Sawyers girlfriends last name was.

My favorite parts:
-Sayid going all savage on that guy
-Hurley saving the day
-Charlie's last scene (I cried)
-Alex finally meeting her Mom

I can't wait until next season. :)

[Kate&Joey]

So many good thoughts / theories about last night's episode! I loved it. :D

Random thoughts:

When Sawyer shot Tom and Hurley said something like "Dude, he surrendered." What did Sawyer say back? I thought it was a good line, but now I can't remember it. :o

Loved it when Sayid gave Sawyer this great look of understanding (I think after Sawyer shot Tom) like "OK, now we're definitely on the same team."

The code to the Looking Glass jammer was the tune to "Good Vibrations"; only a musician would know that: hence, more *destiny* for Charlie to be there.

Great line by Bernard, "I am a dentist...not Rambo." ;)

I also figured it would be Michael in the coffin (Losties would be pissed at him that he betrayed them, didn't have other family, etc.), but with the funeral home obviously being in an AA neighborhood, that might be too *obvious* for Lost.

[tippy]

So many good thoughts / theories about last night's episode! I loved it. :D

Random thoughts:

When Sawyer shot Tom and Hurley said something like "Dude, he surrendered." What did Sawyer say back? I thought it was a good line, but now I can't remember it. :o



I believe he said "I didn't believe him".

[myshel]

- I do not think there was any time travel involved. Remember Jack told Kate that he was flying a lot, with those "golden tickets" the airline gave them? This tells me that they were rescued in and remained in real-time.

- I think Jack talking about his father was just the insane rantings of a drugged-out drunkard.

I completely agree with these two ideas. The whole time Jack was talking about his father, I kept thinking that it was the drugs talking. I think the flash forward shows us that while Jack did take definitive action on the island, it will come back to haunt him, just as it has in every other aspect of his life.

I can completely see Jack becoming the way he is in the flash forward. A lifetime of playing hero will finally catch up to him. He can't save everybody and for someone like Jack, I think that will have major consequences. I also think that Jack's behavior during the flash forward acknowledges the fact that, perhaps, he made the wrong choice in letting Naomi make the call.

[LIZNKEITH]

Link's working again. Scroll down to the bottom of the page, about a dozen posts down:
http://www.4815162342.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=41210

[yby1]

Naomi might be Hanso. I wonder if somehow Kelvin is still alive and came in contact with the Hanso Corp.

I wonder if Naomi lying when she told them that they had found the wreckage of flight 815?

[jen]

I'm guessing the guy who died has the last name of Lantham. Why do I hear Ben's voice saying that name?? Do we know someone with that last name??

[Rosebud]

I wonder if Naomi lying when she told them that they had found the wreckage of flight 815?

I have always believed that someone/some group actually faked the discovery of the plane wreckage. Whoever was responsible for getting the Losties to that island (and they're such a specific group with connections to each other, I have to think they were intentionally selected by some greater power-- Dharma? Penney's father?) also faked finding wreckage, IMO. They either planted fake plane wreckage, or they were tasked with finding the wreckage and then lied about their findings.

It could be Michael in the coffin. That would mean he's got to come back into play at some point here.

[cocoa_femme]

So, I was on TMZ.com looking at the celebrity packages slide show, and look what I found. The tagline said "Dominic Monaghan's Not So Little Hobbit".

It's tagged, so clicky, clicky...http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a334/cocoa_femme/dominicmonaghansnotsolittlehobbit.jpg

[Rancid13]

Wow, a lot to talk about!

My guess would be Locke. He seemed like he was in the Los Angeles area when he went to the funeral parlor. Locke is from Southern California. No one went to see him - that really made me think it was Locke.


eta: Now I'm thinking that it's Ben. Actually, I'm almost sure it's Ben

Locke works (worked?) for a box company in Tustin, which is about 30 miles south of LA city (~20 miles south of LA county). That just seems a bit far of a commute for a paraplegic, and that neighborhood Jack was in definitely looked like some of the poorer neighborhoods of LA. One reason why I think it was Michael was it looked like a predominantly black neighborhood and Kate had no desire to attend (possibly because of Michael's betrayal?)

Where is Michael from, I thought he was from NY?? And isn't he in some sort of construction business??

In the screen cap of the obit, I can't make out a name.

~So now I'm curious if there's still people on the island after Kate & Jack left, and that's why he wants to go back?

~I was totally thrown off when Jack kept mentioning his father

~I'll have to watch again, but did Patchy blow himself up with the grenade also, or could he still be alive out there?

~I was happily surprised to see the Others on the beach did not shoot Jin, Bernard and Sayid. "Ben's losing it", LOL!!

~Jack seemed pretty hopped up on pills and alcohol, maybe he was just way off his rocker when he kept mentioning his father (out of guilt too?).

~I was very surprised at how quickly Penny's transmission came thru on the video screen once the signal was unblocked. Perfect timing?

I was so amazed and excited that Jack actually told Kate he loved her... right after he kissed Juliet - what was that?!

I know! WTH!!!:eek:

Hurley kicked ass! That was so funny. "Yeah dude, I saved them all!"

I loved Hurley! I was starting to feel so bad for him, being left out of groups. Charlie didn't want him coming with he and Des, Sawyer and Juliet not wanting him to come with them. And then he saved the day!!


Why didn't Charlie swim out of the hole? It looked big enough for him to fit through.

I kept thinking that too!! He totally could've gotten out if he didn't have it ingrained in his head that he had to die in order for Desmond's flash to come true.

The only lame part was how Walt went through puberty in the month or so that he's been gone.

I hardly even recognized him! He looked and sounded so different, not just a year or so older, but several years older. Time flies!

I do not think there was any time travel involved. Remember Jack told Kate that he was flying a lot, with those "golden tickets" the airline gave them? This tells me that they were rescued in and remained in real-time.

Yes, you're right! It would have to be in real time then, otherwise why would they have been given those lifetime tickets?

wow, i just remembered...michael didn't die on the island - he was allowed to go "home". if he in fact made it back, that's the question. but wouldn't at least walt have been there?

Maybe Walt is still on the island? Or maybe something happened to him on the island?

I thought it was a great episode as well. Even having read the spoiler in advance.

Me too!! Me too!! There were a few little surprises in there that weren't in the spoiler.

I believe he said "I didn't believe him".

And prior to that he said something like "This is for taking the kid!" (walt). :)

[Rosebud]

I think I said this in my previous mega-post, but I definitely don't think Jack and Kate were time traveling. I think it's an alternate reality that was shown-- like a Desmond vision. It's what happens to Jack and Kate after they get off the island, but it could also be prevented/corrected by something that happens in future episodes.

Also, I don't believe all the Losties will leave the island. I think it will come down to a big choice of who wants to go and who wants to stay. Locke and Jack will be in different camps, of course.

And I still don't think the people on Naomi's boat are the rescuers. I think they're bad & possibly after Claire & Aaron. (Also mentioned this before, I think).

[villanelle75]

Anyone else think maybe it was Jacob in the coffin?

[BumbleB]

eta: Actually, now that I'm thinking about Ben vs. Locke in the coffin more carefully.... it really could be Ben! Didn't Locke say once that he was never going to leave the island? Maybe he reallly doesn't. I'm wondering who else Kate would be angry at in the future...


There is too much to respond to - but I'll start with this. I DON'T understand why LOCKE is trying to force everyone to stay on the island. If they ALL leave, he doesn't have to go with them - isn't that his choice? Do you think he has this idea in his head that the connection to all these people is part of the magic that has healed him? If that is the case then wouldn't it matter that some of them have died? I DON'T GET HIS OBSESSION WITH KEEPING EVERYONE THERE! :eek:

[westamp]

Well the spoiler was totally accurate, which is sort of shocking to me.

I'm not sure what to think but I hope the next season of Lost isn't all about them getting back to the island...

So how did this person find out about the plot points? Do they work for ABC? This is so weird!

Welll yeah, I agree, I don't want to see everyone jumping back to the island next year. That would be a sucky theme. On the other hand, I do want to find out what happened to the rest of the castaways!

[heather1029]

There is too much to respond to - but I'll start with this. I DON'T understand why LOCKE is trying to force everyone to stay on the island. If they ALL leave, he doesn't have to go with them - isn't that his choice? Do you think he has this idea in his head that the connection to all these people is part of the magic that has healed him? If that is the case then wouldn't it matter that some of them have died? I DON'T GET HIS OBSESSION WITH KEEPING EVERYONE THERE! :eek:

I think he must be more wise than the rest of them. He knows what will happen when everyone goes back. He knows they'll still be "lost" and depressed and blah blah... Life and all its problems will still exist off the island. Locke knows this.

[heather1029]

Anyone else think maybe it was Jacob in the coffin?

It would be cool!

I actually thought in the very beginning that Jack (with that nasty beard) was Jacob and that was going to be a huge reveal. :o

[westamp]

Wow. Glad I didn't read any spoilers for the finale.

The water death scene was just like the sydney/vaughn scene in the S1 of Alias but Vaughn ended up living. I guess the stole the idea from themselves.

I hated seeing Jack so screwed up in the future flashbacks but it will make for some interesting storylines. I still feel like they really didn't answer anything.

No surprise to the parallels to Alias since JJ Abrams is one of the producers and he originally manned the show in season one (that's before Tommy Cruise hijacked him for MI3 damn you Tommy).

Yes that makes mes sad that Jack came undone after the rescue.

[BumbleB]

I think I said this in my previous mega-post, but I definitely don't think Jack and Kate were time traveling. I think it's an alternate reality that was shown-- like a Desmond vision. It's what happens to Jack and Kate after they get off the island, but it could also be prevented/corrected by something that happens in future episodes.



I like this theory Rosebud! I agree, they were in the future - time will tell if it is a future they can change or not.

Anyone think the "he" Kate was referring to was BEN? I just had a sinking creepy feeling when she said that.

I LOVED this epsiode, but there was way too much to take in. Feel like I need to watch it a few more times. I do not think Naomi and her people are there to help.

The way the show is weaving everyone together, I'm starting to get to the point where I can't picture them all living without each other off the island. Loved Hurley rescuing everyone and Charlie and Desmond were great, but I was pissed that Charlie didn't swim out - knew he wouldn't, but still. :(

I still want to know why EVERYONE listens to BEN? With the exception it seemed of the guys the losties killed on the beach - Why don't people question him? Is it possible that Jack or Locke will have that kind of power over the group of Losties at some point in the future? Will they always be fighting BEN - I think someone just needs to kill him, but then we wouldn't have the mystery we have now. :rolleyes:

[PG-rated]

That exchange between Danielle & Alex was great. "Alex, this is your mother."
"Will you help me tie him up?" :p I still don't think Ben is really Alex's father. Either he adopted her (after stealing her from Danielle), or Danielle was inseminated with Ben's sperm.!
They've established that Danielle was pregnant when she crashed on the island, and Ben stole her and raised her as his own. He's definitely not her biological father.

Why didn't Charlie swim out of the hole? It looked big enough for him to fit through. Or why didn't he run out of the room and close the door behind him?
I was actually really angry about Charlie's death because I thought he could've done either of those things. Although I did think it was a terrific moment when he saw Mikhail outside the porthole and we could see him accept his "fate" right then.

When the Lostees are rescued, they are brought back to the "Present Day." That would explain why things that you thought have already happened, such as Jack's dad being dead, are seemingly not true - because they have not happened yet as of the time that Kate and Jack are talking. They're discussing "going back" because the island's events are in their past, but not in the world's past. " -- by poster JGlostee
This doesn't make any sense, because Jack's father died in the "Present Day" timeline, before they got to the island. So if they went into the future and come back at the same time they left, they'd be in the exact same situations they were in before they got on the plane.

I think I said this in my previous mega-post, but I definitely don't think Jack and Kate were time traveling. I think it's an alternate reality that was shown-- like a Desmond vision. It's what happens to Jack and Kate after they get off the island, but it could also be prevented/corrected by something that happens in future episodes.

Also, I don't believe all the Losties will leave the island. I think it will come down to a big choice of who wants to go and who wants to stay. Locke and Jack will be in different camps, of course.

And I still don't think the people on Naomi's boat are the rescuers. I think they're bad & possibly after Claire & Aaron. (Also mentioned this before, I think).
I agree with all these theories.

Other thoughts:
- I was jumping up and down and cheering when Hurley showed up in the van. And way to tie in that episode that everyone kept complaining was just filler!
- Don't forget that the coffin that held Jack's father was found empty, so I think it's entirely possible that Jack's father might not be dead after all. We still never found out what Ben meant when he told Locke about the "magic box" that was the cause of his father showing up.

[mel7dog]

So, I was on TMZ.com looking at the celebrity packages slide show, and look what I found. The tagline said "Dominic Monaghan's Not So Little Hobbit".

It's tagged, so clicky, clicky...http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a334/cocoa_femme/dominicmonaghansnotsolittlehobbit.jpg

LOL! Ahhh now I seel why Evengeline is dating him ;)

[meatpie]

I also thought it was a brief glimpse of what could be...but of course the father comment...and Jack was just so sad it tore my heart out watching him like that. I thought the acting was very good, by the way.

Locke - I think he honestly believes it is his destiny to live there and to keep everyone there. That if they leave, as soneone else said, they will all go to lives they hate - he'll lose the ability to walk again, etc. Kate was not looking happy, and Jack was about to jump off a bridge.

Interesting questions - who was dead (Ben, Locke), and who is Kate rushing to get back to. Is Jack's father really dead, and will Charlie swim out the man hole?

[yby1]

- Don't forget that the coffin that held Jack's father was found empty, so I think it's entirely possible that Jack's father might not be dead after all. We still never found out what Ben meant when he told Locke about the "magic box" that was the cause of his father showing up.

I believe in a recent podcast, the LOST writers said that Christian was dead, dead, dead.

[Rancid13]

I still want to know why EVERYONE listens to BEN? With the exception it seemed of the guys the losties killed on the beach - Why don't people question him? Is it possible that Jack or Locke will have that kind of power over the group of Losties at some point in the future? Will they always be fighting BEN - I think someone just needs to kill him, but then we wouldn't have the mystery we have now. :rolleyes:

You could tell in last night's epi that Ben's people were really starting to doubt him by the looks they were giving each other as he was throwing out orders (and by the Others on the beach NOT killing Sayid, Jin and Bernard as instructed by Ben). Seems as if they know something is up with him (the beach guys said something like "Ben's losing it") and aren't too sure that he's to be trusted.

[heather1029]

LOL! Ahhh now I seel why Evengeline is dating him ;)

Bwahahahaha!:D

[Rose]

No surprise to the parallels to Alias since JJ Abrams is one of the producers and he originally manned the show in season one (that's before Tommy Cruise hijacked him for MI3 damn you Tommy).

Oh I know. That's why I said I guess they stole the idea from themselves, meaning the producers.

The Alice in Wonderland theme is another parallel.

[PG-rated]

I believe in a recent podcast, the LOST writers said that Christian was dead, dead, dead.
Interesting...in an earlier podcast or interview (I can't remember which), they said it was definitely significant that the coffin was found empty, and wouldn't rule out the idea that he was still alive.

[yby1]

They obviously like to confuse the heck out of people. ;)

[chefker]

They obviously like to confuse the heck out of people. ;)


No kidding! My brain's turned to mush reading various theories on different boards now. ;)

With all the time travel/alternate dimension talk, I totally feel like re-reading an old favorite - A Wrinkle in Time by Madeline L'Engle.

[villanelle75]

You could tell in last night's epi that Ben's people were really starting to doubt him by the looks they were giving each other as he was throwing out orders (and by the Others on the beach NOT killing Sayid, Jin and Bernard as instructed by Ben). Seems as if they know something is up with him (the beach guys said something like "Ben's losing it") and aren't too sure that he's to be trusted.


Actually, the guys on the beach said that they were following Ben's orders by NOT killing the 3 Losties. Presumably, this means it was pre-arranged with Ben. But th big guy, whose name escapes me, said that they should have disobeyed Ben and shot them, rather than firing into the sand, which is what Ben had ordered. So there is definitely dissension among the Others. I wonder if Locke will soon take over as the leader, especially now that he is back and can tell them that he heard Jacob and the Ben shot him.

[ajb524]

Some pics from the "lost easter eggs" page
http://losteastereggs.blogspot.com/

[villanelle75]

Was Christian dead, only to be regenerated on the Islasnd, much like Pathcy or Locke?

[villanelle75]

Has anyone commented yet on the funeral parlor anagram? "Flash Forward" (Hoffs Drawlar)

[villanelle75]

I just realized that I forgot to ask about the first minutes of the show. My Tivo kicked in late and bearded-Jack was driving in his car. IT was before the opening title so I know I didn't miss much, but did anything happen in the first minute or so?

[chefker]

OK, now I'm on a Madeleine L'Engle tangent - I think there are some parallels from her Wrinkle in Time series, to Lost. I'll just post synopses of each book, tell me what y'all think, or if I'm just 'seeing' things.


all quotes from Publisher's Weekly:


A Wrinkle in Time

Everyone in town thinks Meg Murry is volatile and dull-witted, and that her younger brother, Charles Wallace, is dumb. People are also saying that their physicist father has run off and left their brilliant scientist mother. Spurred on by these rumors and an unearthly stranger, the tesseract-touting Mrs Whatsit, Meg and Charles Wallace and their new friend Calvin O'Keefe embark on a perilous quest through space to find their father. In doing so, they must travel behind the shadow of an evil power that is darkening the cosmos, one planet at a time. This is no superhero tale, nor is it science fiction, although it shares elements of both. The travelers must rely on their individual and collective strengths, delving deep within themselves to find answers.
A well-loved classic and 1963 Newbery Medal winner, Madeleine L'Engle's A Wrinkle in Time is sophisticated in concept yet warm in tone, with mystery and love coursing through its pages. Meg's shattering, yet ultimately freeing, discovery that her father is not omnipotent provides a satisfying coming-of-age element. Readers will feel a sense of power as they travel with these three children, challenging concepts of time, space, and the triumph of good over evil.



A Swiftly Tilting Planet

Fifteen-year-old Charles Wallace Murry, whom readers first met in A Wrinkle in Time, has a little task he must accomplish. In 24 hours, a mad dictator will destroy the universe by declaring nuclear war--unless Charles Wallace can go back in time to change one of the many Might-Have-Beens in history. In an intricately layered and suspenseful journey through time, this extraordinary young man psychically enters four different people from other eras. As he perceives through their eyes "what might have been," he begins to comprehend the cosmic significance and consequences of every living creature's actions. As he witnesses first-hand the transformation of civilization from peaceful to warring times, his very existence is threatened, but the alternative is far worse.


Many Waters

We've all done it. In the frigid depths of winter we've wished we could be magically transported to someplace warm and sunny. But most people don't have genius parents who just happen to be working on a scientific experiment with time travel at the moment of our wish. Sandy and Dennys Murry, the "normal" boys in a family of geniuses, suddenly find themselves trudging through a blazing-hot desert, seeking a far-off oasis for shade. Their desperate wandering brings them face-to-face with history--biblical history. Soon they're feeling right at home with Noah and his family. Even so, the urgent question is, how will Sandy and Dennys get back to their own place and time before the floods--the many waters--come? As they begin to cross the invisible border into adulthood, the twins must confront their ability to resist temptation and embrace integrity.

[BSBC]

I wonder if the Losties are supposed to be there to replace the 40 Dharma people Ben killed in an earlier episode? The way Ben said "I've killed 40 of my own people" and the fact that the show has alluded to the number of survivors really makes me wonder if there is a connection.

I'm wondering if it is either Walt or Michael in the coffin. Walt's backstory seems to be one of bad things happening to a person. If the flash-forward is only a few years into the future, Walt might not be full-grown. And you don't know if there is some future animosity between Walt and the rest of the survivors. Michael was a construction worker, so it could always be him.

I also get the feeling that Juliette could be someone sinister. We just don't know. We know she wants off, but maybe Ben isn't the horror master he is portrayed to be. Juliette has definitely spun things through her story arc on the island, so anything is possible.

I think the island definitely gives people the power to stop aging. That other guy Richard (the one who recruited Juliette) has been in flashbacks going back to the 60s/early 70s and he looks exactly the same.

It was just a well-done episode. My husband and I were thinking about not watching it next year, but it has me hooked in. I just hope next season is a lot better than this past season.

[sparkle&shine]

So yesterday before the episode I heard an interview with 'Ben' on the radio. He was talking about how Ben might not be the bad one as he has said all along and that there are maybe people out there that are truly bad.

So I am thinking that Ben was finally telling the truth that the people on the boat really are bad and just want the island for their use.

I did not read any spoilers so I was really surprised about the flash 'forward'. I kept trying to figure out when this could have happened ;) The phone didn't even catch my eye. I was wondering who was in the coffin and who Kate's 'he' is.

I was pissed at Charlie since he could have freaking swam out the window or opened the door and then closed it. It's not like the window was so huge the water was unstoppable at first. Oh well his story was kind of done anyway. I hope that Claire finds the ring. It will be so sad when she finds out Charlie didn't make it.

Next season should be interesting!!

[pocket]

I think maybe they time-traveled to a few days before the crash, and were able to alter the future. But, altering the future didn't work out the way they thought it would (what with Jack wanting to kill himself and all).


You are a genius! I am sure you are right about this.

[udsweetpea]

Ben mentioned that the people on Naomi's ship will kill all living people on the island, as if there were dead people or ghosts on the island. Hmmm.

[yby1]

Originally Posted by heather1029
I think maybe they time-traveled to a few days before the crash, and were able to alter the future. But, altering the future didn't work out the way they thought it would (what with Jack wanting to kill himself and all).

It's possible since Jack told Kate that he was sick of lying. Seemed like they were privy to something the outside world wasn't aware of.

[Jenyfer9]

It's possible since Jack told Kate that he was sick of lying. Seemed like they were privy to something the outside world wasn't aware of.

I'll have to rewatch, because I totally missed that! I KNEW I taped this (no, we don't have Tivo) for a reason! ;)

[chefker]

It's possible since Jack told Kate that he was sick of lying. Seemed like they were privy to something the outside world wasn't aware of.


Good point. And, if they indeed altered the future, it at least worked out for Kate - she wasn't running from the law anymore.

[chandy]

When the new doctor made the comment that he knew Jack's wife left him for another man, I think that meant that Jack and Kate got married after rescue, but then Kate left him for Sawyer.

[villanelle75]

I think the comment about Jack's wife leaving for another man was referring to his first wife, the one who showed up pregnant in the ER and who he met when he fixed her paralysis. We already know she left Jack for another man.

When did Jack say he was sick of lying?

[yby1]

I think the comment about Jack's wife leaving for another man was referring to his first wife, the one who showed up pregnant in the ER and who he met when he fixed her paralysis. We already know she left Jack for another man.

When did Jack say he was sick of lying?

That last segment when he was talking to Kate and said that they needed to go back. He said ''I'm sick of lying. We made a mistake!''

[chefker]

That last segment when he was talking to Kate and said that they needed to go back. He said ''I'm sick of lying. We made a mistake!''

Whoa - do y'all think maybe Ben is right after all? The character is so deliciously evil though, that it's natural to WANT him to be 'the bad guy.' ;)

That alone could drive Jack to thinking of suicide - realizing Ben was right all along, and if he does end up killing Ben, like he's vowed to do once they're rescued....holy mindscrew for Jack!

[claribella]

Question...did I not hear Jack say "Penny...I just read...." when he called mystery person about the death he read in the paper?
Was I hearing things...?I'm gonna check abc7.com and watch it again right now

[tippy]

Whoa - do y'all think maybe Ben is right after all? The character is so deliciously evil though, that it's natural to WANT him to be 'the bad guy.' ;)

That alone could drive Jack to thinking of suicide - realizing Ben was right all along, and if he does end up killing Ben, like he's vowed to do once they're rescued....holy mindscrew for Jack!

the more i think about it, the more i think that ben/locke were right. i think that in addition to not wanting to get off the island, they didn't want the island found period. b/c whoever was looking for it was "bad" in some way (either they want to take over the island or kill everyone, etc).

i still don't think that michael or walt was in coffin. from the screen-shot of the article, it looks like it is someone who's name begins with a J, and who's last name ends in ...antham.

i have been so unproductive all day - i just can't concentrate on anything else but last night's epi :o

[villanelle75]

Question...did I not hear Jack say "Penny...I just read...." when he called mystery person about the death he read in the paper?
Was I hearing things...?I'm gonna check abc7.com and watch it again right now


Off the top of my head, I remember him saying, "It's me. I just read..."

[heather1029]

You are a genius! I am sure you are right about this.

I dunno now; I'm rethinking it. I can't fit the "golden tickets" into the equation.

[mel7dog]

I still don't understand how Kate could be free in the future. Even if there was some time travel invloved, she had been on the run for a while.

[claribella]

ok scratch what I just said...he said "hey it's me"...sorry

[udsweetpea]

I'm thinking the people who were after Kate weren't really US Marshalls, and that's why she's free now. Who knows.

[heather1029]

I'm thinking the people who were after Kate weren't really US Marshalls, and that's why she's free now. Who knows.

That would definitely explain why they (or especially that one dude) were so passionate about finding her.

[villanelle75]

I think the crash had happened in the flash forward. Kate mentioned that Jack was still pulling people out of wreckage, or something like that. I suppose that could have been a reference to the life on the island which had happened in their realities, but not in a linear time reality where they had gone back and undone the crash. But that seems weird.

And I don't know that he would say he wanted to "go back" if they had made it so they were never on the island, even though Kate and Jack would still have the memories of what happened in the alternate time. I would think you would say you wanted to "undo it" or something like that.

Also, the "golden ticket" would seem to be something that they got as crash survivors, though I suppose if they did something to avert the crash of a plane, the airline might give them a golden ticket for being a hero.

Oh, and I guess that could make sense, now that i think about it. In the episode, there were several references to Jack being a 2 time hero, so maybe the first time was somehow preventing a plane crash, rather than a reference to island life or escape.

I like the idea that they time traveled and changed the future. Jack's misery, as well as the possible suicide of the person in the coffin, seem to fit with the show's possible themes of fate and destiny. If he messed with reality and time to make the crash un-happen, that screwed with his destiny and fate, so things in his world are imbalanced and inharmonious. I really like this idea, but it seems to not completely mesh with a few details from last night.

Crap, now i don't' know what to think!!!

[villanelle75]

Maybe instead of fate and destiny, the show is really exploring themes of causality vs. contingency. There seem to be so many references to and explorations of people's will and the role that plays in all things. Even last night, Locke couldn't move his legs, until he thought that he could, and then they worked. He made them work =>causality. One event led to another. He had the ability to cause them to work. He may think it is the island's healing powers, but maybe the island doesn't heal, it just helps you get what you want, if you want it enough--it amplifies will and strengthens causality. Kate and Sawyer's romance... you could say that the Others caused that, by dressing her up in a sundress, putting them in adjoining cages with no one else to turn to, subjecting them to hard labor and emotional torture together, etc. Causality. They weren't meant to be lovers (in fact, maybe she would have ended up with Jack, if things had been left alone) but the Other's created love where it didn't exist, not with magic, but with simple cause and effect. Charlie ended up dying not because it was his fate, but because he thought it was his fate, so he chose to volunteer for the mission. He even chose to shut himself in, rather than try to escape and shut the door behind him. His choices killed him, not his fate,and not some random confluence of events. Did the Other's or Dharma cause the Losties to be on the plane, or were these people randomly thrown into an experience? There are SO many questions of causality vs. contingency if you look.

[heather1029]

Also, the "golden ticket" would seem to be something that they got as crash survivors, though I suppose if they did something to avert the crash of a plane, the airline might give them a golden ticket for being a hero.

Oh, and I guess that could make sense, now that i think about it. In the episode, there were several references to Jack being a 2 time hero, so maybe the first time was somehow preventing a plane crash, rather than a reference to island life or escape.



I'm really liking your thinking!

[tippy]

Maybe instead of fate and destiny, the show is really exploring themes of causality vs. contingency. There seem to be so many references to and explorations of people's will and the role that plays in all things. Even last night, Locke couldn't move his legs, until he thought that he could, and then they worked. He made them work =>causality. One event led to another. He had the ability to cause them to work. He may think it is the island's healing powers, but maybe the island doesn't heal, it just helps you get what you want, if you want it enough--it amplifies will and strengthens causality. Kate and Sawyer's romance... you could say that the Others caused that, by dressing her up in a sundress, putting them in adjoining cages with no one else to turn to, subjecting them to hard labor and emotional torture together, etc. Causality. They weren't meant to be lovers (in fact, maybe she would have ended up with Jack, if things had been left alone) but the Other's created love where it didn't exist, not with magic, but with simple cause and effect. Charlie ended up dying not because it was his fate, but because he thought it was his fate, so he chose to volunteer for the mission. He even chose to shut himself in, rather than try to escape and shut the door behind him. His choices killed him, not his fate,and not some random confluence of events. Did the Other's or Dharma cause the Losties to be on the plane, or were these people randomly thrown into an experience? There or SO many questions of causality vs. contingency if you look.

wow, that's really intriguing (sp?)! i never thought about it this indepth. good point.

[yby1]

Maybe instead of fate and destiny, the show is really exploring themes of causality vs. contingency. There seem to be so many references to and explorations of people's will and the role that plays in all things. Even last night, Locke couldn't move his legs, until he thought that he could, and then they worked. He made them work =>causality. One event led to another. He had the ability to cause them to work. He may think it is the island's healing powers, but maybe the island doesn't heal, it just helps you get what you want, if you want it enough--it amplifies will and strengthens causality. Kate and Sawyer's romance... you could say that the Others caused that, by dressing her up in a sundress, putting them in adjoining cages with no one else to turn to, subjecting them to hard labor and emotional torture together, etc. Causality. They weren't meant to be lovers (in fact, maybe she would have ended up with Jack, if things had been left alone) but the Other's created love where it didn't exist, not with magic, but with simple cause and effect. Charlie ended up dying not because it was his fate, but because he thought it was his fate, so he chose to volunteer for the mission. He even chose to shut himself in, rather than try to escape and shut the door behind him. His choices killed him, not his fate,and not some random confluence of events. Did the Other's or Dharma cause the Losties to be on the plane, or were these people randomly thrown into an experience? There are SO many questions of causality vs. contingency if you look.

Great post! This is something to really consider.

[c'est la vie]

I think maybe they time-traveled to a few days before the crash, and were able to alter the future. But, altering the future didn't work out the way they thought it would (what with Jack wanting to kill himself and all).
Very Butterfly Effect-like.

And I don't know that he would say he wanted to "go back" if they had made it so they were never on the island, even though Kate and Jack would still have the memories of what happened in the alternate time. I would think you would say you wanted to "undo it" or something like that.
They do want us to think that they were rescued. But wouldn't that be too easy of an assumption?

[chefker]

They do want us to think that they were rescued. But wouldn't that be too easy of an assumption?


I really don't think they'll be rescued (well, maybe not until the final season). If they move the action off the island, the show is pretty much over - I mean, the island itself is really the biggest 'character' in the storyline.

I do think that Locke is going to do something to thwart this rescue, in next season's opener.

villanelle75 - I like your thoughts regarding causality vs. contingency! Ah, I love watching a show that makes me THINK for once. :)

[villanelle75]

I don't think they were rescued. If this is the future (as opposed to an alternate future created when the plane crash was prevented), I think maybe Kate and Jack (and maybe more) get off the island, but that many of the rest of them don't'. That would explain why Jack wants to go back. just like Kate went back for him when the Other's had him, he now wants to go back to the island to see if he can help the rest of the castaways who are still there. Before I started considering time travel and other more out there possibilities, my initial thought was that he and Kate got home but other people didn't and Jack was racked by guilt, feeling like he should try to go back and help them, but not knowing how to get back.

Maybe it is an older Aaron in the coffin? It seemed large to be for someone who would probably only be a few years old in the near future. But since Desmond's vision saw Aaron and Claire being rescued, maybe they got off the island, along with Claire and Jack. The visions that the psychic had when Claire was pregnant suggest that maybe Aaron is capable of very bad things. That could somehow explain why he wasn't a "friend or family" and why Kate bristled at the notion that she would attend his funeral. Could he have done something, even as a baby (maybe a baby with strong powers?) that allowed only a few of the Castaways to be rescued, leaving the others? And "now" (time travel is so confusing!!) Jack wants to go back to help them. That too, is a recurring theme, I guess--one or a few Losties "going back" and endangering themselves in order to help out their peers and leave them behind.

Other than the phone style which suggests last night's flash forward wasn't too far into the future, do we have any other clues about when it was and how old Aaron would be?

[villanelle75]

What is Claire's last name? Do we know anything about the father of her baby? I can't remember if we've met him.

[yby1]

I don't think it was Aaron for the same reason I don't think it was Walt. The obit said that the body was the of a man, not a boy. Speculation on the lost eastereggs site is that the name on the obit is Jeremy Bentham - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jeremy_Bentham

I do think that Aaron has a similar ability to Walt though.

[pocket]

Gotta love the internet. the text of the obituary reads: "The body of John Lantham of New York was found shortly after 4 am in the 4300 block of Grand Avenue. Ted Worden, a doorman at the Tower Lofts complex, heard loud noises coming from the victim's loft. Concerned for tenants' safety, he entered the loft and found the body hanging from a beam in the living room. According to Jaime Ortiz, a police spokesman, the incident was deemed a suicide after medical tests. Latham (sic) is survived by one teenaged son. Memorial services will be held at the Hoffs-Drawlar Funeral Home tomorrow evening."

So my money is on Michael, with a changed name and Walt is already back on the island.

[yby1]

Claire's last name is Littleton - http://www.lostpedia.com/wiki/Claire

Here is Claire's baby daddy - http://www.lostpedia.com/wiki/Thomas

[pocket]

I do think they were rescued. My thoughts on last night's S3 finale

Jackforward:

I was accidentally spoiled on the final scene of this epi, so I did know it was a Jackforward instead of a Jackback, but as it turned out, it didn’t matter because you could tell from the cellphone in the first scene that it was at least 2006. So I agonized for nothing. Surprisingly, I really loved Matthew Fox in this epi! He was great – completely drug-addled, drunk and raving. His apartment is in bad shape and so is he – clearly from the reactions of everyone who encountered him he’s been like this for a while now. His pregnant ex is still his emergency contact. He is calling, calling, calling Kate on the phone, and she doesn’t want to see him. He is using the golden pass from Oceanic Air to fly back and forth over the Island every weekend drinking and hoping to crash. So they must have come home to a certain amount of fanfare, and something must have involved lying because Jack wants to stop lying. He refers to his father in the present tense, but my instinct is that he is just really messed up. What could have possibly happened to make him so despondent?

I don’t know who was in that coffin, but if it’s someone we already know, I say it’s Michael with a fake name (you can see that the obit is for Jo______ ___ntham, that he is from NY, died in a fire in LA) and Kate is incredulous that Jack would think she would want to go. If it’s someone we don’t already know, I like the theory that his name is Jeremy Bentham , another philosopher who came up with the Panopticon – reference the whispers here. If the obit guy has a fake name, that could also explain why Kate is free. The people who rescued them give Kate a new identity and also give one to whoever is in the coffin.

Since the flashes and the realtime action are linked thematically, and since he is called a hero several times during the epi, it must be that his heroism had very bad results indeed. Jack in this epi leads his people to rescue overcoming obstacles on the way but triumphing over the Others in the end. Lots of Exodus references in here including that stinky little liar Naomi asking him what he did before he became Moses. Bitch. This was the culmination of the entire season’s conflict with the Others and the Losties won. Richard is leading the Others to the Temple. Where/whatever that is.

[yby1]

Gotta love the internet. the text of the obituary reads: "The body of John Lantham of New York was found shortly after 4 am in the 4300 block of Grand Avenue. Ted Worden, a doorman at the Tower Lofts complex, heard loud noises coming from the victim's loft. Concerned for tenants' safety, he entered the loft and found the body hanging from a beam in the living room. According to Jaime Ortiz, a police spokesman, the incident was deemed a suicide after medical tests. Latham (sic) is survived by one teenaged son. Memorial services will be held at the Hoffs-Drawlar Funeral Home tomorrow evening."

So my money is on Michael, with a changed name and Walt is already back on the island.

Where did you find that?? :) It does sound like Micheal.

[pocket]

The Others:

We really wrapped that storyline last night, didn’t we? For the past 3 seasons these mysterious Others have been tormenting the Losties for no understandable reason. Last night we learned so much about Ben and his motivations that I am still rolling through it. Most importantly, there’s a diary and I saw a clear screenshot of the page, so somewhere out there, someone with better equipment that you or I will ever have is sharpening up a screenshot and soon we will know what Ben writes in his diary.

Dear Diary,

Today while looking for my dead mother I met an immortal eyeliner pirate in the woods. Mmmm..these Apollo Bars are delicious! I wish I could kill my father.

GTG,
Benry

Though I think Ben is a violent sociopath with paranormal powers, I also think he is telling the truth about the Freighter Folk who are coming to the Island. I think those people are dangerous simply because Naomi lied about who she was and her connection with them. I think that they are going to be the new bad guys and that the Losties and the remaining Others will join together to oppose them. But why? And what is so terrible about them? How do they threaten the Island and why are they a worse threat to the island than anything it has faced in a long time? My guess is that the timeline of the island overlaps with The Lost Experience and that the ship waiting off the Island is the Helgus Antonius designed for Hanso by Paik Industries. We know from TLE the the Helgus Antonius was heading to a mysterious island. We know that they aren’t doing a second TLE. Maybe that’s because the timelines are about to converge.

[villanelle75]

Thanks, Pocket!

That's makes sense. It also makes sense because Kate and Jack would feel some annimosity towards Michael, thsu their reactions to the funeral. He sold them out and left them on the island. And he killed himself, which is what Jack was about to do because maybe Jack felt like he'd done the same thing to the other Losties as well by leaving them behind.

Is it February yet!?!?!?!

[pocket]

Where did you find that?? :) It does sound like Micheal.

A guy on The Fuselage called someone he knows on the set and he read him the obit. It must not be intended to be a secret. More likely it's an Easter Egg for us to find.

The quadrangle:

I’d like to point out that my longed for make-out scene with Jack and Sawyer got a shoutout –

Sawyer: So you had sex with the Doc yet?
Juliet: No, have you?

Jack and Juliet kiss – very sweet – and he tells Kate that he loves her but in the context of encouraging her to be with Sawyer. True. Sawyer is the right guy for her, not Jack. Sawyer was a huge dick to Kate – withdrawn and distant and flat out mean, trying to hurt her and push her away. But one of the things I’ve loved about them is seeing these two emotionally damaged people trying to deal with their unexpected feelings for each other. I wonder if Kate is really pregnant. Wouldn’t you ask Juliet to give you an abortion if you were pregnant? I would.

[pocket]

Beach Battle Babylon:

Sayid, Jin and Bernard blow up most of the Others and then are taken captive. Bernard sings like a bird and tells the Others the whole plan. Ben arranges for Pryce to pretend to shoot them to pressure Jack to give up the sat-phone. Jack refuses. But then it turns out that they aren’t dead and then Hurley shows up in the van and saves the day. Go Hurley! Sawyer shoots Tom who totally had it coming, and Sayid kills a guy with his legs. Very cool.

Farewell sweet hobbit!

The Road goes ever on and on
Down from the door where it began
Now far ahead the Road has gone,
And I must follow, if I can,
Pursuing it with eager feet,
Until it joins some larger way
Where many paths and errands meet.
And whither then? I cannot say.

The Road goes ever on and on
Out from the door where it began
Now far ahead the Road has gone,
Let others follow it who can!
Let them a journey new begin!
But I at last with weary feet
Will turn towards the lighted inn,
My evening-rest and sleep to meet.

-- J R R Tolkien

It was sad to see Charlie go, but he was a hero in the end. Did you notice how Aaron started crying when Charlie died? Little Turniphead is strong in the force! I’m worried that Charlie’s sacrifice was all in vain. If these people are really the baddies, then how is he a hero? Isn’t he their destruction? Mikahil is obviously also an immortal pirate. Greta and Bonnie aren’t pirates, they are Others. I guess the Looking Glass isn't my time portal to Portland. But it's around here somewhere, I'm telling you.

The Special Ones:

John Locke rose from the grave at Walt’s bidding. Walt looked like he had aged a lot – maybe he’s been off the island for while and came back through the time portal. Okay, there probably isn’t really a time portal. But it would be cool if there was one! I wonder if it was really him…if it were smokie then he would have appeared as he did on the Island. So my guess is that it was the real Walt and that somehow he came back in time. I don’t know how though. Maybe he is the one who helps Jackand Kate get back.


Questions:

How long have they been back from the island?
Who is in the coffin?
Why does Jack want to go back to the island?
Why doesn’t Kate want to go back?
Who is she with that (understandably) doesn’t want her so see Jack?
Why isn’t Kate in jail?
Is Jack’s father alive? How can this be? We have been assured about a million times that Christian Shepherd is dead.
Where did Walt come from and why is he so old?


I know, I know, I know. I'm a massive huge dork. I just love this show so much!

[southerner]

I knew it was a flash forward b/c of the beard. We'd never seen him with a beard, as a drunk, or addicted to pills. He just looked to old and weathered for it to be a flash back.

[pocket]

That's makes sense. It also makes sense because Kate and Jack would feel some annimosity towards Michael, thsu their reactions to the funeral. He sold them out and left them on the island. And he killed himself, which is what Jack was about to do because maybe Jack felt like he'd done the same thing to the other Losties as well by leaving them behind.

Exactly! Of everyone we know other than Others, Kate would not want to go to Michael's funeral. Jack would be more sympathetic. Also, I really think that was the real actual Walt on the Island but 3 years older. When they go back to the Island they will find that not as much time has passed as they expect.

[chefker]

I knew it was a flash forward b/c of the beard. We'd never seen him with a beard, as a drunk, or addicted to pills. He just looked to old and weathered for it to be a flash back.


Yup yup. They totally made him up to look like Jim Morrison: The Paris Years. ;) Seriously though, he DID look like a strung out celebrity.

Ironic though that he'd turn to the same vice - alcohol - that ruined his father's career & life. What happens to make Jack turn to booze?

[whos that girl]

"Walt" *cough* Jacob *cough* sure grew a hell of a lot older in 90 days.

[Linnybubbles]

-I would be shocked if it was Michael in the coffin, only because the actor who played him did not want to come back for the season finale, and I am pretty sure he does not want to do the show again.


-What if the "he" that Kate is referring to is Ben or somebody else from the Island? I think it would be way too obvious to be Sawyer, plus Kate seemed kind of afraid of whomever she was talking about. Probably a ridiculous theory, but just throwing it out there, I don't actually believe it.

-Could Kate and Jack be the only ones who were rescued and Jack WAS actually responsible for the deaths of everyone else, which is why he is having such a hard time being back.

-What did Walt tell Locke that we did not see? There has to be more behind the reason for why Locke killed Naomi. And if it was just about being rescued, he could have shot the phone device.

-I still have so many questions! I have read many times that Aaron is going to be central to the show, so I know there is much more to learn. I was figuring that next season will be all flash forwards.

[Linnybubbles]

Oh, and I think Walt only aged because the actor playing him is older. I do not think there was anything else behind that!

[Jenyfer9]

Oh, and I think Walt only aged because the actor playing him is older. I do not think there was anything else behind that!
I agree with this 100%. I mean, they can't win... if they bring back Walt with a different actor playing him, people would be LIVID. If they bring him back and he's older (even though not much time has passed on the island), people are asking "why is Walt older?"

Duh.

[LoveandLaw]

I think maybe they time-traveled to a few days before the crash, and were able to alter the future. But, altering the future didn't work out the way they thought it would (what with Jack wanting to kill himself and all).

This theory has been thrown around a bit, but I'm not sure.

Didn't Jack say that the airline had given them free lifetime airline passes (impliedly because of the crash)? If they traveled back before the crash, presumably they would not have been on the flight (a 2nd time around, that is) and no free passes.

Am I making any sense?

[yby1]

Oh, and I think Walt only aged because the actor playing him is older. I do not think there was anything else behind that!

The writers stated that Walt's age would play a role in this series. So there will be something behind it.

[yby1]

This theory has been thrown around a bit, but I'm not sure.

Didn't Jack say that the airline had given them free lifetime airline passes (impliedly because of the crash)? If they traveled back before the crash, presumably they would not have been on the flight (a 2nd time around, that is) and no free passes.

Am I making any sense?

I don't think that the traveled to right before the crash, but the decisions that Jack made on the island had ramifications that altered his past.

[heather1029]

This theory has been thrown around a bit, but I'm not sure.

Didn't Jack say that the airline had given them free lifetime airline passes (impliedly because of the crash)? If they traveled back before the crash, presumably they would not have been on the flight (a 2nd time around, that is) and no free passes.

Am I making any sense?

Yeah, but villanelle came up with a good answer to this. See below:


Also, the "golden ticket" would seem to be something that they got as crash survivors, though I suppose if they did something to avert the crash of a plane, the airline might give them a golden ticket for being a hero.

Oh, and I guess that could make sense, now that i think about it. In the episode, there were several references to Jack being a 2 time hero, so maybe the first time was somehow preventing a plane crash, rather than a reference to island life or escape.

[MidwesternGal]

I'm not a fan of the time travel theories. There is just too much biblical/phisophical/healings/pyshcic powers stuff going on to throw time travel into the mix as well. If that is the case, I will be sorely disappointed. I think they can come up with something better than that to tie everything up together.

I too think it's Michael or Walt in the casket but think that the whole African American community surrounding the funeral home was just a little *too* pat--perhaps they are setting us up?

Ben, to me, may be a kind of Jekyll/Hyde character. With a screw or two or twenty loose.

I don't understand why the *original* "others" (ie, Richard and his cronies) follow Ben.

Next season should be quite interesting. I'm highly looking forward to it!!!

[stevesbabygirl]

think the crash had happened in the flash forward. Kate mentioned that Jack was still pulling people out of wreckage, or something like that. I suppose that could have been a reference to the life on the island which had happened in their realities, but not in a linear time reality where they had gone back and undone the crash. But that seems weird.

Oh, and I guess that could make sense, now that i think about it. In the episode, there were several references to Jack being a 2 time hero, so maybe the first time was somehow preventing a plane crash, rather than a reference to island life or escape.



I think these are both in reference to the car crash. He pulled the boy and his mother (hence a 2-time hero) from the car (hence the burning wreckage).

[J&K2003]

-Did anyone notice the couple behind Jack on the plane? It looked very much like Jin & Sun.


YES!! :eek: I thought I was going nuts, but I did see this too.

[pocket]

but they've already told us there is time travel. desmond traveled in time and so did jewelrey store woman/ms. hawking who is in the pic on the monk's desk. there is definitely time travel in lost.

[cocoa_femme]

Chefker, your avatar is hilarious!

[jen]

A guy on The Fuselage called someone he knows on the set and he read him the obit. It must not be intended to be a secret. More likely it's an Easter Egg for us to find.



Can you post where you found this info?

For the record, I guessed it