Wanna Learn Photography? [Archive]

Little Angel '77

07-13-2005, 05:01 AM

The other thread, although really cool, is more of a place to just post pretty pictures, I wanted to start a thread for those interested in actually learning photography and maybe down the road, doing something with it.

I am currently a professional photographer in Boston, and don't know it all and still have tons to learn, I learned so much over in the other pink world, that I wanted this thread to come back.

So a few rules,
1. Don't be intimidated... its scary but if you want to learn you have to jump in head first.
2. No question is a dumb question, so ask away!

OK, so lets start with a few definitions.

F-stop or Aperture - This is the number that controls the Depth of Field or DOF The blur on the photo, when you want part of your subject in focus you use a LARGE f-stop (or small number 2.8) They range from 1.4 to 32. If you want say flowers to be in focus and the background to blur, you would use 2.8. Everything depends on the light. You can't use 2.8 in bright blaring sun, or you need a shutter of 4000th of a second....
Shutter Speed- is the amount of time a shutter remains open to allow light to reach the digital camera sensor. Its measured in seconds, or fractions of a second
ISO/ASA- This is the speed of the film or digital sensor you are using. This ranges from 100-3200. The higher you go the more noise or grain you will get on your picture.

Those three elements are the key to great photographs. Photography is a great balencing act of light, shutter speed, ISO and F-Stop. You will always have to comprimise one, to get the picture you want- its a huge juggling act to keep it all straight all the time.

A few boards to gain more information:
www.photo.net

Some Labs
www.mpix.com

There are tons of resources to learn photography. One of the biggest hurtles of photography is learning what the heck an F-stop is, and how it relates to your picture.

Here is an example of Fstop- 5.6
http://www.digicamguides.com/images/photographs/depth_of_field/dof_f5_6.jpg
Here is the same picture with a SMALL aperture or LARGE number F32
http://www.digicamguides.com/images/photographs/depth_of_field/dof_f32.jpg

Now a lot of people say when you do formals, you HAVE to be shooting at F/5.6 becuase if you shoot at 2.8 with a very shallow, DOF your portrait won't be in focus.

OK, thats all for now. Ask away!

tlew12778

07-13-2005, 05:09 AM

Very cool thread. Thanks for starting this! I was trying to get my butt in gear to take a photography course but something always comes up that prevents me from diving in (I should also probably find the manual to my digital camera one of these day as I have no idea how to use the manual functions ;)). I'm definitely going to be following along!

keska

07-13-2005, 05:25 AM

This is a great thread. I had DH buy me a nice camera two years ago and I've never learned how to use it.

Little Angel '77

07-13-2005, 05:37 AM

tlew12778

07-13-2005, 05:41 AM

Yeah I know... I was thinking about getting a film Rebel as they're rather cheap compared to digitals but the cost of developing is so high here in Europe that I think I'd probably drag my feet about actually taking the film to be processed which would defeat the purpose ya'know?

skyblu

07-13-2005, 05:56 AM

Okay, I have no idea what you're saying :p but I have a simple question:

With my digital camera, if I take the flash off manually, I have to use a tripod or stand of some sort or else the longer shutter speed makes my photo all blurry.

Is there a way around that? I love natural light photos, but my camera seems to think that anything less than blinding sunshine requires a flash.

Thanks!

Little Angel '77

07-13-2005, 06:10 AM

The reson you are getting slow shutters is because you aren't getting enough light into the camera to get a proprer exposure. *You probably know that, but some people might not.* When you are shooting in a dark location, you need to have a long shutter in order for enough light to hit the film or the chip to have the picture expose properly.

So how do you get faster shutter speeds so you don't need a tripod? Well first, if you are shooting film, you can use 800 speed film. This allows film to be more sensative to light. On some digital cameras, you can raise the film speed or ISO, to make the camera chip or more sensative to light. At ISO 100 its not very sesative so you need slower shutter speeds in dark situations. On your camera I bet there is a setting to raise your ISO to 400 or even 800 or depending on the camera, you can go to 1600 or 3200.
Going to these higher ISO (film speed or chip sensativity) numbers, you are able to get faster shutter speeds, avoiding the camera shake.

If its super dark, you need to go to ISO 800, but by doing that, you will intordocue more digital noise or grain (if you are film) into the picture. Some people like that effect.

Does that help?

AKA Poohgirl

07-13-2005, 07:12 AM

Great thread Little Angel. ;) I'll be glad to help answer questions as well!

Thanks for starting this!

sourgrapes

07-13-2005, 07:45 AM

This is all very helpful info.

:)

Kimberland30

07-13-2005, 07:53 AM

Honestly I've been interested in Photography for a while. I don't have a camera (unless a 35MM counts), but I think I have an "eye" for good snapshots. I'd like to invest in a nice quality camera without breaking the bank. Could you offer suggestions? Nothing top of the line since I'm just fooling around right now, but something other than my generic camera would be nice. And price range...what an average for an average camera? Where would be the best place to take classes? A community college?

TIA, and sorry about all the questions!

Little Angel '77

07-13-2005, 08:03 AM

35 MM count! It takes film, you can change settings- right?

Ok, for camera suggestions, you can get a great deal on a fantastic Canon Rebel G on Ebay. I just sold my 300.00 camera on there for 23.99. No one buys film anymore.

You can also look at the Canon Rebel 2000 which was the next model up and has more focus points.

What you want to look for is all the manual settings, you don't want a point and shoot if you really want to get into it.

You can also get the Nikon F100 Used. If you have a couple lens for your camera already buy that brand.

If you want digital, a good digital SLR camera (Single Lens Reflex) The Canon 10D and the Nikon D2H are good and are coming down and price.

I would get a cheap film camera, learn and then think about going digital. I don't shoot film so I am not a lot of help, but I got started with the Canon Rebel G, with one lens.

My BEST suggestion for learning and getting into photography is to ASSIST!
Find a photographer whose work you love, explain you really want to learn, but can't afford school etc.

There is so much more to learn about photography other than just the settings. You have to learn how to deal with people. The people end of it, is SO important, if you can't interact but take great pictures, you will only get so far.

You can take classes, but readding and assisting will be so much more beneficial. Not to say school isn't helpful, but You can learn everything by sjust talking to other photographers and helping. I assist a couple photographers and belong to great message boards. I have learned so much just chatting and with people. I also attended WPPI in Vegas last april and learned so much that way.

greenbunny

07-13-2005, 08:11 AM

I definitely want to use digital, not film. Our camera was very high-end when we bought it about five years ago. Now I want a new one, it doesn't meet my needs anymore.

My biggest complaint is reaction time. When I press the button, this camera takes several seconds to respond and actually take the *$@*$! picture. Often whatever I was aiming for is gone or over by then. I really like shooting wildlife and they just aren't going to pose no matter how much I plead.

I also want a camera that will work with lenses for zooming and fancy effects. My current one allows no attachments.

Are any of the models you listed specifically good with reaction time?

Little Angel '77

07-13-2005, 08:25 AM

What type of camera do you currently have (brand, Make)

As for the shutter lag time, it sounds to me as though you have a P&S and not an SLR. Its a comman complaint from most P&S digital users - with regards to lag time.

When you buy a Point and shoot its not designed for multiple shutter releases that a pro would need. For multiple, fast shutter release - you would need a digital SLR. I am not all that firmilar with lower price models, but I know they exist. Canon Sells some in the 200-300 range, but if your going to spend money- spend it right. Make sure to get a camera that you are not going to outgrow in a year. That once you understand the basics, you won't need the next model up for resolution and speed. (card writing speed and shutter speed.)

I'll poke around and see what I can find. Check out ritz for a higher end, lower cost SLR digital. The Rebel Series is good. Great to start off with.

You should spend between 200-500 on a camera if you seriously want to get into it, with the knowlege that once you are better you are going to need a faster more expensive camera. You have to start some where. I started with the Rebel G. It was a 200 dollar camera.... I know own 2 Digital bodies, and a slew of lens.

Maybe Pooh girl can help with the film side of this. I am very much distanced from it.

greenbunny

07-13-2005, 11:38 AM

I had to call DH and check...we have an Olympus C3000. I don't mind paying for a decent camera, this one was about $700 plus all the odds and ends. I have heard that once you get into better equipment you spend more on the accessories than anything else.

Trillian

07-13-2005, 12:17 PM

I have the first model of the Canon Digital Rebel (not the new one that came out this year). I have had it for a couple of years now and am still very happy with it. I think you could probably get the model that I have for a LOT cheaper now than when I bought it, too. I'd bet a lot of people are selling their old models to upgrade to the newer one (which I think is only slightly better).

Kimberland30

07-13-2005, 12:49 PM

Thank you for the starting tips! I have a P&S (as you call it). I prefer the look of film, but know that a good quality digital and processing will produce *almost* the same thing. I'll be lookin' on Ebay for deals. Any excuse to be on Ebay.... :)

I know a friend who shoots for fun...and he's amazing. I'll have to find someone I can stalk to learn some basics. I learn faster IRL than text anyway.

mrsdrummer

07-13-2005, 01:11 PM

Ok, Here's some q's. I have a Minolta Maxxum5 film camera with just the lense it came with and the attached flash.

1.) I'm shooting a wedding for a friend in September, the wedding it's self is in a church and the reception is at a country club. Assuming we'll be able to get some shots outside what kind of flash do I need?

2.)Any tips for shooting outside?

3.)How do I know which flashes are compatable with my camera.

4)400sp or 800sp film?

skyblu

07-13-2005, 03:22 PM

Thanks, LittleAngel, for the ISO information. That should help!

AKA Poohgirl

07-13-2005, 03:43 PM

mrsdrummer - outside portrait photography can be tricky. If it's really sunny, you'll get harsh shadows. You just have to place your subject (bride and groom) at an angle where they are not facing into the sun, or facing away from the sun. I usually will place them with the sun hitting them from the side and slightly behind, then I use fill flash to help lighten up the shadows.

I use the lowest possible ISO when shooting outdoors. If it's bright sunny, I use 160, if it's overcast, or getting late in the afternoon, where the sun is casting a golden glow, then I'll use 400. You'll probably want to use 800 in the church if flash is not allowed, and if it's not allowed, you'll definitely need a tripod.

As for flash compatible with your camera, I don't know. I use a Canon system, and I have the Vivitar 283 flash, which is a workhorse, and may be compatible with Minolta. You might want to ask at your local photo shop to see.

I hope this helps!

Ummm

07-13-2005, 05:28 PM

hey i'm here :)

just want to say - don't get intimidated. if we want to become good photographers, we must learn to control the tool, and not let the tool control us :)

i still have much to learn, but i can be a very harsh critic... but only if you ask for it! :D so i guess if people want critique, state so when you post pictures, because sometimes some people just want to post pics to share, whereas others want to learn more from them... and i learn the most when people point things out that i don't often see... okay back on working on pics... will post some when i finish with them. i won't repost the ones i've already posted in the other thread...

Little Angel '77

07-13-2005, 07:20 PM

I hope we don't lose everyone with the move... :(
I liked being over in the chit chat thread :(

Little Angel '77

07-14-2005, 05:34 AM

Hmm, what do I use for formals in the church...
Well, honstly, not many people have wanted formals in the church. I have had a lot of interesting weddings. I had one at Fenway Park and one in an old barn, and so there has been better backgrounds than some of the churches.

If I were to shoot in a church, I would turn all the lights UP, go to ISO 400 or 800 and use flash. If the church is small enough to bounce, I will do that.
If not, I use direct flash.

twainny

07-14-2005, 08:47 AM

since no one answered my questions over on the other thread, I thought I would post it here.

QOTD- where do you get your film developed? Do you DIY in a darkroom or just take it somewhere?

I still can't decide if I want to get the 17-40 lens. Will it take good pictures in Alaska? I want something with more of a panoramic view than my standard lens, and I assume that the 17-40 will do it, but I don't want the fisheye effect for Alaska. I need to order it if I want it... I just can't decide. Or will the kit thing (adapter) work for that?

Also, what filters should I be using?

TIA

twainny

07-14-2005, 08:57 AM

little angel can anyone order from the website you posted on pg.1 (I still haven't done a wedding album and I would like to order one.)

Little Angel '77

07-14-2005, 09:05 AM

Honestly,
I would get the 17-40 MM lens. I am thinking about it myself. If you want great panaramic type stuff, nothing beats good glass! You need good glass.

Yes, having a good eye helps (ahem)
But you NEED good glass to get crisp amazing pictures. Good glass is why the pro's spend so much on lens, and minimal on cameras (well some... not all). You can have 100 dollar camera, and a 1200 dollar lens, and get probably better pictures than a 1200 dollar camera and a 100 lens.

As for anyone ordering from sites for wedding albums,
No, I believe the ones I listed are Professional Labs only and you need a FID number and a legit business.

There are sites that allow you to create albums on. PM and I'll see if I can come up with some.
Thanks!

Lindsan

07-14-2005, 09:09 AM

Great thread! I will most defenitely be reading along, trying to learn more (and secretly trying out stuff at home). :)

dpreview (www.dpreview.com) has a glossary (http://www.dpreview.com/learn/?/glossary) that I found helpful when I first started looking for info online. It might be basics for you pros, but it helped a complete amateur like me.

Little Angel '77

07-14-2005, 09:26 AM

Green Bunny
What lens?? What where your shutter and ypur aperture. Maybe you need to blur backgrounds more by closing down your f stop??

I think they look great! You might want to add contrast and that might make the image pop more.

greenbunny

07-14-2005, 09:40 AM

little angel, er...I don't have any lenses to attach to my camera, so I don't know what to tell you. Just whatever it came with, I guess.

I don't know anything about the other stuff, either. I know I hit the button with the little cloud because the little sun button was too harsh looking. I don't know what an f stop is, either. I think I changed the ISO to 400. These were sitting on the floor or else I would have used a tripod...I have naturally shaky hands.

I know I can't expect you to tell me how to take the picture better physically without me understanding this stuff. But I would like some advice just of how you "eye" the picture. They seem so trite to me. Is there some other way I should be organizing my subjects? Should I try taking the picture at a different angle?

I am glad that you like them. Maybe it's just that I have this hazy mental picture of how they should be, and it isn't matching up.

Little Angel '77

07-14-2005, 09:51 AM

Greenbunny! I am sorry!!! :)

Ok, well, first lets start with what kind of camera you have. Is it a small hand one or a big hunky black one? does the lense come off?

As for using the little cloud vs the sun, those are your automatic settings ( I know this might be very basic, but it will help explain something) The cloud is for use OUTDOORS. When there is no sun. Why should you only use it outdoors??? Because... its setting the white balence for the picture. Every camera can read the light color. believe it or not, there are shades of light. Its referred to as the Kelvin Temperature range here it is...
This is why your camera has those different pictures (believe it or not)
(Auto White Balance): automatically adjusts the white balance between 4,200 and 7,000k.

Incandescent: The color temperature of this setting is basically fixed at 3,000k.

Fluorescent: The setting is fixed at approximately 4,200k.

Direct Sun: Color temperature is fixed at approximately 5,200k (even though basic sunlight is 5,500k).

Flash: Its color temperature is set at approximately 5,400k (even though flash is 5,500k).

Cloudy: This setting is obviously for overcast light. Its color temperature is set at approximately 6,000 K.

Shade: The color temperature is set at approximately 7,000k in the D1 and 8,000k in the X/H.

Because you used the cloud setting, you told the camera that the light was coming from the sun, and it automatically adjusted the white tones of your picture, making them look "off" Do they not look correct to you? Now, I thought the color was the effect you were going for. Next time, try using the P or green box. It will automatically picked the light color adjustment for you. If i were you, I would have used the flower mode, which means portrait. Or the face mode. (each camera is different.) Now if you have OTHER settings on that dial, I would have put the camera on A, or Av (which stands for aperture priority. ) Using A, or AV will help bring your subject into focus, and blur the background.

Believe it or not, you can't "teach" a good eye. Some people have it, and others can imitate it. Its not something I can say.... ok, do this, and your picture will be perfect.

One thing I wish someone told me, is that YOU will be the most critical person of your own work. I look at pictures and think "oh my god... those are awful, this person is going to HATE THEM".... but then they love them. Its hard to just accept the fact that your work actually might be "good". Your not going to be Ansel Adams in a day, but you can get better.

So, lets start with what kind of camera you have. Please don't be intimidated, it took me FOREVER (and I mean forever!) to get this! Just keep learning, and practicing!

Georgiana

07-14-2005, 11:49 AM

Susbcribing!

This is another hobby I want to pick up!

greenbunny

07-14-2005, 12:43 PM

Little Angel, no worries, I guess I should figure out what the hey I'm talking about! ;)

I have an Olympus C3000 digital. The lens does not come off. Here it is:

http://ai.pricegrabber.com/product_images/293000-293999/293940_125.jpg

I read the manual, but it wasn't very well written and it was really confusing. The cross-referencing was practically non-existent. (Considering I'm a tech writer and I write machinery manuals for a living, I have a little more experience with how manuals should be than a lot of people!)

The way I read the manual, the flower button (a tulip, right?) is for getting a clear picture of something when you're very close. I think they called it "detail". I think I did use that at first, but then I decided I liked the labels on the bottles to be blurry, so I stopped.

(I should make a point to say that I'm calling these "buttons" but it's really a set of commands on a menu on the screen that I access by pushing arrow buttons. I shouldn't be so sloppy with my terminology.)

I had NO IDEA that temperature had anything to do with light settings. That's really interesting. (DH is a science teacher, so I'm hearing about Kelvin all the time :rolleyes: )

I'm guessing that part of the problem is all the different lightings in the room. I was taking the pictures in the kitchen (for the white walls) and there is natural light from the deck doors and the window, flourescent light above the counters, and incandescent light around the edges of the room.

sravenne

07-14-2005, 07:09 PM

Great Thread Little Angel! Thanks for posting!

oceaneast

07-14-2005, 08:05 PM

Subscribing, I have a Canon Digital Rebel Camera

keska

07-14-2005, 08:24 PM

I'll be checking back in on this thread after the bar exam. This is such a great idea.

deliciousjones

07-14-2005, 08:35 PM

greenbunny: i like your idea of hanging pictures of the wine bottles! i was goofing off with my camera the other night after a bottle of wine and got some pretty pictures of the bottle & glass backlit by a candle that was on our table. maybe you could play around with candles!

and if your husband insists on drinking your subjects, maybe you could do a closeup of the corks?

i'd love to see what you come up with! i think it's a great idea!

eta: really bad examples of wine related things in candlelight ;)

http://www.plamann.net/misc/wine-1.jpg

http://www.plamann.net/misc/wine-2.jpg

Little Angel '77

07-15-2005, 05:20 AM

The flower button is for shooting things close up, so the background is blurred out. It is probably using a low aperture when you shoot using that setting. I would use either that button or the face of a person (some cameras have a portrait mode)

You are on the right track you just need to make sure you aren't using the outdoor settings indoors. Read your manual and see which settings they recommend in certain situations. I am sure they have examples.

I am not sure I posted this right, but tempertures have nothing to do with light settings, I meant light settings have TEMPERTURES :) When I use the word temperture, I really mean different shades of light. Some lights have more blue, some have more red, some lights have more orange (called tungsten) Most light blubs you use and florescent bulbs are tungsten light, meaning they have orange tinge to them.

I gues for you to get the effect you want, I would put it on program, see what you get, and go from there, put the camera on the M mode (manual) and play around with shutter speeds... I am pretty sure you can change the settings a bit. Hope this helps.

greenbunny

07-18-2005, 06:19 AM

Thanks Little Angel, that makes sense. I will mess around a bit when I get a chance and post back--probably not for a week or two, work is insane right now.

deliciousjones, that second pic is SPECTACULAR! How the heck did you do that??!?!?!??!

And what kind of wine did you use? (I ask that out of 1/3 photography interest and 2/3 culinary interest ;) )

I like the cork idea, too. I have a whole bag full I could take some shots of. This one Italian restaurant we like has a wreath made of corks hanging over the bar and I think it's so cool, I've been saving ours for two years now to make one myself. I can only save them when we drink the good stuff, because the usual local cheapo stuff we drink has those nasty plastic corks.

Little Angel '77

07-19-2005, 04:55 AM

Greenbunny I posted this in the other thread, I completely forgot I had this picture :)

Thought of you :) http://images.snapfish.com/34449%3A2%3B23232%7Ffp7%3Enu%3D3235%3E993%3E47%3A% 3EWSNRCG%3D32328563%3A5%3B84nu0mrj

greenbunny

07-19-2005, 06:17 AM

Alicia, that's a really great shot. Something like that would have been great at my wedding, we used my great-grandmother's crystal...I'm a little ashamed to admit that, during our wedding, I was wishing I had the time to take a few pictures. :o

I'm going to try to experiment with some candles like dj up above. We don't own any wine glasses that are plain, they all have etched designs on them. He's going to think I'm insane when I buy a couple of wine glasses to take pictures of. :rolleyes:

Lindsan

07-19-2005, 08:59 AM

Greenbunny, do you need them to be inside? I was asked by a friend to take som wine/bottle pictures for a wine journal she was comissioned to make. I took about two million pictures inside and outside. Both in day light and at night by candlelight and with with lamps on. When it came down to it, the two I liked the most, one of which she ended up using, was outside in daylight. If you find it difficult to get it looking right, that might be a solution?

Little Angel '77

07-20-2005, 05:48 AM

I am sure its something silly. Maybe you need the battery connections cleaned. Don't fret!!! I will keep my fingers crossed that its something small.

Can I ask, does anyone on this thread- do photography for a living?

I have a full time job, but I am planning to go full time photography as soon as I have a certain amount in the bank account.

I am wondering - how you went about deciding "when" to go full time.

I need to book 24 more weddings, in theory before I can go full time! I have 3 on the horizon! Yippee!

greenbunny

07-20-2005, 06:59 AM

Lindsan, I guess I could take the pics anywhere, never really thought about doing it outside. I will try that, thanks.

DH was about to take our old ripped white sheets for garage rags. I started shrieking at him that I need them for backdrops. He now thinks I'm certifiably insane.

We are having a party this weekend, and so the next five days will be preparation and then cleanup. All I can think of is "I wish I had time to take pictures of wine bottles". :p

Little Angel '77

07-20-2005, 07:08 AM

augh oh... someone has the photography bug. When all you want to do is talk about photography... and shoot... your in trouble ... :)

deliciousjones

07-20-2005, 08:41 AM

Can I ask, does anyone on this thread- do photography for a living?

I do. I left my day job when photography fully replaced that income, last Fall.

Little Angel '77

07-20-2005, 08:44 AM

Delicious Jones...
How do you budget? Do you find it hard to "pay yourself?"

The one thing I struggle with.. is paying myself out of my photography income.

How long had you been shooting, when you decided to make the jump. I really want to make the jump!
I found your site... I can't believe you do just children...(I mean .. thats AWESOME!) but how many kids do you do a week?? to make a living?

Oh my gosh.. need more info :) So excited to see you can make a living off of this !!!

marchfamily

07-20-2005, 09:43 AM

Currently I have a P&S and am interested in upgrading. My P&S does not give me the shutter speed I would like - plus I would like to play around with more options. This would be for hobby only - mostly to take photos of my family and such. Would like a digital. Any suggestions? Brands? Sizes? Accessories?

deliciousjones

07-20-2005, 09:43 AM

my website is old and should probably be updated. my web design skills are limited and i've been lazy about trying to find someone to do it for me. i want to try the simpleviewer program that everyone seems to love.

i shoot 2-3 sessions per week. almost all children. i also shoot small events: baptisms, parties, casual receptions. i also do some commissioned work for a publications house. i avoid working on the weekends so weddings are out. i don't want to be away from my family for an entire day. portrait sessions and commissioned work is much more relaxed and conducive to my particular situation.

for example, this week i have an individual portrait session on thursday, a day-in-the-life shoot on friday and a session with a girl and her horse at a horse show on saturday morning. i'm spending the afternoon and evening in chicago and will make sure to get some stock photography shots for a corporate client who sometimes purchases images from our vacations!

i found it difficult to pay myself at first and it was only a couple of months ago that i started writing myself checks! i currently payself a reasonable salary and will give myself a bonus ;) if i have a need or want outside of my personal budget. like yesterday, i took the car to the shop for an oil change and ended up needing new brakes and tires. what do you know? i happened to get a bonus yesterday!

my overhead is very low. i own all of my equipment and do very little advertising. my husband carries our insurance. even if i do a session and the family doesn't order anything, my session fee has covered my costs. i do not require the equipment necessary to shoot weddings or large events.

i have an amazing client base and 85% of my business is from referrals. i placed a $75 ad on a local website and that has paid for itself several times over.

Koala_Gurl

07-20-2005, 06:23 PM

subscribing...

emschwar

07-20-2005, 06:57 PM

Just found this thread.

I recently got a digital rebel xt, and I love it! I haven't really learned how to get the most out of it though. I mostly shoot in the auto modes, because I shoot my toddler, and there's not much time to be futzing with settings when he's on the move. I'd like to be able to do more with it.

I've got some photog experience - 1 class in high school, and 2 in college - all film, since I graduated from college 7 years ago.

Any suggestions on how to get the most out of my camera? How about good accessories to add to the wish list? :)

cynder

07-20-2005, 07:34 PM

Christine Try Simpleviewer for your portfolio. It's not too difficult to figure out and showcases photos so beautifully. If I ever get my trip to Australia done, I can show it to you.

Shannon

07-20-2005, 10:48 PM

Great thread - can't wait to learn more :)

Best wishes,
Shannon

Allegra

07-21-2005, 01:44 PM

Can I ask, does anyone on this thread- do photography for a living?

I'm a professional wedding and portrait photographer. The way I made that call was when I could live off of my photography income and bank my "day job" salary for three months.

Allegra

AKA Poohgirl

07-21-2005, 02:34 PM

Allegra - welcome!

I too would like to be able to make that jump, but I think I'm far from it. But I'm not so busy that I can't handle both right now, so I'm still okay. Plus, it's extra $$ to get my gear and everything else I need.

emschwar - just start playing with your camera. I bought a couple of books, and started learning that way. Mainly, I'd put it in program, and then look at the settings, then switch to manual, and use the same settings to take a picture. After the initial pic, I'd start opening up my aperture, while making my shutter speed faster, and then I'd compare the effects. A good thing to do is kind of keep a journal of how you got the shot. That way, you know if you ever try to recreate it. Well, now I can see your digital, so you'll always know how you got the shot, but I'd just start playing around. You'll soon start to see the kind of shots you like. Also find pics that you admire, and start trying to recreate them, as far as the exposure goes. Once you nail it, you start to learn.

marchfamily - I'm still film, so I can't help you there. But I think the Canon Digital Rebel is a good choice. It's a digital SLR, but I think they run about $800, so it might be kind of steep for a hobbyist, unless you're willing to part with that kind of dough. But I think most digital SLR's are in that price range and up. Maybe Little Angel can provide more insight.

Little Angel '77

07-21-2005, 02:51 PM

allegra can you ellaborate a little bit more about how you made the jump. MY DH and I are having a hard time trying to figure out how to "pay" ourselves.... and make sure to keep track of it all.

The part that scares me is the income tax for STATE and FEDERAL,

I already collect sales tax... but once I make a profit, which I will this year, I have to report federal and sales. Its so scary. I have a CPA, but its still scary.

Allegra

07-22-2005, 07:47 AM

allegra can you ellaborate a little bit more about how you made the jump. MY DH and I are having a hard time trying to figure out how to "pay" ourselves.... and make sure to keep track of it all.

As a former accountant, I felt somewhat qualified to handle the accounting for it! ;) That said, how you "pay yourself" is going to depend on how you have your busines set up. I'm a sole proprietor which simplifies things somewhat. Any money the company nets, is mine. See? Wasn't that easy? :D :p

The accounting details in broad are as follows:

receive payment from client
deposit full amount in business bank account
remove 25% of the gross for state and federal taxes (this is way more than I need to but keep with me) and place in savings account
pay business expenses from account (does NOT include salary)
what's left over is yours

here is where you can determine how you want to handle paying yourself

either A) decide what "salary" you will pay yourself and do so - BUT in a sole prop, this cannot be counted as a business expense OR
B) what I do, when I need money, I take an owners draw from the account

The difference is that one is a regular owner's draw and the other is as needed. Since my business is SOO cyclical, I cannot set up a regular draw (oh I guess I could but I don't bother)

Now if you are setting up your business as anything else, you have different options - your CPA is really the best person qualified to tell you how to handle everything.

oh and back to the 25% - I pay taxes quarterly, so I take a portion of that 25% and use it to pay my taxes. The rest is part of my permanent savings. What portions you use (and if you even set aside 25%) will depend on your tax bracket and your state rate. This is obviously for income tax. Sales tax is totally different in that you are collecting for the state - the money is never yours...

Does that help? It can all get pretty involved - I suggest talking to a CPA for your area as the best course of action!

Allegra

Little Angel '77

07-22-2005, 07:55 AM

Well, that was a little bit helpful.

Would you be willing to talk to me a bit more about it? On the phone or over email?

I am going to send that to my DH, because he does all the banking.

I have to remember that when I get money, I have to do this
Sales tax
State income
Federal Income
401K
Health Insurance

THEN
We have to look at the cost of goods I am selling. Gosh, I need to hire a good accountant. Mine just said - you won't make a profit this year, so don't worry about it.... next year I'll have to worry about it.

Ahhh!

Koala_Gurl

07-22-2005, 12:02 PM

OK, I have had the 50mm lens recommended to me by several people, and am almost ready to get one. But, funny...I am not sure what it will really do! (my kit lens goes 18 - 55mm). Is the difference a fixed f-stop (1.8)?

Anything I need to know about this lens? (flash / no flash, etc?)

TIA!! (And I am enjoying the "lessons" already given!)

Little Angel '77

07-22-2005, 12:16 PM

The 50 MM lense is a fixed focal length lens which means you can't zoom. Its a great lens for close up and detail shots. I love using it to capture the jewelery the bride will wear or the table set ups. It lets in a lot of light and is light weight. I use it in really dark rooms, because I can get the shutter speeds I want with it.

Its a great lens because you can use it for anything. I sometimes use it for my group shots.

The 50MM is only 69.00 and if you get the 1.4 you end up spending 369.00 for the extra stop.
Its worth the investment. Everyone has 70 bucks :) come one!! Buy it, you will love the Depth of field you get with it on close up shots!!! :) Peer pressure!

Koala_Gurl

07-25-2005, 05:06 PM

Ordered... ;) (the 1.8 one!) I am sure I'll be back with questions! :)

sravenne

07-26-2005, 05:02 AM

Thanks so much for sharing Allegra! That was very informative. I think it will be a while until I move over full-time, but I look forward to hearing more from your professional experience on this thread. Welcome!

GeekGirl

07-26-2005, 07:58 PM

Subscribing.

And wishing I could afford a decent camera....*wistful sigh*

AKA Poohgirl

07-27-2005, 08:35 AM

Little Angel '77

07-28-2005, 10:12 AM

I am looking to sell my Canon 10D, if anyone is interested?
I was looking for around 650 for it. It comes with the battery grip and just the body. no lens. (sorry girls!)

Its in great working order.... nothing wrong, I just want to upgrade to the 20D again.

If anyone wants a great professional camera, I paid 1200.00 for it a year ago. IF you have Canon lens... you should think about it!

Koala_Gurl

07-28-2005, 10:28 AM

Little Angel '77 - How does the 10D compare to the 20D? A friend of mine loves my 20D, and was possibly thinking of getting a digi SLR...

Koala_Gurl

07-28-2005, 10:30 AM

Can anyone recommend any books / websites that can help me learn some of the basics?? I would love to take a class, but that won't happen for a while, and I would like to get started.

Little Angel '77

07-28-2005, 10:34 AM

It compares, but the 20D is obviously the newer of the 2.
I love both the 10D and the 20, I just really want the 20D. and then hope to sell those and get the Mark II

I don;t know if anyone else has an opinion.

sravenne

07-28-2005, 11:41 AM

Can anyone recommend any books / websites that can help me learn some of the basics?? I would love to take a class, but that won't happen for a while, and I would like to get started.

Hey there! Understanding Exposures is a FANTASTIC beginner's guide. When I started learning, this was my bible. The great thing about this book too is that with every picture, he shows which settings he used. Highly recommended. :)

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/0817463003/qid=1122576019/sr=8-3/ref=pd_bbs_sbs_3/102-4293568-8259313?v=glance&s=books&n=507846

sravenne

07-28-2005, 11:43 AM

sourgrapes

07-29-2005, 09:30 AM

GeekGirl, you could depending on whether you want film or digital. I have two film cameras (Canon Elan II's) that I bought off of ebay, for about $150/each. I use these professionally. You just have to know what you're looking for.

I don't know about digital, though. I think the digital SLR's are pretty pricey.

Poohgirl, what kind of lense do you have?

Just curious because I shoot with the same canon camera.

I've seen your photos and I really like your work.

webmistress

07-29-2005, 09:06 PM

Awesome thread, I've only read the first page so far, but I will be practacing these tips, I love Photography!!

t3h_wookiee

07-29-2005, 11:21 PM

I'm glad I found this thread! :)

I'm finally getting back into film photography (man I've missed it!), and am trying to decide whether to buy a new camera, or just get new lenses for my current one. Right now I have a Canon AE-1 Program that was my mom's, and pretty old. I used it in my photography classes back in high school, and it works pretty well (just loud!). I still have the original 50mm lense though, so I know I need a new one, plus a new flash, as the current one is being held together by electrical tape. ;) (I dropped it a few times...) The camera is heavy (since it's mostly metal instead of plastic), but that's not too big of a deal, at least right now, we'll see once I get a bigger lense.

I've looked at possibly buying an Elan7E or Rebel 2000 also. I'm a Canon girl. :)

Do you guys think it's worth buying a new body, or should I just get new lenses (and a flash) for my AE-1? If the second option, which lenses should I look at?

Thanks a bunch y'all. :)

Little Angel '77

07-31-2005, 01:25 PM

if you don't have a reason to buy a new canmera (i.e you out grew the other one ) I would wait, and just focus on getting lens. Then upgrade your equipment... when you have a need (its just not working the way you need it too).

Just my thought.

Ummm

07-31-2005, 01:32 PM

LeslieandPaul

07-31-2005, 04:10 PM

I love taking pics and just got back from a camping trip where I was designated official photographer.
I've got a Canon Power Shot S230 (3.2 Megapixels) and a Pentax MZ-50 (film) with a 35-80 lens, as well as an 80-200 (i think). I got some really good photos with each and now I'm motivated to start taking more pictures!!!

t3h_wookiee

07-31-2005, 05:42 PM

t3h_wookiee

07-31-2005, 05:54 PM

jess - does the AE-1 Program use EOS mount lens? i'm asking because i'm not sure if AE-1 Program is a fully manual camera? for canon, the EOS lines use a diff lens mount to the manual cameras. so if you invest in manual lenses now, they may not mount on a newer camera should you invest in one later on. esp if you plan to go digital down the road. just something to think about.

It uses FD mount lenses. That is one thing I've thought of, but I'm not too worried about it. I have a digicam that works for now, and probably won't buy a new one until I can get a digi SLR in a few years. :)

Little Angel '77

07-31-2005, 06:11 PM

but then again, if you are using FD lens... I am not sure theywill transfer to a new camera... you'd have to make sure before spending the money...

Koala_Gurl

08-01-2005, 09:20 AM

Question for anyone...

I wanted to get some material or something to use as a background to take some picutures of the baby. What type of material would work? (Something relatively inexpensive).

Thanks!

deliciousjones

08-01-2005, 11:41 AM

I wanted to get some material or something to use as a background to take some picutures of the baby. What type of material would work? (Something relatively inexpensive).

please please please don't use a white sheet! :)

black velveteen works well in a pinch and it's super cheap.

t3h_wookiee

08-01-2005, 11:42 AM

Good point. If I can get good prices I won't worry about it much, but if they're going to cost quite a bit, then I'll research some more.

t3h_wookiee

08-01-2005, 12:56 PM

You know, I think I will go ahead and just get another body too. For sure it will be a Canon Rebel, but I'm not sure which model. There are tons on ebay! I want to spend under $300 if I can, and it doesn't matter if it's new or used. Does anybody here have a model that they like? The ones I've looked at so far are the Rebel 2000, the Ti, the Elan 7, and the GII. My head's getting dizzy looking at all the reviews out there! :)

Koala_Gurl

08-01-2005, 01:14 PM

please please please don't use a white sheet! :)

black velveteen works well in a pinch and it's super cheap.

Dumb question, is velveteen like velvet? (See, dumb, eh?) Is it just a cheaper version of velvet?

deliciousjones

08-01-2005, 03:44 PM

Is it just a cheaper version of velvet?

Yup.

Koala_Gurl

08-01-2005, 04:19 PM

Yup.

Thanks! :o

greenbunny

08-03-2005, 05:47 AM

Why shouldn't you use a white sheet? It is just a cliché, or is there some technical reason?

deliciousjones

08-03-2005, 06:03 AM

greenbunny: it's not that it's cliche, but have you ever seen a photo with a white sheet that didn't look like a white sheet? they're very thin and don't absorb light and they show wrinkles. they also seem to look sort of gray in some shots, especially when used with a flash.

in my opinion, the whole point of a plain white or black background is to draw attention to the subject and in many of the portraits that i see with a white sheet, the first thing that jumps out is the wrinkly white sheet.

on the other hand, i think that if used outdoors, it might work, or if the sheet is thick and sturdy and placed a few feet behind the subject.

greenbunny

08-04-2005, 06:48 AM

deliciousjones, thanks, I had no idea!

Do you know where I can buy something nice for a background? Should I just browse at the fabric shop? How do I tell what might look good and what wouldn't? Obviously I have no clue since I thought a white sheet would look good. :rolleyes:

What about those nice blue backgrounds I see around? Can I find something like that? Can I possibly ask any more questions at one time?

Lindsan

08-04-2005, 10:53 AM

Oh, I have a question about that too deliciousjones. Someone asked me to take some photos of food, preferrably at a set table. After reading you suggestion to stay away from white I tried using our grey countertop. But it came out beeing too big of a contrast. So now I'm thinking I want to do the white table cloth background anyway. Or do you have a better suggestion? I'm including pics to show you the results of my first try.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v454/Lindsan/P8040762.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v454/Lindsan/P8040763.jpg

Here is another one but this time of only the plate. I think it looks better than with the dark grey
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v454/Lindsan/P8040767.jpg

sravenne

08-04-2005, 01:10 PM

Hi Lindan,

I like the pictures a lot...and the food looks delicious :p .

If I may make a suggestion, I think that this dish would look more inviting if we saw just a bit more of the setting, like a glass with wine in it...and also perhaps maybe a slightly rotated angle, if you know what I mean (not dead centered). Just a thought...and I particularly like your depth of field on #1 and #2 best.

Otherwise, I actually think the gray (or silver) background works fine. :D Sorry if I'm not much help.

deliciousjones

08-04-2005, 03:00 PM

Do you know where I can buy something nice for a background? Should I just browse at the fabric shop? How do I tell what might look good and what wouldn't?

Look for something heavy, that doesn't show wrinkles and that you can't see the light through. Keep the background a few feet from your subject and know that if you use your flash, you'll see a shadow.

What is your subject? A person, object?

Oh, I have a question about that too deliciousjones. Someone asked me to take some photos of food, preferrably at a set table. After reading you suggestion to stay away from white I tried using our grey countertop. But it came out beeing too big of a contrast. So now I'm thinking I want to do the white table cloth background anyway. Or do you have a better suggestion? I'm including pics to show you the results of my first try.

Well, a table cloth belongs on a table, so it's the obvious backdrop. A sheet does not look natural behind a kiddo, know what I mean?

I would also like to see a wine glass, napkin or something else on the table. The light looks a bit harsh, too.

The dish looks fabulous and is making me hungry =)

swcolleen

08-04-2005, 03:10 PM

haven't read through yet but I am going to subscribe...i love photography and love to learn more!

Lindsan

08-04-2005, 03:11 PM

Thanks, sravenne and deliciousjones!

I agree, the lighting is too harsh. Too much flash. I did try the wine in the shot thing but didn't like how much of the background that was included. But yeah, I will definitely try in better lighting, with a table cloth and nice surroundings. Thanks for your suggestions!

My husband did the cooking, btw, it was heavenly!
(hence my avatar)

greenbunny

08-05-2005, 06:02 AM

Look for something heavy, that doesn't show wrinkles and that you can't see the light through. Keep the background a few feet from your subject and know that if you use your flash, you'll see a shadow.

What is your subject? A person, object?

Okay, thanks. I will go shopping next week.

I don't really have a specific subject in mind at the moment. I have a few future projects I want to do, but mostly I just want to have the right accessories on hand.

cynder

08-05-2005, 08:02 AM

Lindsan That dish looks so yummy! I agree that you should you should kill the flash and try a different angle.

This is from last weekend. My food does not look as nice as yours...but you get the gist...

http://www.cynthiavarkey.com/images/photos/chicken.jpg
http://www.cynthiavarkey.com/images/photos/drinks.jpg

deliciousjones

08-05-2005, 08:04 PM

a couple of shots of my daughter. i'd love to post client stuff but i'm definitely not comfortable sharing their personal portraits on a public message board. i do post them in my livejournal, though.

http://www.plamann.net/rachel/4august-1.jpg

http://www.plamann.net/rachel/4august-2.jpg

http://www.plamann.net/rachel/4august-3.jpg

can you believe i shot these with the total substandard non-l series TAMRON glass? shit, it may as well have been plastic

Little Angel '77

08-10-2005, 05:39 AM

I just posted this in the other thread so I thought I would post it here,.
http://www.luminous-landscape.com/tutorials/understanding-series/understanding-histograms.shtml

Its how to understand reading a histogram on a digital camera.

greenbunny

08-10-2005, 07:48 AM

I was fooling around with my camera at a wedding this weekend and got a lot of "almost good" shots. I figured out how to take shots of fast motion, but they all got very dark. I figured out how to get lighter shots in the dark, but they're all blurry.

I finally read the camera manual and know how to change the shutter and aperture settings. The only problem is that the manual doesn't tell me WHY to change them. Can anyone recommend a website or book I can use to learn about the whats and whys of light settings and motion settings?

Also, what is an SLR? I googled it but it only tells me where to buy them, not what they are.

deliciousjones

08-10-2005, 07:49 AM

Can anyone recommend a website or book I can use to learn about the whats and whys of light settings and motion settings?

Understanding Exposure.

Increasing your ASA/ISO will help in low-light situations but will result in grainy images on film and noisy images on digital.

Little Angel '77

08-10-2005, 08:15 AM

I finally read the camera manual and know how to change the shutter and aperture settings. The only problem is that the manual doesn't tell me WHY to change them.

You change them varying on the lighting. One thing that might have helped you was flash.

If you in low light, you need to get a lot of light in the camera. One way to do that is to have a FAST film speed or a HIGH ISO (800 or 1600) but as delicious jones said, it makes it noisy or grainy. SOme photographers love that look.

another way to let a lot of light in, is to have a BIG aperture or low number of 2.8.

So why do you change your settings, to get proper exposure. In time you will learn what settings you need for certain situations. For bright sunshine, you need a small aperture to limit the light that gets in the camera. So you would go to F 11 or f 16. and have a fast shutter to open and close the curtain fast only letting in enough light for proper exposure ...

keep playing. It will ALL come totgether. Was that helpful at all?

greenbunny

08-10-2005, 01:39 PM

keep playing. It will ALL come totgether. Was that helpful at all?

Yes! Thank you! I think I was assuming larger aperture numbers = larger size but according to your comment I had it backwards.

What can I do in situations in which I don't want to use the flash? For example, when I take pictures of my cat she always closes her eyes when I flash, and I obviously can't ask her not to.

Also, I have very shaky hands, and in low light that makes it even harder to get a non-blurry shot.

deliciousjones

08-10-2005, 02:06 PM

What can I do in situations in which I don't want to use the flash? For example, when I take pictures of my cat she always closes her eyes when I flash, and I obviously can't ask her not to.

Try this:

Put your cat facing a window or open doorway so that the outside light falls on her.

Don't zoom -- the general rule of thumb is that you need a shutter speed equal or faster than your focal length, so if you're zoomed out to 200mm, then you need a shutter speed of at least 200s to avoid camera shake.

Try using AV mode (aperature priority) so that the camera chooses the shutter speed.

Open up your lens (decrease your fstop as low as it will go). I don't know what kind of camera you have. Seems that the kit lenses on dSLRs open up to 3.5ish.

If you still don't have enough light, bump your ISO and try again.

greenbunny

08-11-2005, 11:52 AM

Okay, I will work on that. I'm not sure how to change f-stop yet, I need to read the manual more thoroughly.

Here's an example of my shakiness/blurriness issues. Summer posed really nicely, I love how her tail looks so long here. I hope I can get her to do it again for a better shot. (I know the background is cluttered, but she's quarantined in one room right now...once she has a clean bill of health, I can pose her somewhere better.)

http://i15.photobucket.com/albums/a354/agreenbunny/P8090044.jpg

Ummm

08-11-2005, 03:56 PM

greenbunny - i forgot, what kind of camera / lens do you have again?

Ummm

08-11-2005, 05:35 PM

anyone wants to do a weekly or bi-weekly or even monthly exercise or something?! eg on this website they have contests (this is what one of the local photog club is doing) - we can pick a topic, and we can post as many images as we like?

eg the local photog is doing this topic next month - complementary colors (http://www.worth1000.com/cache/contest/contestcache.asp?contest_id=6697&start=1&end=10&display=photography)

Koala_Gurl

08-11-2005, 05:48 PM

Little Angel '77

08-11-2005, 05:58 PM

Greenbunny... one thing I do when I shot anywhere, is turn ALL the lights on and open all the shades to get as much light in as possible.

To change the aperture, you need to put the camera on Av or A and spin a dial, you will see the number change.

So for the fstop... lets review (because this is SOOOO confusing and one of the hardest yet most important things to understand in photography)

Large Apetrue = LOW number 2.8
Small aperture === HIGH number

So if you want to let a LOT of light in, you need a large aperture, (low number)
this will open the eye of the camera as wide as your lens will go. As DJ said, your lens probably only goes to 3.5 or 4.0. More expensive lens, go as low as 1.4 04 1.2 or even 1.0 (but those are unnessary unless you are shooting really dark dark situations.)

So for the picture above, this is what I might have done.
Set the ISO to 400. Aperture, at 2.8 or 3.5 or 4.0
the shutter speed will fall where it wants in aperture mode.
If you are getting to slow a shutter, you need more light... so bump the ISO... to 800. You should get more shutter speed for your buck. :)
Below is a picture of the shutter with a SMALL APERTURE or LARGE F stop NUMBER (see how the hole of the shutter is small???) its letting in very little ligght because the scene is probably very bright, or there is a lot of sunshine
http://www.acdsystems.com/NR/rdonlyres/e33rd5m7jzrxvzjyyjxka6jbr3jkrowd4q2yg5ye7gbxthzbou dmlavnpbmsrft6rcfq7qvedboau2wkyuaj5hgqkue/aperture-closed.gif
This is the SMALL APERTURE -- LARGE NUMBER (see how the hole of the shutter is small???) its letting in very little ligght because the scene is probably very bright, or there is a lot of sunshine

In this example, the scene might be every dark and the camera needs a lot of light to hit the film or chip. so the shutter is open WIDE with a LOW f stop number or aperture of f 2.8
http://www.acdsystems.com/NR/rdonlyres/etxkv53e4fce625ebh2pq5got2voqlf2frxxn43qpyikg3osyc k4cncryswh23h6axznvhzhotsvbdh6jiy64ekyuyh/aperture-open.gif

Look at this too : http://www.digicamguides.com/learn/aperture-examples.html

I am such a visual person so I know this will help someone else understand how it all works.

Now the SPEED of the shutter is how quick that curtain opens and closes. If it snaps open and close fast --- thats a fast shutter speed, letting in less amounts of light. If it stays open for a long time you have a very dark scene and the camera needs more light.

When I shoot weddings, and I take a picture I know that when I hear the shuter click a certain way, I am going to get a blurry picture because the shutter was open for to long, I need it about 60th of a second, because I can't shoot at anything slower without showing camera shake. I need a tripod when I use a long lens in a dark room. The lens is going to need a lot more light... (because its so big) It takes awhile for all that light to get through the glass to the chip or fim. I can't hold a 70 MM lens (as DJ said ) at a 30th because thats a longer shutter speed than the focal lenght. I need the shutter speed to be up at around 80 when I am at 70MM .. to avaoid shakee.

HTH.

Koala_Gurl

08-11-2005, 08:13 PM

New question...

I took DD in for a portrait sitting. Now that I am getting into this stuff, I was talking a bit w/ the photog about the camera she had. I forgot to ask about the lens, but was thinking I might get help here! From what I remember, it went to 120mm (don't remember the first #), and looks like it had a shield (?) thing on the end.

What type of lens was she using, and can you tell me a little about it? (I like learning through "real life" situations, and now I am just curious about what she was using!)

Little Angel '77

08-12-2005, 05:04 AM

deliciousjones

08-12-2005, 07:25 AM

a lens shield prevents images like this. it's not a typical flare (you can't see a ray of light like you can with some flares) but the light washed out the whole image.

http://www.plamann.net/workshop/washedout.jpg

i have no idea what sort of lens she was using. i know you get some beautiful portraits shooting through a long lens and it's something i'd love to try eventually.

greenbunny

08-12-2005, 07:37 AM

greenbunny - i forgot, what kind of camera / lens do you have again?

I have an Olympus C3000 digital. As far as I know it doesn't take any lens attachments.

http://ai.pricegrabber.com/product_images/293000-293999/293940_125.jpg

Alicia, I'm really visual too, those pictures are great! Thanks! I don't think I can set to 800 ISO, maybe I need to check my manual. When I change ISO through the screen menu, my options are 100, 200, 400 or AUTO.

I also like the idea of an exercise/lesson.

I am bidding right now on a copy of Understanding Exposure. I am really excited!

Koala_Gurl

08-12-2005, 08:18 AM

It sounds like she was using a lens sheild to cut down on lens flare. Lens flare are the spots of lights on a pictures, that are caused by light entering the camera at an angle, bouncing off the mirror.

The 20D is a great camera(its the one I shoot with.) The lens, I am not sure about it, it could have been a 24-120mm, or a 70-120mm depending on what lens she was using . Some photographers use lens, that are not the same brand as their camera.

I am pretty sure it was a 24 - 120mm (when I saw that it just looked really familiar!)

I can't wait to see how the pictures turned out, after seeing how she created them.

Oh, I just got the Understanding Exposures book, and just about 30 pages into it and I think it is a great book. So much is starting to come together all of a sudden (between the discussions here, the book, and playing with my own camera.) It is an easy read, and the author gives good examples.

Little Angel '77

08-12-2005, 09:09 AM

Greenbunny
You can't go higher than 400 than. Sorry!!! 400 is good though, its what you would need indoors 'most cases'. If you were shooting reception halls like me, you would need 800 or even 1600 (blach!!) I hate shooting at 1600 because the images look like poop!

I have been trying to find the other picture example of what aperture does. I wonder if its at the begining of this thread.

be back :)

emschwar

08-12-2005, 09:13 AM

I have a question about ISO speeds. I know what they do on film, but on digital, what's the difference. I mean, obviously 200 requires more light than 1600, but is there a difference in the quality on digital?

Little Angel '77

08-12-2005, 09:18 AM

They do the same thing, the only difference is (which is GREAT) that when you go from out door to indoor, you don't need to change film! You just adjust your camera setting, and you can go back and forth between indoors and outdoors without having to take a roll out midway.

The dynamic range of film is a LOT deeper than digital. With film, you can over expose a picture by 2 stops and still have it be in a good range of color. If you over expose in digital by 2 stops- you have most likely lost your image, and either will need to make it a black and white, or trash it all together..

For those of you use to shooting film, you will have a rude awakening when you get your images back in digital... you will have to sort of relearn exposure :)

The great thing is, if you shoot RAW - you can fix most your images in PS, but if you over expose, or in my case blow out the wedding dress, there is not much you can do :)

deliciousjones

08-12-2005, 10:47 AM

you will have to sort of relearn exposure

i think you just have to pay more attention to exposure. i've found that it's very easy to rely too heavily on photoshop for corrections. you can always correct for underexposure but the image can really suffer for it.

i try very hard to shoot so that i don't have to open photoshop before i order my proofs. it's easier said than done. a lot of times i'll get a great image that can be even greater with a bit of sharpening, bump in levels, etc.

I mean, obviously 200 requires more light than 1600, but is there a difference in the quality on digital?

just like 1600 speed will produce grain in film, 1600 ISO will produce noise in digital images. personally, i love the feel of dark, moody, grainy film images. i've had little luck trying for the same effect digitally. noise looks very muddy compared to grain.

let me see if i can dig up some stuff shot in 1600. at my workshop last weekend, i was shooting indoors in a dark area at 1600 and then forgot to switch when i got outside in the sun. i was metering at 400, shooting at 1600 and getting some crazy results! too bad none of them are artistically crazy, just ugly overposed crazy. :)

deliciousjones

08-12-2005, 10:55 AM

emily:

you've seen these images before. i don't know that they're the greatest examples in the world, but it should give you an idea.

400 ISO. lots of natural light. i stay away from 100 and 200 ISO because i like a bit of grain/noise.

image removed

1600 ISO. very, very dark room. tiny bit of natural light about 20 feet behind me.

image removed

see the difference?

emschwar

08-12-2005, 10:56 AM

just like 1600 speed will produce grain in film, 1600 ISO will produce noise in digital images. personally, i love the feel of dark, moody, grainy film images. i've had little luck trying for the same effect digitally. noise looks very muddy compared to grain.

let me see if i can dig up some stuff shot in 1600. at my workshop last weekend, i was shooting indoors in a dark area at 1600 and then forgot to switch when i got outside in the sun. i was metering at 400, shooting at 1600 and getting some crazy results! too bad none of them are artistically crazy, just ugly overposed crazy. :)
Ok, that makes sense. I am cutious what the noise looks like. Did you see those craptastic results from my experimentation that I posted in my LJ? The shots aren't great, but any noise there?

emschwar

08-12-2005, 10:58 AM

Ok, I think I see. On the 1600, when you zoom in, the details aren't as crisp? The line between the hair and skin, for example?

AMC

08-12-2005, 12:47 PM

**subscribing**

papergirl

08-14-2005, 10:11 AM

Can I join?

I recently got a new camera, which I am slowly trying to learn how to use. I do event planning in NYC and figure it will be helpful if I can learn a few skills in photography so I can get some good shots of my work (to then show prospective clients). What I am most obsessed with right now is getting great detail shots of things like flowers and intricate cake design.

Today I took some photos of an orchid and would sincerely appreciate any help you experienced ladies can offer. What I was trying to capture was the fine details in the center of the flower but I had no luck. You know how inside it can be a little fuzzy, almost like little hairs – how do I capture that?

Here is what I actually got:
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v489/beebeck/Picture084.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v489/beebeck/Picture089.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v489/beebeck/Picture087.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v489/beebeck/Picture085.jpg

My camera is a Panasonic DMC-FZ20. It has 5 mega pixels a 12x zoom lens. For the photo I had the nob set to the flower and my ISO was 200. The photos were taken in front of a window with natural light coming in.

Also, I enjoy reading everyone’s questions, which are helping me learn so much.

Rebecca

Lindsan

08-14-2005, 11:45 AM

I'm back after several tries for a better food shot. This is the result of Friday's exercise. Does anyone have any feedback for me?
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v454/Lindsan/P8121016.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v454/Lindsan/P8121017.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v454/Lindsan/P8121019.jpg

Thanks!

Koala_Gurl

08-14-2005, 12:05 PM

Lindsan - Those shots turned out great! I like how you added some other food dishes in the background, but used the depth of field to keep just one dish in focus.

I don't know too much about this stuff, but I think they might be a touch overexposed?? (What I am referring to is the piece of chicken on the far left of the second shot, and maybe a bit on the honeydew??) Someone who knows more about this stuff can correct me! :)

deliciousjones

08-14-2005, 12:19 PM

I dont think they are overexposed. I don't see any blow outs and my monitor is calibrated.

Lindsan - those shots are great. I love that there is other food in the background. It looks like the shots that I see in restaurant reviews!! Awesome job and way to go for making me hungry :)

Koala_Gurl

08-14-2005, 12:37 PM

Little Angel '77

08-14-2005, 02:40 PM

bumble, I would have used (if you have it) a macro setting. Check your book. Also, you could have probably got away with 100 ISO (always try the lowest ISO you can, before assuming you need to go higher.

Kaola Girl, I see what your saying about the chicken being a touch over exposed, but actually you want some highlights to blow out in an image. When I shoot a wedding dress (*one of the hardest things to NOT blow out) I look at my histogram, and if I see something blinking on the screen, that means I blew out the exposure on part of the image. thats a good thing, and tells me I have even exposure over 95% of the image. remember, digital has less of the dynamic range as film and is less forgiving, so that chicken piece, although lost the detail on the cut part, has great detail on the top (the brown part)

One important thing I was taught in photography is that there are 4 really important elements, but when you shoot a picture you are going to have to decide which of those 4 elements you can compromise to get the shot. The important thing it to ALWAYS get the shot. You will never be able to have an image where there isn't something you'd like to change.

You have to remember, ISO, Aperture, shutter and the light.
Photography is a perfect balence of those 4 things, and somethings you have to compromise one of the four- like in that shot, to get the top of the chicken well exposed, the highlight on the cut had to be overexposed a smidge. Its called blowing a highlight.

Koala_Gurl

08-14-2005, 02:49 PM

Little Angel '77 - Ahh, I see what you mean about blowing a highlight. Makes sense! :)

Carissa

08-14-2005, 03:33 PM

What a great thread! Photography is one of my hobbies and I am always looking to learn more.

Ummm

08-14-2005, 08:54 PM

some recent portraits i did...

http://christabutler.com/dwf-jpg/christabutler-jess1.jpg

http://christabutler.com/dwf-jpg/christabutler-jess2.jpg

http://christabutler.com/dwf-jpg/christabutler-jess3.jpg

http://christabutler.com/dwf-jpg/christabutler-yarzue1.jpg

http://christabutler.com/dwf-jpg/christabutler-yarzue2.jpg

http://christabutler.com/dwf-jpg/christabutler-yarzue3.jpg

Lindsan

08-15-2005, 07:33 AM

Thanks guys for your feedback and compliments. I have to say that overexposing the chicken was the least of my worries. I haven't come far enough yet to have all the stuff down when it comes to what to think of. These were my main concerns:
how to compose the pics (what to include and exclude)
where to put the focus to find the right depth
getting enough light

But I do like to think that I am getting very much further where taking a good shot isn't just a fluke. :) :o

CarolM

08-15-2005, 10:49 AM

I just got all the way through this thread and there is a lot of good information. I'm very interested in improving my photography and have already taken some of the hints.

I'll be checking in more often to see what else I can learn. :)

greenbunny

08-15-2005, 11:31 AM

Lindsan, the food looks great. I only have one thing I noticed: to me, the bacon all the way on the left being the piece that's most focused seems odd, I'd expect to see the middle piece most focused because of the gentle angle you used. If the melon slices were on a steeper angle, like so that the right-hand slice was high up in the field of view, then I might expect the left-most bacon to be most clearly focused.

I am definitely not as knowledgable as most people in this forum when it comes to the "proper" technique, that's just my gut reaction.

Lindsan

08-15-2005, 01:44 PM

I see what you are saying. I think what I was thinking at the time was the one closest to me should be the one in focus. But yes, in hindsight, perhaps it would look better with the middle one?

PS: It's actually Parma ham, not bacon. :)

Koala_Gurl

08-15-2005, 02:26 PM

Lindsan - I had to go out any buy a honeydew melon after seeing those pictures! :D

Lindsan

08-15-2005, 02:36 PM

Hehe, it's amazing what food in photographs does to you, isn't it?

papergirl

08-15-2005, 03:41 PM

little angel i did use the macro setting. any other suggestions or tips? trying to get those tiny details is a lot of work but it's fun learning. :)

Koala_Gurl

08-15-2005, 03:58 PM

little angel i did use the macro setting. any other suggestions or tips? trying to get those tiny details is a lot of work but it's fun learning. :)

Maybe the experts can help more...my experience with a point & shoot (Olympus 5 MP) was that I could never get that close up detail I wanted. (I also may not have known as much as I do now...not a lot, still learning...) When I got a digital SLR, I was able to get that detail.

FWIW...I would LOVE to learn how to get that detail with my P&S!!

Ummm - Beautiful shots! :)

Little Angel '77

08-15-2005, 07:24 PM

Hmm, for tips for getting detail, in a p&S I am not sure how well they can focus on detail. The detail might be to much for the camera to capture??? (Honestly, I don't know. I just know that when I need to shoot detail, I know I need a 50MM lens (which is what the human eye sees,) and just move back and forth until I get the detail I want. I am stumped.

KarenS

08-15-2005, 09:42 PM

Most point n shoot cameras are not equipped for macro work. It all depends on what the closest focusing distance of the lens is. For example, if you go to BH's website and look up various lenses, they will tell you in the specs how close they focus.

The Canon 50mm 1.4 will focus to 1.5' (18")
The Canon 135mm 2.0 will only focus to 3'
The Canon 15mm 2.8 will focus to .7' (about 8.4")
In general the wider the lens, the closer it will focus.

But there are something like 6 different Olympus 5MP Camedia cameras on B&H (and those are only the newer ones) and they all have different focusing ranges - from 1.5' to as close as 3". The other thing you have to keep in mind is that most point n shoot cameras are rangefinders ... that means that what you see thru the eyepiece isn't exactly what you see thru the lens - so at very close focusing distances you could be off by up to 50% of the focusing range and not know it.

But even if one of those cameras focuses that close, you could be losing detail because the size of the sensor (even tho it's 5 MP) is smaller than a 5MP sensor in a 35mm camera. So you might be getting so close that you're losing the finesse of detail because of the size of the sensor.

In general point n shoots are not the best for close up work. You can buy some magnifying filters and that kind of thing for some cameras, but if you want to do a lot of macro work, you should get an SLR digital and get lenses designed for macro work.

Karen

Ummm

08-15-2005, 11:02 PM

using a tripod for macro work is also important. since you're getting quite close to the subject, any slight camera shake is quite obvious.

if it's a SLR use a small aperture (large f number eg f22) but i don't think you can change that in a p&s (i'm hopeless with a p&s). you'd probably want to flip the mirror up to minimize camera movement, and use a timer or remote switch. but again, not something you can do with a p&s -- perhaps you can try using a little tripod and set it on timer? you probably can't get very close but if you shoot with with a large file size, you may be able to crop later on.

Koala_Gurl - thanks!

Lindsan - i don't know much about product photography (it's a whole new ball game to do food shots!) - you may wish to do some research on studio still photography/food photography. i've read some articles and there's A LOT of techniques involved. something VERY controlled. in fact, most of the food after the shoot probably can't be eaten (although i think i read somewhere that it's illegal to use non-food for food shots? i forgot where i heard that from).

Lindsan

08-16-2005, 03:15 AM

Ummm, thanks, I think I will since DH is a chef who likes to experiment with new dishes and often photographs his food.

I heard that the food needs to cool down a lot before shooting, but I never heard that the do something to it so that it can't be eaten. That is interesting.

greenbunny

08-16-2005, 05:37 AM

I have heard some things about food shots because a friend of mine is the head artist at a business greeting card company. She said that a lot of the food is something completely different than what it's made to look like. I don't recall many examples, but I think she said they made vanilla bean ice cream out of Crisco shortening and pepper specks.

On another note, does anyone know how to remove red-eye in Photoshop? I have 7.0 if that matters. I guess I could make a mask and do layers, but I was hoping for an easier way.

Little Angel '77

08-16-2005, 06:17 AM

Hi Greenbunny
I have heard that too :)

I use to have great examples, but I can't remember. I think they spray some food with hairspray to give it shine. THey use Crisco for Ice Cream...

Weird - huh :)

KarenS

08-16-2005, 03:19 PM

Old timers used to do things like make ice cream out of crisco, powdered sugar, and pepper - it held up better under hot lights for shooting. Depening on your use of the image, it can be illegal to use fake food, but not always, but that doesn't mean that you can't alter the food to make it look better.

For example if you look at a roasted chicken or turkey shot, they use liquid smoke and glycerine to make the skin look really brown and juicy.

IN fact glycerine is used on a lot of things to add shine, moisture, or drops of water.

Fake ice is still used in most drink shots since it reflects light better.

Tack putty holds the food on the plate or bowl so that it looks better.

Most things like hamburgers or whatnot are assemled from the "pick" of the very best meat patty (ususally browned and with ironed in grill marks, but not cooked thru), custom made buns (with sesame seeds placed by hand), and idividually chosen leaves of lettuce, etc. from a selection of hundreds.

Here's a fabulous blog and portfolio by a professional food photographer:
http://www.foodportfolio.com/blog

This is a great article on food photography
http://www.eye.net/eye/issue/issue_12.16.93/foodanddrink/fo1216.htm

And another:
http://www.silverace.com/photogenic/0204/foodphotography.html

Ummm

08-16-2005, 04:57 PM

lindsan - if your DH needs to have a food tester let me know!!! i wish i can be a food crictic :) :) :)

one 'trick' i remember the most about food photography (becuase, well, who'd have thought of it in the first place)? to get steam (eg hot coffee/chocolate with steam steaming out of the cup) - is to put a tampon in a cup of water and microwave it, then put the hot soaking wet tampon (with steam coming out of it) into the coffee!!

Koala_Gurl

08-16-2005, 05:28 PM

What is this? I have been searching on the 'net for a nice easy explaination of it...but haven't found a good site (yet.) Can anyone explain it and/or point me to a site?

Thx! :D

tlew12778

08-17-2005, 05:47 AM

OH MY GOSH, YOU HAVE TO LEARN HOW TO USE IT!

oK, START WITH THIS:
Put your camera on Manual, and a shutter speed of 125. F stop of 2.8. Then go outside and take a picture, but the f stop up and take another picture, then go get the developed. You will see how everytime you change the f stop number, you are closing the whole in your camera (your aperture) and causing less light to hit the film or chip (if you are digital). You will see the pictures get darker and darker as you close the number down. Alrighty...getting back on the bandwagon... so I downloaded my manual finally and printed out the pages I deemed necessary (ie. how to put the camera on manual focus). Then I tried doing what you said with some coins on my desk... only my shutter speeds seem to go from 16" to 1/1000. The manual says the range is from 1 to 1/1000. Can somebody explain what the 16" to 1/1000 is? What would I set it on for a shutter speed of 125? If I put the camera on 2.8 with a shutter speed of 1/125 it gives me a red exposure differential (I don't even know what that means!). Thanks.

Little Angel '77

08-17-2005, 07:32 AM

What is this? I have been searching on the 'net for a nice easy explaination of it...but haven't found a good site (yet.) Can anyone explain it and/or point me to a site?

Thx! :D

I'll attempt to explain this best I can. In digital cameras, its basically a small computer that records the information its seeing through the lens. When you hit the shutter, it records what it sees.

The way it records it, is the format. Think of saving a word document, and it saves as .doc, or a pdf file .pdf

With cameras, there are several formats you can save the information as. You can save it as a small file disgarding any information the camera "thinks" you won't need, or it can save all the information that it can.

RAW format saves ALL the information it can. Its a HUGE HUGE FILE. When you take your CF card out of your camera, and upload it, you might be uploading (depending on the camera) 13MB of picture.

RAW is a great format, because it allows you to "save" a picture. When I say Save, I mean recover. With all that data in the RAW format, you can recover highlights, bring up under exposures etc.

You also have the option in a camera, to save it as TIFF, JPEG LARGE, JPEG MEDIUM, JPEG SMALL, AND RAW pLus JPEG LARGE, RAW PLUS JPEG MEDIUM, RAW PLUS JPEG SMALL.

So you can save the file twice in your camera. Now whats the benefit of saving the file as two formats? Well, my basic understanding, is that if you have a picture, and the exposure is dead on, you can just use the JPEG file.

If you needed to recover something, you could use the RAW file.

I shoot (althought I SHOULDN'T) JPEG for my weddings. I don't have a huge supply of CF cards (I think I have 10 GIGS) and I would only get about 400 pictures out of that shooting RAW. If I shoot ten gigs Jpeg, I can get 2000 images. Normally one 1 GIG card can hold 330 pictures. Depending on the camera. Each image saves as a different size, no matter what, because its holding different information.

Does that help? Its my basic understanding.. in lay mans terms.

TLEW I am not sure what you are saying?? Did you mean MANUAL - not MANUAL FOCUS. To put your camera on MANUAL FOCUS< your going to give your eyes a workout! Use Auto.

The 16' to 1/1000th is the shutter speed the camera is using. So, if you have bright sunshine, the camera only wants the shutter open for a SMiDGE of time (as quick as it can) so it uses the FASTEST shutter speed it can. (also depending on your aperture.)

Can you try to reexplain what you were asking, I am a bit confused.

You want to play with your aperture, to see the effects you get, on MANUAL, you get to pick the aperture, and shutter speed. If you put it on AV or aperture mode, it will pick the shutter speed for you based on the lighting.

So if your outside in rbight daylight, you pick an aperture of 2.8, the camera doesn't need a whole lot of light, so its going to open and close the shutter quick - shutter speed would be 850 to 1000th of a second. My camera can go all the way up to 4000.

If you pick an aperture of 22, you are making the lens a PIN hole, (see diagram above,) and your lens needs light in, so your shutter will fall to the slower side, letting more light in, say around 125 or 200th of a second.

Let me know if this helps! I'll help as much as I can :)

Koala_Gurl

08-17-2005, 09:52 AM

Little Angel - Perfect explaination! That is what I needed to know a bit about it before looking at some of the stuff online! :)

I have a 4 GB card (DH thought biggest was best...know I can thank him!) :)

Off to find out how this RAW thing works on my camera!

Thanks for all the advice everyone has given so far! Between this thread and my "Exposures" book, I feel like I have increased my knowledge 100x!! (Well, a lot anyway!) :)

deliciousjones

08-17-2005, 12:54 PM

have a 4 GB card (DH thought biggest was best...know I can thank him!)

Awesome husband you have! For future reference, though, it's usually ideal to stick with several smaller cards. So, instead of a 4gig card, get 4 1gig cards. This way, if your card fails (and they do tend to fail), you've only lost 1gig of memory.

Koala_Gurl

08-17-2005, 01:59 PM

deliciousjones - That makes perfect sense! Next time...

(I also have a 500ish MB card that I got at Walmart...I couldn't wait for the other one to come in the mail.) :)

Little Angel '77

08-17-2005, 02:50 PM

on the flip side, just to be devils advocate, having more cards, means you might drop one or lose one. Its more to hang on to. If you put just one card in your camera, you don't have to worry about losing it or dropping it. It stays put. I have yet (knock on wood) to have a card fail on me. Lexar garentees all their cards, and says they promise if you can't retrieve your images, they will.

Koala_Gurl

08-17-2005, 03:16 PM

:) I guess I am somewhat covered...I have a big card for main use, a back up, and I will just be careful to save my pictures to my computer often (AND back up my pictures on CD...) ;)

papergirl

08-17-2005, 04:09 PM

You ladies ROCK!

Karen and Ummm, your explanations were very helpful. At this point I am assuming my macro lens is not powerful enough to capture the details I was hoping and since photography is just an interest of mine (not a profession) I don’t think I’ll be upgrading to a better lens anytime soon. This camera, which is new, is a lot better then my last and for now that makes me happy.

Thanks again.

Rebecca

papergirl

08-20-2005, 12:20 PM

I have a question for you *experienced* ladies…

I want to start using my histogram in hopes of improving my photos. I have grasped that when using it you want the chart (I don’t know how else to refer to it) to appear with the bulk of the reading in the middle. I read somewhere that it should look like a mountain. However, if everything is condensed the right or left of the box then the photo will be over or under exposed. So I’m getting that, right?

My questions is, when I am taking a photo in a natural setting and look at the histogram if my reading has everything condensed to either side, which is not what I want, then what should I do? Do I need to adjust my ISO, shutter speed, use my flash? And how do I know which to do?

Thanks,

Rebecca

emschwar

08-20-2005, 06:29 PM

We just got back from a week in alabama. I spent most of the time with my camera in manual, and I'm pretty pleased with some of the results. Nothing spectacular, but I thought I'd share anyway.

This is what happens when your baby crawls right up to you:
http://images.costcophotocenter.com/34477%3B8323232%7Ffp3%3Enu%3D3235%3E33%3B%3E437%3E WSNRCG%3D32323%3A4%3B%3C3576nu0mrj

I thought this was pretty cool - too bad I left the camera in b&w mode. :rolleyes:
http://images.costcophotocenter.com/34477%3B8323232%7Ffp5%3Enu%3D3235%3E33%3B%3E437%3E WSNRCG%3D32323%3A4%3B%3C436%3Anu0mrj

http://images.costcophotocenter.com/34477%3B8323232%7Ffp3%3Enu%3D3235%3E33%3B%3E437%3E WSNRCG%3D32323%3A4%3B%3C4489nu0mrj http://images.costcophotocenter.com/34477%3B8323232%7Ffp4%3Enu%3D3235%3E33%3B%3E437%3E WSNRCG%3D32323%3A4%3B%3C39%3B5nu0mrj

Any tips?

Also, anyone with a canon digital rebel - any tips on manual focus? I have a hell of a time being able to tell when it's focused. I've just been keeping it in AF right now, since I can never get the focus right.

And one more thing.... What would be a good (not real expensive) 2nd lens to get? And where can I find them? Thanks!

KarenS

08-20-2005, 07:19 PM

Rebecca,

You're right that you want the histogram to have a bell curve in the middle of the range - most of the time. The thing that you have to remember is that if you're shooting a scene that has a lot of black or a lot of white in it, then the curve or spike might be more to the left or the right. I am travelling right now and don't have access to upload some examples at the moment, but I will when I get home.

If the data on the histogram is running off the side on one side or the other, you need to adjust your exposure to either add more or less exposure. The steps you take to fix your exposure is the same whether you're measuring exposure by the look of the image or the histogram - exposure is exposure. So whether you adjust the ISO, the f-stop, the shutter speed, etc., is going to depend on what you want from the photo, what the situation you're working in, etc.

------------

Emily,

I buy all my gear from B&H Photo in NYC. The URL is http://www.bhphoto.com - the only thing you need to know is that the business is owned and run by Orthodox Jews, so they close the business on Friday night and don't open again until Monday morning. Also they close for the Jewish holidays and holy days. I didn't realize that when I started ordering from them and I was very confused by their "holiday schedule" at first! :) I never knew when they'd be open or closed.

For a next lens, I'd recommend the 50mm 1.8 lens. It's about $150 and it's sharp and fast and fun to use.

Karen

deliciousjones

08-21-2005, 09:41 AM

emily: i also get most of my gear from bhphoto.com except for my camera bodies. until today, i never knew why they were always closed at such random times. :rolleyes:

i ditto karen's suggestion of the 50mm f/1.8. i found it at bhphoto.com for $75. here's a linky. (http://www.bhphotovideo.com/bnh/controller/home?O=productlist&A=details&Q=&sku=12142&is=USA&addedTroughType=search)

also, my personal preference is to leave my digital cameras in color mode and convert to black and white myself. i like the tones that i get with photoshop better than the b&w tones that come out of the camera. i think there's an explanation for why the camera's tones are flat but i'm not sure what it is. karen, do you know?

bumble: there's a great book called understanding exposure which will help you understand what exposure is all about. i think that with that knowledge, everything else will fall into place for you.

emschwar

08-21-2005, 09:51 AM

What's the advantage of a 50mm f/1.8? What kind of pics is it good for?

also, my personal preference is to leave my digital cameras in color mode and convert to black and white myself. i like the tones that i get with photoshop better than the b&w tones that come out of the camera. i think there's an explanation for why the camera's tones are flat but i'm not sure what it is. karen, do you know?
Good to know. I don't notice much difference between the ones in b&w direct from the camera and the ones I turn b&w on Picture It. I'll keep an eye out though. Anyone know if photoshop is much better than Picture It? I've always like picture it (actually, we have the MS digital image pro 9), I've never been able to figure photoshop out, at least from the free trial :)

Little Angel '77

08-21-2005, 11:07 AM

What's the advantage of a 50mm f/1.8? What kind of pics is it good for?

The 50MM 1.8 is good for better depth of field ( more blurred background,) and for low light situations. When I shoot weddings, I shoot with my 85 mm and my 50 mm 1.8. I don't own a 1.4 yet, but if I had enough cash flow, I would go buy the 50MM 1.4.

deliciousjones

08-21-2005, 12:43 PM

Good to know. I don't notice much difference between the ones in b&w direct from the camera and the ones I turn b&w on Picture It. I'll keep an eye out though. Anyone know if photoshop is much better than Picture It? I've always like picture it (actually, we have the MS digital image pro 9), I've never been able to figure photoshop out, at least from the free trial

I dont know anything about Picture It (I've never heard of it or of the MS program you mentioned) but honestly, I doubt it has anywhere near the capabilities of Photoshop when it comes to working with photographs. I guess it depends on what you want to do.

I have found a HUGE difference between desaturating (or changing to B&W mode) and doing it manually with channel mixers, etc. Here is a good basic tutorial on B&W conversion with Photoshop. (http://www.popphoto.com/article.asp?section_id=4&article_id=1418&page_number=2&preview=)

What's the advantage of a 50mm f/1.8? What kind of pics is it good for?

It's a prime lens so you will find that your images will be much sharper. The large aperature will give you more wiggle room in low light situations (but watch out for super shallow depth of field).

I think that if you get it, you'll love it and end up using it for the majority of your photos.

papergirl

08-21-2005, 01:52 PM

aaa-ha, so i need to read a book. shucks! i was hoping for an easy answer. ;) maybe i'll go hunt for it this week. thanks for the recomendation.

emschwar i think your photos are great!!

on the black and white debate, it was always my understanding that *true* black and white photos have more depth then color converted to black and white. when you shoot in real black and white you're going to get a greater range of grey shades etc. when you convert color the palet of black, white, greys is limited.

sometimes photographers will "brag" that they use real black and white film and when i asked why that is the explanation i got from my father, a retired profesional photographer. my wedding photographers confirmed this but i'm going to assume unless you have been dealing with photos a long time (and of course have a great eye) then you may not notice the difference.

deliciousjones

08-21-2005, 03:37 PM

on the black and white debate, it was always my understanding that *true* black and white photos have more depth then color converted to black and white. when you shoot in real black and white you're going to get a greater range of grey shades etc. when you convert color the palet of black, white, greys is limited.

This is definitely the case with film. I think it's a bit different with digital. Let me dig up a good example...

deliciousjones

08-21-2005, 04:02 PM

ok. so there's no doubt that black and white film captures differently than color film. i'm definitely not qualified to talk about that as i'm not very familiar with the reasons why certain films look different that others. i just know they do. :)

what i was trying to explain earlier is the different ways of converting a digital color file to black and white.

most of the consumer picture programs will have an option to turn your picture to black and white. most of these simply convert the image to greyscale. i prefer to convert to black and white by using the channel mixers in photoshop which i feel gives me a little more control over tones, etc.

here is a super quick example. first, the original. second, the original converted using greyscale. third, the image converted using the channel mixers.

http://www.plamann.net/misc/original.jpg

http://www.plamann.net/misc/difference.jpg

papergirl

08-21-2005, 06:10 PM

This is definitely the case with film. I think it's a bit different with digital. Let me dig up a good example...

gotcha. i was thinking film and the original poster was talking digital. my bad.

is that your daughter chris? she is TOO cute.

Koala_Gurl

08-21-2005, 06:27 PM

RE: 50mm lens... - GREAT lens! I am new to this stuff, but this lens was recommended to me, and I can't say enough about it! :) (Coming from a P&S...I thought the kit lens was great, but this is even better!)

Understanding Exposure - I have just started this book, and so far I am really enjoying it (and learning so much!) Highly recommend this as well!

Telephoto / Zoom lens?? - OK, having fun with the 50mm, and was thinking of adding a telephoto lens (perhaps asking as a Christmas present). Is this a wise next purchase and any recommendations? I would love to do both close ups (e.g. baby body parts or something like that), and zooming to distant objects. Thanks! :)

deliciousjones

08-21-2005, 06:40 PM

Telephoto / Zoom lens??

I know many people who swear by the Canon 70-200mm f/2.8. I found that lens to be quite heavy and it's also quite pricey. About $1300, I think.

You can purchase non-Canon lenses for substantially less but make sure to research and read reviews. Some lenses are better than others. I have a Tamron that I love love love, but I know of other Tamron lenses that suck, suck, suck. :)

Koala_Gurl

08-21-2005, 09:00 PM

Yeah, that might be a little out of my price range (unless I get into this stuff seriously!) But, I will do some research for a cheaper one.

Any others??

KarenS

08-22-2005, 01:19 AM

For a lens after the 50mm one, I'd recommend either a 20mm (if you want to go wider) or the 100mm macro (if you want to shoot closeup and get farther away). The 100mm is a little slower to focus, but it's a wonderfully sharp lens and the macro feature is fabulous for shooting close up!

As far as the difference between "true" b&w and converted b&w - I shudder when I hear some of the information out in the wilds of the Internet about this. There's so much misinformation and confusion - not that I'm a *expert*, but I've shot film and digital, I still shoot some b&w film and do my own developing and printing, and I shoot all digitial and convert for my clients. So I consider myself to have a pretty good knowledge base here, if not an expert.

If you shoot color film and print to b&w using traditional printing methods (wet process chemicals, enlarger, etc.) you lose tonality. The paper that is used to print b&w images from color film is (IMO) flat and low contrast and it results in a very flat looking print, that's true. If you take a color negative and scan it or start with a color digital image it is possible to convert the image so that even a seasoned pro looking at it cannot tell the difference between a b&w film image and a b&w digital image. However, probably 90% of all photographers including a lot of professional photographers do NOT do that with their images. Quite frankly it would be too intensely time co