Charting to Avoid Volume 4 -- No babies right now!

[kemaji]

Reenie - Congrats on the chartiversary!

I feel like I haven't been hanging around here as much lately - I guess life has been very busy lately. I'm still charting - it's still working for us :-) and I'm still TTA for a while. It's hard though, because my sis just got pg and that makes us want to be pg even more...

I haven't been around much either, we were in CA visiting my parents last week and got back Friday evening, then we drove up to DH's parent's to pick our dog up. Charting is still working for us as well, although I was majorly slacking last cycle with being sick and then travelling. I really need to get back into a regular pattern.

We've been talking about putting off TTC for about a year (we had orginally planned to start next July, but I've been thinking about going to grad school and if I do that, I don't think I'll be able to handle a full time job, school and being pg/having a small baby. Ironically, now that DH is okay with that, I'm feeling a bit of regret in having to put off TTC until potentially 2008. It is hard wanting and not wanting something at the same time.

Updated to here.

[21daisygurl]

Sigh...I also haven't been around much lately.
I am on CD 72 I think. I have lost count. DH and I are starting to talk about TTC and how it will go when we start trying. Our starting date will be Aug 2008 b/c then I will be in the last term of my Master's program.
We are being pretty pessimistic about my cycles. I don't mean to be but it is hard when you know what your body is like.
I have been on the vitex for a few weeks now. So maybe by Valentines time it will have kicked in and help me regualte a bit. I hope so!

[tlew12778]

Daisy - you can ask to be tested for insulin resistance (althhough, from your avatar it doesn't look like you have that problem). They can regulate IR with metformin, which would in turn regulate your cycles. You can also try regulating your diet. I actually read a book called The PCOS Diet Book and it had a lot of useful in it.

[Clattercote]

KRL626 - Hmmm - what did your temps do? If you noticed even somewhat of a shift, I'd probably venture toward calling that spotting AF, even though it was light. What are things looking like now? Have you seen any more fertile CM?

Reenie - TTC decisions depend very much on our current job situation - if things go one way, we'll TTC in January but if they go another way, we'll be waiting to TTC till at least September 2007 if not later. It's tough waiting - but it is coming up relatively soon, even if we wait till September...

[KRL626]

Clattercote I haven't been temping. I figured it would be a bit unrealistic to bother with it until I actually get an AF (I delivered DS 10 1/2 mo. ago and I'm breast feeding him.) Right now not much going on in the CM department. So I'm really not sure.

[21daisygurl]

Daisy - you can ask to be tested for insulin resistance (althhough, from your avatar it doesn't look like you have that problem). They can regulate IR with metformin, which would in turn regulate your cycles. You can also try regulating your diet. I actually read a book called The PCOS Diet Book and it had a lot of useful in it.


Tlew: I acutally do have bad blood sugar issues, but they go in the opposite direction! I have severe hypoglycemia (I faint at the drop of a hat). My normal fasting blood sugar is around 2.0 and my Blood sugar 1hr post meal is about 4.0. I used to have to take my blood sugar levels daily and have had two glucose tests.
I do however have trouble with my weight. I was at my healthy norm at the wedding at after the wedding, I went off the pill and packed on 25lbs! (I am only 5'3" so that is a fair amount). So, I am regulating my diet to loose the weight but it is an uphill battle. I work out a minimum of 3 x/week.

I dont' know what to do now. I don't know at what point I go to the doctor for a med to bring on AF. I know a lot of people say 3 months, but I know if I go, I will just have this problem next cycle.

Perhpas if I go to see about meds to bring on AF, I will see what other meds she can put me on.

[raven077]

Anyone else have problems with their BD BBT thermometer? Since I started temping in March, I've replaced the battery once and the low battery symbol just flashed at me again yesterday. I temp, then press the button again to turn it off. (I retain the reading in my head for when I get oup later). Does that waste the battery faster than letting it go off by itself? I'd have to turn it back on again anyway to get the reading later if I have to do it that way.

Argh this is so frustrating! Stoopid battery. Stoopid thermometer.

[heather1029]

Ack, my temps are crazy this month! I'm surprised since last cycle was so textbook. I wonder if the stress of Thanksgiving has pushed back my ovulation date. Wowy.

http://www.fertilityfriend.com/home/166fc1

[LeslieandPaul]

i've been getting really low temps, but I'm not sure if it's from the cold weather, or if the battery is dying (no indication of that). I have another thermometer that was giving me slightly higher readings. The problem is, I can't get the battery out on the one i usually use.
I had the strangest AF last month (i'm on day 10 or so right now). I had about 7 days of spotting, 2 days of flow and then about 4 more days of spotting. It may be from one of the supplements i'm taking, but I'm stopping it.

[Reenie]

tlew Thanks for the tip about the progesterone. I already had an inkling on that, so I've looked into progesterone creams. What do you think of those? Obviously, I know that pills would be better... How would I get my doctor to prescribe progesterone? Could I simply ask for it?

[Clattercote]

Reenie - I wouldn't say pills are necessarily better (I'm not sure I even knew that progesterone came in a pill form) - but what is helpful is that the doc is helping you figure out what dosage to use with the progesterone. I have a prescription for progesterone in a cream form, and I worked with my doctor for about 6 months to get the dosage right for my cycle... I'd say it depends on the doc for how well it would work to just ask for it - An NFP/FAM friendly doc is probably more likely to prescribe it.

[PugLover]

I would like to join. I was a member of this thread back in the WC day's as JulAmber (am actually on the first post as a TTA Master :) ) and am back to join again.

PugLover (formerly JulAmber) (http://www.fertilityfriend.com/home/25e5a)
Real name: Julia, 27
DH's name: Josh, 28
Occupation: Office Coordinator at an Ad Agency
Married: April 20, 2002
Started charting: June 2002
TTC: not sure I will


I don't know how active I will be able to be in here but wanted to join anyway.
I also wanted to know if anyone in here has charted after a miscarriage. I have finally recovered from a 2nd D&C (for the same pregnancy) and am ready to start charting again to see if my body will return to normal.

[tlew12778]

Reenie - I suppose it depends on how open your dr is to FAM in general. I mean, you'd have to explain why you think you need it and it's likely he or she would want to confirm it with blood work before prescribing progesterone.

As for pills vs creams, I have no idea if there is a benefit of one over the other. When they put me on it to bring on AF the package said it could also be used for first trimester spotting. I was on the pill form.

[FSUSammy]

Hey ladies. Don't know if you all remember me or not. It's been awhile since I've been on this thread. I moved over to TTC but it hasn't been easy for us. I wanted to stop by because today marks my year anniversary of charting. Woohoo! In the year I've learned a lot about my body. I've only managed to have 8 AF's, but not a full 8 cycles. I also learned because of charting that I have irregular cycles, some anovulatory, some not. Thanks to that knowledge I was able to go to my doctor's and eventually was diagnosed with PCOS. It's been quite a journey this last year but I do know that once we do conceive I will definitely be back here when we are ready to avoid again. Charting is such a great thing and I just wish that I would have learned this back in school because I would have avoided going on the pill altogether.

Hope you ladies are doing well. Just wanted to drop by today because if it weren't for this thread I wouldn't have continued charting and wouldn't have learned EVERYTHING I know now!

Sam

[motray36]

Hi eveyone....

I really stink at sticking with charting. There always seems to be something that gets in the way - but I've been at it for 2 years now - you'd think it would be a habit I couldn't break!! My cell phone (which doubles as my alarm clock) broke right before we went to Italy, so no temping for me over the past 2 weeks. Grrr. We did UDD because we were irresponsible and got swept up in a moment (ok, three moments) while away. So who the heck knows. Somebody kick my butt back into shape!! What happened to my type-A personality and overly organized self?? I have my annual gyn appt today, so I am hoping that her typical lack of support for charting will frustrate me so much that I get back into full gear!!

Enough of my vent and plee for help!

raven007 - My BD themometer battery lasted about 1 year and a half...but I know some people have had weird thermometer issues - you may just want to get a new one

heather1029 - stress can definitely delay an "O"...what a shift from that very nice looking chart last cycle!

LeslieandPaul - Weather can do it - did you recently start the supplements that it would cause a change or have you been on them for a while?


PugLover - Welcome :) I'm so sorry to hear about the D&C's...a friend of mine just went through one, know you're in my thoughts and prayers

FSUSammy - Thanks for stopping by! Maybe your post is what I need to get back in gear!!!

[TheMarieke]

Raven, I'm considering getting a new therm also (after I try replacing the battery). My BD therm does weird things every once in a while.

If you haven't had the therm for a year yet, it could be that the battery got dislodged...that happens with mine every once in a while. Just hold it upside down (so you can see where you take the battery out) and whack it firmly your hand or something not too hard. That should fix it.


I'm not sure when I O'd last cycle (I'm on CD2 of the next cycle now...it's the cycle that started 11/5). We UDD on CD 4 and FF is calling O on CD10, but I'm not sure I agree, but it's definitely possible. The thing is, I had fertile CM till at least CD11 (CD12 was also pretty fertile, but it was borderline creamy/watery). The open circle on CD12 was lack of sleep (we went to a concert the night before), but I had about 4 hours sleep before temping.

FF kept going back and forth between calling O on CD10 and CD13.

Also, my luteal phase is typically 11-12 days, and Oing on CD 10 would give me a 14 day LP. I typically O on CD12-13.

Anyway, if you could take a look at my chart, I'd appreciate it. I don't want to end up with a surprise later on if I O early like this again. We only UDD to CD4, and I''m wondering if we should stop at CD3 (not that we typically UDD that much CD1-3 anyway :(

[kemaji]

PugLover, welcome! To answer your question, I'm not sure if anyone currently in the TTA thread has miscarried and started charting to avoid, but I know that clzj did. She has since gone on to TTC and I believe she has gotten pregnant again.

Hi Sam! I definitely remember you, I'll add you to our list of masters.

TheMarieke, what is your post-O range generally? 98.1 for a pre-O temp seems to be awfully high, but then you have two days of fertile CM after that first high temp. If it were me, I'd probably call O on CD13, but my CM dry up is one of the most consistent things about my chart and I'd feel comfortable with following those signs above the others.

Updated to here.

[TheMarieke]

Kemaji, good point, I didn't even think about my temp ranges. FF's coverline is definitely low for me. My coverline is usually 98.1-3. a temp of 98.1 is typically pre-O (or getting close to O), whereas if I get a temp of 98.2, I've O'd (I usually have one temp jump to 98.2ish and then back down just after AF, though).

I would say my pre-O range is 97.6-98.1 and my post-O is 98.2-98.9 (with one exception higher in the middle of the first phase, and sometimes one exception lower in the LP, usually towards the end).

In that case, CD13 would make more sense (and my CM is pretty reliable also... as long as I'm paying attention!).

[kemaji]

Well, knowing your pre- and post-O ranges definitely makes me more comfortable about calling O on CD13.

[TheMarieke]

Thanks Kemaji!

Now to figure out how to override FF....

[21daisygurl]

Still here: CD 76 I think now

I have a consult at a homeopath on Monday. i can't wait. My PCOS symptoms are getting annoying and I feel very frustrated with my anovulation.

Raven: My BD thermometer hasn't given me any issues so far but it is only a few months old.

Marieke: Override on FF by going to ANALYSIS. At the bottom of the options it has a "TUNING/OVERRIDE" function. :)

[southerner]

Had to shoutout to FSUsammy. We started charting right around the same time. I remember you were new to it and I joined this thread a few weeks after you. We ended up asking a lot of the same questions, I remember that. I always got a kick out of the people who got excited about their chartiversaries. However, as mine is approaching, I have to admit, it's a cool feeling :o CC charting master. I don't feel like one, though. I've had an uneventful run at charting. I feel bad for a lot of people, so I'm not around that often. I don't know as much as I should to be a true master, but I'll take it ;)

I think I may start lurking in the TTC charting thread. We're looking at this summer ::nervous::

[21daisygurl]

I agree...It must be cool to have chartiversaries!
I think I will make it to one year (or even 2 years), though not by being careful. When you don't ovulate there isn't much chance of getting pregnant. DH seems to think the odds of getting me pregnant are on his side. LOL. Wow will he ever get a shock when one day I show up with a BFP. hehe.

[tgr68]

CD 13. Nothing too exciting going on. I don't think I'm anywhere near O because while I've had a couple of days of CM, the last two days have been dry.

[TheMarieke]

Thank you Daisygurl!

Chartiversaries are fun! I can't wait till I have my first TTA chartiversary (aka, our wedding anniversary). I'm not sure which I should consider my real Chartiversary, since I kinda have two :p ...one for when I started charting in May 2005 (but wasn't DTD), and then one when we *actually* started TTA (ie: got married and had sex :D )

[heather1029]

Argghhg!!! I'm so frustrated with this stinking chart! Plus, my face is breaking out like CRAZY and I'm nowhere near my period.

http://www.fertilityfriend.com/home/166fc1

This is my third cycle off BCP and you'd figure it would be getting clearer, not crazier! Last month's chart was so pretty :confused:

[PookiePrincess]

Heather, I can sympathize. My first two cycles off BCP were pretty by the book. The 3rd and 4th were just plain wacky, with one of them being anovulatory. Give it some time and it should be back to normal.

[heather1029]

Kristi, thanks for replying. I wonder why it happens like that. You'd figure the first two cycles would be nuts with your body trying to work without added hormones. I'm guessing this cycle may be annovulatory too, which would suck.

[raven077]

Thanks for the answers, ladies. :) I'll try "whacking" it first and see what happens.

[Reenie]

We're looking at this summer ::nervous::

Us, too, southerner! And I think we may have started TTA at the same time as you all?

Do you think the following warrants a call to the doctor?
I have had spotting during DTD sometimes. It is not painful, so I don't think DH is bumping into my cervix or anything... I'm not sure. I looked up post-coital spotting (because I couldn't find anything on coital spotting), and it was terrifying (things about STDs, cervical dysplasia, etc., etc.). I know that I do not have an STD and I had a "clean" pap smear at my annual visit this July, so I'm sort of confused. Plus, at my doctor's office, if you want to leave a message for a doctor to call you back (before you just go ahead and make yourself an appointment), you have to leave the message with an actual person instead of in his/her voicemail box... should I say that I have post-coital spotting or be more "laymen's terms" about it?

[tlew12778]

I would go get it checked out actually. I mean, it can't hurt, especially since you want to TTC soon anyway. You could also mention that to your dr just so he knows.

Re: the STD testing - Just bc tests show up negative does not mean they always are. Some STDs don't show up for years, which is why it's important we all get tested on a regular basis. I actually had chlamydia show up like 3 years after I broke up with my POS ex :rolleyes:.

[FEIrider]

Hi ladies-

I'm mainly a lurker, but need some advice now. I'm on CD49 & still no O. When should I call the doc? I'm not coming off BCPs & have been charting for a year and a half, so I know I typically O around CD28. Here's my chart (http://www.fertilityfriend.com/home/a14d2) if anyone wants to take a peek. I've never had a annov cycle before & I haven't been under anymore stress than usual...maybe less stress actually! Based on the chart & the fact that DH & I haven't UDD, I seriously doubt I'm pg, but quite literally, everyone around me is, so I'm fighting the neurotic impulse to go buy a HPT.;)

The only thing I can think of is that I was sick at the end of Oct & lost 5lbs. I still haven't gained it back & I'm small, so maybe that could be it.

TIA!:)

[RobertsButton]

This is such a great resource since I feel like I've been flying by the seat of my pants! BCP was thrown out the window a month ago and I have charted consistently for one month, understanding things may be wacky for up to three cycles. I do have one very odd question that I am hoping you might be able to assist with.

Last April I had my thyroid removed due to cancer. As a result, I've been put on a daily thyroid hormone replacement to compensate for what my body doesn't produce. I am wondering if this may impact my temps or anything about my cycle. My synthetic hormone levels have been fine-tuned so I am no longer hypo or hyperthyroid. Technically, my body should be functioning as it has all along. But I thought I would throw it out there just in case. Of course, I will chat with my doc at my next appointment to verify. But I don't want to wait that long. :rolleyes:

Thanks!!
e.

[Reenie]

FEIrider I don't know, it kind of looks to me like maybe you did have O but didn't have a huge temp increase, and then all of that stuff you're calling EWCM with spotting (Days 37-43) was actually a light period. If so, then I'd say you're in a new cycle. Are you sure that you're checking your CM accurately? That is a lot of days to have EWCM. Additionally, you could have simply delayed O due to the illness or weight loss.

Hi RobertsButton. :) (sorry I can't help with the synthetic hormone info).

[Reenie]

tlew Thanks for the response. I am positive that I do not have an STD because my doc did a comprehensive at my Pap smear in July since we'll be TTCing before I see him again... I was sure things would come back fine (DH and I have been together since 1999), and they did, so I'm sure it's still fine. But I am going to go ahead and call tomorrow, because I've continued to have very minimal, almost nonexistent spotting since that started this week.

[lil_geek]

RobertsButton - I'm not 100% sure... but from things I have read, if you are hyper or hypo your temps will be either higher or lower (not sure which way does what... my mom was hyperand had radiation and is now hypo and on Synth***(?)). So, I would THINK if your hormone balance on they synthetic hormones is 'in balance' your temps will be too.


That was VERY in eloquent.... I hope it makes sense..... if not, someone else take a stab at wording what I am trying to say!

[tlew12778]

RobertsButton - In the back of TCOYF there is a chart with various meds and how they can affect your temps and CM.

[heather1029]

I think I have finally ovulated. Thank God. I will wait until I see tomorrow's temp to know for sure.

Otherwise, I'm a mess! My face is covered in blemishes -- seriously, every milimeter is covered (and let's not forget my neck and chest). Oh, and my boobs are sore as heck and have been for days. What is up with my body? Someone tell it to calm itself down and learn to regulate! Those BCPs really created a monster. I hope its effects die down soon...

[Clattercote]

FEIrider - The temps are too low to be pg temps, I'm thinking - your chart looks to me like a long cycle with a BTB pattern (breakthrough bleeding/spotting, which you noticed for several days). So I'm guessing O is still to come... As for talking to your doc, I think that depends on your own comfort level. I've had a 120 day cycle before, and I knew that was due to a vast amount of stress at work, and so I didn't go in. And sure enough, my cycle went back to regular pretty quickly. Losing weight could do it - though I'm hesitant to say that's the definite reason.

[21daisygurl]

I think I remember someone mentioning issues w/ the BD thermometer.

Mine was working great but the last 3 weeks I have been getting the exact same temps: 97.1 & 97.3.
So i decided to test it at night. I had DH use it and he got (surprise surprise) 97.3.
Yesterday I was really nauseated, and I wanted to see if I had a fever, so I took my temp: 95.1 (um...not right at all). I repeated the temp: Got the same reading. So I check with my other basal thermometer and get 98.1.
However, my BD thermometer isn't reading that the battery is low and I even switched the batteries between the two thermometers and they read the same thing. So what is wrong w/ my BD thermometer?

I decided this morning to just use the older thermometer b/c it is reading more accurately.

Has anyone else had their BD thermometer act like it was possessed???

[Reenie]

heather My face did that when I first got off BCP, too. It calmed down after a couple of cycles, and while I still have some symptoms that I hadn't had on BCP (a few pimples, back pain, swollen breasts), I will take it over the BCPs. I wish I never would have gotten on them in the first place.

daisygurl I don't have a BD thermometer, and I know that everyone swears by them, but I've never had trouble with my trusty Walgreens brand. I love that it saves the last four temps. If I could upgrade the Walgreens brand, I would put a light in it and make it temp in one minute rather than three. But those are really just silly things when I think that it's doing the job it's supposed to be doing.

I had another episode of post-coital spotting this week, so I called the doctor, who basically told me that he couldn't say over the phone (which I already knew) but that that sort of spotting usually indicates any number of things (all of which I had already read about on WebMD) and that he wanted to see me this week. So I am going on Thursday afternoon, and I'm kind of nervous.

[Clattercote]

Reenie - Best wishes at the doc!

[Reenie]

Thanks, Clattercote! (ETA: Happy Birthday! :D )

And on that note, (I know we've been wishy-washy :rolleyes: ), because of this issue and the probable issue with my progesterone levels, DH and I are finished with TTA until we have DC #1. We won't start actively TTC until July just because we'll be hoping to be lucky on our first couple of cycles of actual TTC, but since we figure it might take a while, we're done with actively TTA now. We will be moving to an actual SWH stance (not timing BD, etc) until July 2007, when we will actively TTC. I will let you know what happens at the doc simply because it's curious. And I hope you won't mind if I come in and ask a question or two from time to time. :)

[tgr68]

Congrats, Reenie on SWH!! Definately keep us updated!

I have been such a crank-butt today. :( That usually means AF will soon be here. I'm only 5 DPO, so I hope this mood doesn't last another week! Ick!

[PookiePrincess]

Congrats Reenie! I'll be joining ya soon!

[Sue]

Congrats Reenie! Good luck!

My temps have been all over the place, first I left the heat on overnight, last night I had very broken sleep... This is NOT going to be a fun cycle. I should be O'ing soon or already O'd - If I amd going to O at all. What I have noticed, is that I don't get a lot of EWCM, and usually it arrives late at night. The last couple of cycles I've been awake late and have noticed it. But this cycle I have moved from sticky yet...

[kemaji]

Congratulations, Reenie! Good luck and keep us updated!.

Updated to here.

[mobe63]

I'm new! To CC, to Charting, and the being off BCP. Still trying to figue this whole thing out. We will be TTA for a few years (if successful) I want to finish school before having little ones.

[lil_geek]

Does anyone prefer Ovusoft or Fertility Friend more?

I have been using FF since it's free.... but I downloaded OS and put my current cycle in.. and I wonder if I may like it more. I don't have much CM yet and OS seemed to use the little information I had a little better then FF just giving (or not giving) me an O date.

Also, anyone on here have 'delayed temp shifts'? This is only cycle 3... but I noticed what I peg as my peak day the last 2 cycles is a few days before any temp shift (this month my temp hasn't gone up dramatically yet... but it's climbing slowly sort of like last month). I feel like I O'd Friday or Saturday

FF chart

http://www.fertilityfriend.com/home/15c0db

OS (for some reason - trial? - I coulnd't upload... so here is a screen shot. All DTD is protected.. but I didn't get that far in the system yet)

http://www.imagestation.com/picture/sraid220/pa9ef6a32f2914d91660fd74ef9684b49/eba7a566.jpg

[kemaji]

Welcome mobe63! If you want to post your stats I can add them to our roster on the first few pages.

***

As for me, my cycle seems to have gotten back to what is normal. After my last one, where I was sick for half of it, it is nice to have something predictable again. I've been working on my grad school application and I'm pretty excited about the prospect of taking the next step career-wise.

Unfortunately (sort of), that means that we are definitely pushing back TTC for another year. I probably won't be completely finished with my MBA when we do start trying, but as long as I'm done before a possible baby arrives, I'll be fine. The good news that I just found our regarding my schooling is that my company has upped their tuition reimbursement to the IRS maximum of $5600/year. I'm excited about that, because they'll cover up to 80% of my costs (up to $5600/year), depending on how well I do.

[kemaji]

lil_geek -- I've used both and while I'm currently using FF, I definitely prefer Ovusoft. Per your chart above, I would put CD17 as your potential O day, provided you get one more temperature above your coverline.

[LeslieandPaul]

I don't know what is going on. FF called O when there was a "dip" but the two following temps were taken at a later time of day. Any ideas of when o was, or if this was possibly annovulatory?My Chart (http://www.fertilityfriend.com/home/977c7)

[tgr68]

Leslie&Paul~I don't think you've O'ed. I just don't see any clear indicators of it.

[kissmary]

Leslie, I don't think you've O'd yet either. Your temp is not above your usual coverline (at least from the last cycle).

[mobe63]

my stats:
Real name: Bethany (23)
DH's name: Morgan (23)
Occupation: student (Pre-Pharmacy hopefully Pharmacy Fall 2007)
Married: June 3, 2005
Started charting: December 4, 2006
TTC: 2009-2011

[mobe63]

i have a question about being asleep for 3 hours before taking temp. My dog woke me up to go out at 5 am and then i woke up at 7 this morning. is this a big problem, my temp was about the same as the past 2 days.

[PookiePrincess]

mobe, I'd say if it's in the same range even without the 3 hours of uninterrupted sleep, record it but maybe make a note of it (just in case).

For some people the continuous sleep matters, for some it doesn't. I can wake up several times at night and mine is usually okay.

[21daisygurl]

Kemaji! That is exciting! I know how exciting it is to take the next step career wise. I just started my Master's of Nursing this past fall and I am pretty excited!
Good luck on the applications. :)

[21daisygurl]

Well, I got my provera prescription. I am going to take it in the new year and bring on AF. It is time to end this cycle. Although I am 99% sure I will just have this type of cycle again.

[Reenie]

Thanks for the well-wishes, everybody.

Quoting myself here:
had another episode of post-coital spotting this week, so I called the doctor, who basically told me that he couldn't say over the phone (which I already knew) but that that sort of spotting usually indicates any number of things (all of which I had already read about on WebMD) and that he wanted to see me this week. So I am going on Thursday afternoon, and I'm kind of nervous.
I will let you know what happens at the doc simply because it's curious
I went to my regular doctor (FP) on Thursday, and he talked to me for a while and explained what he planned to do that day (internal exam, some cultures for STDs [which I had in July at my annual pap and which were clear, and which I am sure are still clear], and a vaginal ultrasound). But then he did the internal and said that he changed his mind, he wasn't going to do an U/S. He scheduled an appointment for me with a women's reproductive health specialist for January 4 (he wanted to do December 21, but I should have AF then, and then their offices will be closed for the holidays [I'll be OOT, anyway, but we would've stayed home if need be]). He wants her to give a second opinion and do a colposcopy. He gave me a dx of cervical ectropion (basically, my cervix is elongated) with some sort of inflammation (he thinks that maybe I have columnar cells there rather than flat cells). Anyway, if this new doctor seconds what he said, she will probably perform a procedure in which she will "paint" the cells of the cervix with a solution and use a special light to view them. The cells that look normal will be left alone, and the others will be cauterized. I am nervous, but apparently, this procedure (if everything is what Dr #1 believes) is an out-patient thing that should not affect fertility. I hope so.

[Sue]

Reenie, I've had a colposcopy and a biopsy and cryosugery (I had irregular paps for quite a long time). It's not bad just a little uncomfortable.

Well this cycle has been wacky, temps high, no CM really... I haven't been feeling well, so I'm thinking that's the probelm. I'm not sure if I O'd, I've had some lotiony CM, but not as much as I usually do. When I adjust Ovusoft to call O with temp only, it says I O'd on CD11, which is a bit early for me. I'm just waiting for this cycle to end.

[akacharlotte]

Reenie-I had a colposcopy last November for an abnormal pap and like Sue said it is not bad more uncomfortable. Take a few motrin or advil with you to take right after your procedure. I got a little crampy afterwards.

If possible I've become more diligent with my chart as we will move to TTC in May. I have my annual scheduled with a new OB/GYN for January 5th. I'm taking my charts and my lists of questions to ask as this will be the last visit before TTC unless I have another abnormal pap. I can't believe we are moving to TTC in 5 months! I'm so excited!

[tlew12778]

The colposcopy is actually just a "look around" type of exam. The colposcope is the special micoscope used to look at the "paint" to see if anything has illuminated. The biopsy (should they decide to do one) is the uncomfortable part as they actually take a sample of your cervix.

[tgr68]

Back on CD 1 here.

I need to starts looking for a new OB/GYN as mine is retiring. Do you know of anywhere I could find a list of questions to "interview" for a new doc. I would really like to use one of the two at the hospital where DH works, but I don't just want to pick on blindly either.

[akacharlotte]

The colposcopy is actually just a "look around" type of exam. The colposcope is the special micoscope used to look at the "paint" to see if anything has illuminated. The biopsy (should they decide to do one) is the uncomfortable part as they actually take a sample of your cervix.

I did not realize that. I had the biopsy which is the uncomfortable aspect.

[21daisygurl]

Merry Christmas to me....

Christmas eve will be CD 100! UGH....

[akacharlotte]

Back on CD 1 here.

I need to starts looking for a new OB/GYN as mine is retiring. Do you know of anywhere I could find a list of questions to "interview" for a new doc. I would really like to use one of the two at the hospital where DH works, but I don't just want to pick on blindly either.

I don't have a list of questions. Although the one I plan on asking at my visit next month will be regarding her thoughts on charting. I usually go with word of mouth from friends/relatives on finding a new OB/GYN. I like to have one face-to-face visit under my belt to determine how the doc and I relate before I determine they are not the right fit for me.

Did you try a google search?

21daisygurl-I'm sorry. :( Have you contacted your GYN? Is he/she offering any guidance or help?

[21daisygurl]

Thanks akacharlotte: She prescribes Provera but I am waiting till the holiday s are over to take it in case I feel ill on it. My mom was violently ill on it so I want to make sure I am home when I take it. :(

[tlew12778]

tgr - is your DH a dr? That is how I find all my drs. I start asking around amongst his colleagues. I want ppl who know their stuff to recommend other ppl they hold in high esteem. I actually go to a gyn that is the gyn of a few of his fellow coworkers. That said, I would NEVER go to a gyn that is a friend of DH's or a close coworker. Ppl in the medical community talk way too much amongst themselves.

[tgr68]

tlew12778~Nope. DH works as an accountant for the hospital. He just started there in Nov, so he doesn't know alot of the medical staff. However, it is the closest hospital (whose staff I haven't heard horror stories about) that deliver. :(

[Reenie]

akacharlotte, tlew12778, tgr68 Thanks for the info and reassurance about the colposcopy and accompanying procedure. It makes me feel a little better that this has happened for other people (because it seems more "normal" if that makes sense).

[southerner]

Coming by to ask to be moved to a charting master. My chartiversary is this week.

Reenie, good luck in SWH and with the colposcopy. Hope to see you around the boards!

Welcome mobe!

Lil-Geek, I prefer FF b/c I enter my temps on random computers sometimes. Also, I just got used to using it during my trial, so I stuck with it. I was overwhelmed enough as it was when I started charting, and was too afraid to try something new.

[Clattercote]

Congratulations on your chartiversary, Southerner!

[tlew12778]

Congrats Southerner!

Merry Christmas everyone!

[PookiePrincess]

Congratulations Southerner on your chartiversary!

[tgr68]

Congrats Southerner!!!

I hope everyone had/is having a great holiday!!

[Sue]

Congratulations Southener!

[mobe63]

I don't know what is going on. My temps are all over the place, no CM. I dont know if i have O'ed. Does anyone have any insight? This is the first cycle off BCP, so I guess this is my bodys way of getting rid of hormones! http://www.fertilityfriend.com/home/17a0cc

[tlew12778]

What are all the open circles? Did you temp at a different time? If so, have you adjusted the temps?

[kemaji]

southerner -- Congrats on your chartiversary!

mobe63 -- I was going to ask the same question about the open circles.

Updated to here.

[mobe63]

Ok I found the answer to the open circle question (sort of )
Open Circles and Dots:
If something in the data indicates that the temperature may be slightly inaccurate (either by events selected in the Special data area or by a time difference larger than normal), the temperature is plotted using a circle instead of a dot. Please note that these points do not need to be discarded. The circle will just indicate to the reader areas on the chart where the data may be less accurate.

However, except for 2 the times are the same as normal so i am jsut eally confussed

southerner..congrats on chariversary

[tlew12778]

I did think it was the drinking at first but you have days you drank and no open circle... but the alcohol could explain the spike on CD 14 and CD20... in which case you would be post-O right now (probably... it'd be sort of uncertain due to the remaining open circles). Regardless you shouldn't have UDD until at least 3 cycles of charting so it makes no difference anyway.

[mobe63]

I have had 3 days with high temps, so i think i have O'ed!!! (no EWCM). Lets hope charting gets eaiser and less confussing

[tlew12778]

Well... let me be the first to tell you to never, ever rely on temps alone. Too many factors can influence your BBT so you need to watch out for the other signs as well. Also, while I never trust anyone's interpretation of their cervical position (not even my own) you say yours was low, firm and closed when you would have o'ed. That, in combination with the fact that you had no fertile CM (no surprise after the BCP), is why FF will not confirm O and why I am pretty sure none of us here will either.

This is one of those wait and see games. Like I said before, I would NOT UDD.

[tlew12778]

Separate post for a separate question...

I am a community leader on iVillage, therefore I browse their boards every now and then (well other than my own I mean). Today I went over to their FAM board just to see what type of board it was (it never interested me in the past bc it was one of those "I think you O'ed! Congrats!" boards when there was clearly no O in sight...). Today, the CL of the board was telling a girl who is TTA that the rule is earliest O - 5 days for latest UDD. What book says that? It seems REALLY risky to me considering there are members of CC who have gotten PG 6 days after sex. She also failed to mention that if you see fertile CM that rule goes out the window...

[southerner]

kemaji, do you mind updating my stats on page one? TIA!

Name: southerner, 31
DH: 32
Married:August 2003
Started Charting: December 2005
TTC: Spring/Summer 2007

[21daisygurl]

Happy Holidays everyone! I hope everyone is relaxing and enjoying the holidays.

tlew: I think that rule is a mangled version of the rule in TCOYF. I agree...that is VERY risky!

As for me, I am on day 3 of my progesterone. It is making me feel awful but I am luckily on holidays and doing little around the house. It is my first holiday without having to work through it (being a bedside nurse was NOT good for holidays!). So I only have 2 days left of hormones, and hopefully AF will come in a couple of weeks. My temps haven't gone up very high with the progesterone. I have a coverline b/c the pills raised my temps a bit but not as high as I would have expected.

Anyway, hope everyone is well
:)

[tlew12778]

Really? What dosage are taking? I thought the standard was 100mg for 10 days.

[21daisygurl]

I am taking 5mg for 5 days by mouth.
I have only heard of people taking 5 - 10 mg for 5 - 10 days by mouth.
100 mg would likely make me keel over! LOL

[akacharlotte]

Also, while I never trust anyone's interpretation of their cervical position (not even my own) you say yours was low, firm and closed when you would have o'ed.

I rarely record cervical position because to me it always seems to be in the same position and feels the same. Occassionally I'll notice a slight difference but honestly it is too hard to tell. I'm going to ask my doctor about it on Friday just to get her take on the subject.

I was bad and I missed temping two days in a row this weekend plus I consumed alcohol twice this weekend. I O'd on CD18 so I'm not too concerned I missed my temp.

I've consumed more alchohol in the past two weeks than I have in the last 4 months. Of course I don't drink that much anyway. How can one resist such yummy wine at this time of year? ;)

Happy New Year to all! Congrats to Southerner for her chartiversary.

Threadmistress-please update my stats. Thx
Real name: Stacey(34)
BF's name: Jason (31)
Occupation: Insurance Claims
Married: May 2007
Started charting (date, if known): 01/06
Occupation: Insurance claims
TTC: May 2007

[akacharlotte]

QOTD
How many days of EWCM do you have?

[tgr68]

QOTD~I usually have about 3-5 days.

Blah. My cycle is really wacky this time. I've had two really late temps, which normally doesn't affect things, but this time gave me an O date of CD10. :eek: I know this isn't anywhere near accurate since my average O date is CD18.

Can someone refresh my memory for adjusting temps. Is it .1 degrees for every 30 minutes? I can't remember.

[mobe63]

my temps have been up for the past week, but i didn't temp today ( i thought i might hurl if i put anything in my mouth). I am leaving town tomorrow morning for a week and a half and I don't know when AF will get here. Im going to bring tampons, but since this is my first cycle i don't know how long LP will be.

Cervical position...I noticed a difference b/t firm and medium and i think a little open and closed however i went out of town for a few days right around my possible O and didn't check, I know now I am firm and closed, but never felt soft and open...It is all up to the observer and what you think is open someone else would called closed I am just trying to get the hang of this!

[lil_geek]

QOTD: I am 5 cycles off BCP and last cycle was the first I noticed ANY EWCM. I tend to get 3-4 days of wetter CM though around ovulation.

Anyone else REALLY bad at charting/temping over the holidays? Since CD 1 was Christmas Eve I figureed there was no point in ruining my one week of vacation all year by waking up early!! I should be able to get 5-6 good temps in before I O though still.

[EmilyBronte]

QOTD
I usually have around 4-5 days of EWCM.

Anyone else REALLY bad at charting/temping over the holidays?
Me!

I completely forgot my thermometer when we left town for the holidays. Oops. This is actually the 2nd month in a row I've done horrible because of travelling for the holidays. My DH is ready for me to get back on track because we can't UDD! I think he thinks I did it on purpose to torture him.

[Sue]

How many days of EWCM do you have?
I haven't had a lot... maybe a day or 2? Recently I hardly have had any. More lotiony than anything.

Anyone else REALLY bad at charting/temping over the holidays?
I was absolutely awful... just awful.

[Clattercote]

How may days of EWCM - Depends on the cycle and how many times my body tries to O - but usually I see a gradual rise in fertile CM culminating in 2-3 days of EW, followed by sharp dry up.

I'm not all that good at charting over the holidays either - partly because we travel a lot, and it's a bother to do temp. Partly because DH and I are starting to feel a bit more "see what happens" than strictly TTA. We haven't actually broken any rules yet - over the holidays we have used the CM only rules - but we're thinking maybe we'll be TTC pretty soon....

ETA: tgr68 - it's .2 degrees per half hour, I believe. I don't usually adjust, myself - but use the rule of thumb if necessary when it comes time to determining CL or LTL.

[lil_geek]

Oh, my DH got me a flashlight for christmas in my stocking.... a little one so I don't have to turn the light on in the AM to read my thermometer!

What a nut!

[Taylandra]

Temping- *waves hand* I was bad too...But now I'm back and I should start again.

I still don't really know what my "average" temp is due to the hassle with thermometers, but my cycle has been 28/29 days for three months since going off BC. Hopefully I will wind up with a schedule of some sort for the first time in my life without BC!

;-)

[tgr68]

Thanks, clattercote, for the refresher. I'm not sure if I'll adjust. Normally, taking my temp late (as a result of sleeping in) doesn't affect it, but this time it clearly made a difference. We'll see how things go this cycle before I decide what to do with those two days.

[kemaji]

I get at least 4 days of EW usually, sometimes more. It isn't that I've been bad at temping during the holidays, I've been really bad at updating my chart. Usually forget to enter it during the day, so I write it down at night as I'm going to bed, then I'll enter up to a weeks worth of temps at once.

Updated to here.

[PookiePrincess]

If anyone would like to take a peek at my charts, I would appreciate it. I'm not sure what to think about this cycle. I've had no EWCM and my temps in general have been higher than normal. FF called O on CD 20 and OS keeps moving my coverline up. It's definitely not been a normal cycle and I don't feel like I've O'd (purely for the fact that I've had nothing but creamy CM) but my temps have been high for quite a while. We haven't been keeping the house warmer or sleeping with extra blankets or anything, so I'm not quite sure why my temps are high. TIA!

[tlew12778]

I get like 10 days of EW. It's really annoying actually. My CM no longer really follows the classic pattern although it could be that I am just missing it altogether since I don't start temping until after AF leaves. We stop UDD on CD7 bc I o'ed on CD14 once and I normally start temping then. When I am really bad about it, I will just check CM and start temping on CD10. I normally O around CD17 or later. Anyway, my EW starts almost right after AF leaves. It didn't start doing this until a few months ago. It sucks bc sometimes I'll start getting watery right after AF which means no UDD.

[tlew12778]

PP - You can O without EW. I have many times in the past. Was last cycle your first chart? I am trying to figure out what your normal post-O range would be as it looks like you are in that range based on your last chart. Also, do you check internally? BC had I not checked internally for the first 18 months of charting, I would never have known I had EWCM.

[MLA]

Wow. This thread is daunting, but I thought I'd join since I've been charting now for about three months -- this is my 4th cycle.

Name: MLA(31)
DH's name: DH (28)
Occupation: Arts Management
Married: June 19, 2004
Started charting (date, if known): October 2006
TTC: June or July 2007

[southerner]

waving at MLA

[MLA]

Waving back! :)

[PookiePrincess]

PP - You can O without EW. I have many times in the past. Was last cycle your first chart? I am trying to figure out what your normal post-O range would be as it looks like you are in that range based on your last chart. Also, do you check internally? BC had I not checked internally for the first 18 months of charting, I would never have known I had EWCM.

That's what I thought about the EW. I just figured maybe my body decided not to produce any this month. I do check internally and sometimes the most fertile that I see tends to be creamy but its stretchy. I got some of that this afternoon, so I put it as EW because it is stretchy and I know that's more fertile than creamy/lotiony.

This is cycle 6 for me. Cycle 3 was anovulatory. Midway through cycle 4 I started temping vaginally because my temps were so rocky. Since then, my coverline was 97.9-98 and the post O temps for cycles 4 & 5 were 98.1-98.8. My "usual" O range seems to be CD 18-22 (if only I could have two normal months in a row.) I just don't know why my temps have been so high this month. The only change is I was off school for 2 1/2 weeks so I was hanging out around the house quite a bit and staying up later, but I temped at the normal time and got more than 3 continuous hours of sleep each night.

[raven077]

Ladies,
You've all been very helpful and I've learned alot. I know I haven't posted much, but I've been so busy. Plus, I know there's always someone more skilled than I around to throw in their knowledge. ;)

So just a couple months shy of my first chartiversary, you can move me to graduating. We're not actively TTA anymore and boy is this scary. :eek: I've spent 12 years on BCP and now almost a year charting and actually KNOWING my fertility and now it's open season! So weird! (my heart is beating rapidly even as I type this! what a goof! :o)

Anyway, I'll keep you all posted. And I know I'll eventually be back with different questions. This method worked wonderfully.

[heather1029]

Congrats on graduating Raven! Good luck!

[21daisygurl]

All the best Raven!!! Keep us posted!

as for me: Ladies...I am spotting....The progesterone seemed to work! WHOO HOO.

ALSO, some interesting news. I had my bloodwork drawn on CD 90 to just b/c my MD wasn't sure why I had never had PCOS confirmed w/ bloodwork and it came back NORMAL. Crazy eh? I spent 15 years thinking I had a hormone imbalance. I mean, this doesn't mean I don't have PCOS, and it doesn't mean that I don't have fertility issues. But it is a nice bit of news. :)

[kemaji]

Congrats Raven!

Welcome, MLA.

Updated to here.

[heather1029]

New question for you ladies:

http://www.fertilityfriend.com/home/166fc1

My chart was telling me that I ovulated on day 18. Then, all of a sudden today, it said it was moving the date to the 19th. I have no idea why! Yes, I had one day of EWCM after the 18th, but that has happened to me before. I even thought I was having ovulation pain on the 18th. So, which day do you think i ovulated?

I guess if we can't figure it out here, my 13 day luteal phase will tell all.

[kemaji]

Heather, I agree with FF's interpretation based on your recorded CM and temps. The rule of thumb is that you experience a CM dry up and you note 3 temps higher than the 6 previous. Placing your O date on CD 18 doesn't make sense based on those rules.

[tlew12778]

Heather - I would say CD19 unless you are prone to delayed temp rises.

[PookiePrincess]

Well, AF came for me yesterday. If I look at my FF chart and count back 11 days for my LP (which is my normal) it had my O date "correct" at CD 20. I changed OS to match that, but made tons of notes about it because my temps were so high last cycle. Hopefully this cycle is nice and normal!

[21daisygurl]

Quiet board lately! :)

I hope everyone settled back into work nicely after the holidays. I was sick so my holiday was extended a bit (but not pleasantly!)

Currently I am CD4 and AF is done. I am hoping I will O this cycle. I am having odd AF cramping on my left side. I am hoping it isn't my cysts doing whacky things. otherwise, not much else new. I started a new treatment with the homeopath. She is so positive she will get my cycles back on track. That makes me feel so positive. :)

How is everyone doing?

[heather1029]

kemaji and tlew12778,

Thanks for the responses. I just can't figure out why FF would have had CD18 as the O date in the first place. I thought it was very strange.

[tgr68]

Can someone help me with my chart? Click me! (http://www.fertilityfriend.com/home/1e632)

I can't figure out for the life of me why FF hasn't called O yet. The open circles on CDs 13-14 are because I temped late. I have no clue has to what the one on CD17 is all about - temped at my normal time, no unsual notations, etc. :confused: I think I O'ed on CD17, and both my temps and CM back that up.

Well, what do you ladies think?

[Clattercote]

21daisygurl - Glad to hear about the homeopath - hope the cramping is temporary...

tgr68 - I'd say CD 17, too. FF just has some weird fall back rules, sometimes. But I like CD 17, and would probably set a CL at 97.5.

[kemaji]

Heather -- FF was designed as a tool for women who are TTC, not TTA and because of that, they more heavily weight CM in their interpretation. Because you marked CD18 as dry, it assumed it was an O shift & corresponding dry up, before you actually had the temp shift. This is just another illustration as to why you can't ever rely on the software to interpret your fertility, ESPECIALLY when you're TTA.

tgr -- I agree with Clatter....

[ali_ohli]

I'm very new to charting, but am trying to keep track of things since losing our baby at 22 weeks in early December. We are hoping to begin TTC again in March. In the meantime, I'm going to attempt to chart to avoid.

Question for you experts: In my first postpartum cycle, my temps and CM were all over the place -- no clear pattern whatsoever. I got AF on Monday after 36 days. Today I had a follow-up ultrasound that revealed a medium-sized ovarian cyst. Would that be the likely reason my temps were so nuts (i.e., I didn't actually ovulate because of the cyst)? Or is it possible I'm not temping correctly? I'll admit, sometimes I fall back asleep when I'm waiting for it to beep and am not sure if I'm keeping my mouth closed the whole time!

Any ideas or insights would be greatly appreciated. Thanks in advance.

[tgr68]

Ali~I'm so sorry for your recent loss. :( I would keep taking your temps at the same time you have been. Multiple factors could've caused the wacky cycle, especially considering that you are basically charting after pgcy. Keep in touch with your dr regarding the cyst. It may very well be what's causing your cycle to act up. I would give it another cycle, maybe 2, to see if your body regulates on it's own.

Well, I overrode the FF software and set my O date as CD17. I set my CL at 97.4 becuase the 97.5 temps were taken 1.5 and 2.5 hours later than normal, so they would've most likely been very low temps. That puts me at 7 DPO.

[ali_ohli]

thank you, tgr -- it's the worst, but I'm slowly moving forward. I suppose it makes sense for my body to be pretty out of whack for a little while. Appreciate your response.

[akacharlotte]

ali ohliI am so sorry for your loss.

Threadmistress-I just started Cycle 13 so I've hit my chartiversary. :D

I can't believe I've been charting for one year. That went fast!
I was really bad about temping so I have not temped since last Friday. New cycle started today so I must get back in the habit. I blame it on being so dark at 6am when my alarm goes off. :)

Only 3-4 more cycles until we switch to TTC.

[Taylandra]

akacharlotte-Congrats on your chartiversary!!

I guess I've finally hit the four month mark of "no more BC in my system." The past three months, my cycle was 28 or 29 days...This time, I'm still waiting for AF. I am pretty sure that I O'd last week Thursday, so I'm just waiting to see how long my natural luteal phase is. *sigh* I just wish my body would figure itself out!

The other frustrating part is I have discovered that I am allergic/sensitive to panty liners and regular pads. I get terribly itchy and swollen soon after wearing one (like 15-20 minutes). I am going to invest in some cotton panty liners (per some advice of fellow CC'ers!) quickly so that I don't get too surprised once AF does arrive.

Have a great weekend everyone!

;-)

[Clattercote]

akacharlotte - Congrats!

taylandra - I developed an allergic reaction to those as well - I've been wearing cloth pads and using a Keeper for 6 years now - it feels SO much better. (And it's now cool to think that I am "spending" something like $1 per month on these reusables)

[chinadoll]

Can you please give me an opinion on my chart? According to Ovusoft, I O'd on CD 12. My temps and CM seem basically in line with that interpretation, although I think an argument could also be made for CD 15 -- the only reason I'm questioning it is because it is so early on in my cycle and I never O that early. My last 6 or 7 cycles have been in the CD 20-24 range.

When I first started charting (2 years ago!) my O dates were usually between CD14-18, so I guess CD 12 could just be wacky.

[Clattercote]

Chinadoll - I'm not seeing much cause for thinking it's CD 15 myself - As for earlier Os, I guess all I can say is I have had some surprise early Os. Usually O CD 15-18; sometimes O CD 7-9. My concern in this chart is more that you had a temp drop today - it's probably a blip but I'd be watchful -


Well, ladies - I can't believe the time has come but DH and are going to TTC starting this cycle (I'm currently on CD 5). Because of some job things that might come up, we may only TTC for a little bit before TTA again, but for now, threadmistress, you can move me to grad status. Ack!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[tlew12778]

OMG Clatter! Congratulations!

[Clattercote]

tlew - Yeah, I still can't believe it. I've been TTA for so long, it's a bit difficult for me to get my mind around TTC and being able to UDD on fertile days.

[PookiePrincess]

Congrats Clattercote!

[mobe63]

Clattercote...thats very exciting. Good luck!

I'm on cycle 2 CD12! I suceeded in TTA for cycle 1.

[kemaji]

Clatter, how exciting! Congrats!

Updated to here.

[kemaji]

Also, just a bit of housekeeping, since it is a new year and all...would everyone please double check your stats and let me know if there is anything that needs to be updated?

I've moved everyone who was still listed as planning on TTCing in 2006 to 2007, so let me know if I should update that any further.

[tgr68]

Congrats, Clatter!!! :D Have fun baby making! :p

Threadmistress~This month marks my 4 year chartiversary!! :eek: I cannot believe it has been that long. Also, I need the following changes made.
DH: Cordell (27)

[PookiePrincess]

Kemaji, can you change my age to 28 and DH's to 30? Thanks!

[heather1029]

DH and I are both about to have birthdays, so we might as well update our stats now...

Real name: Heather (24)
DH's name: Jeff (24)
Occupation: Marketing in beauty industry
Married : 10/29/05
Started charting : October 2006
TTC: 8/07

[Taylandra]

Clatter- Congrats on graduating!!!

tgr68- Congrats on your chartiversary!

The only thing that is different for me (and I didn't say anything b/c we keep going back and forth anyway) is this:

TTC: End of 2008/2009 maybe

;-)

[raven077]

I'm still lurking here from time to time, so congrats Clattercote! (and I totally understand what you mean about trying to wrap your head around UDD whenever you want!) See you 'round the TTC threads, and Good Luck. :)

[LeslieandPaul]

me: Leslie, 22, receptionist
DH: Paul, 29, technologist
married: August 20, 2005
started charting: March 2005
TTC: 2007?!

[tlew12778]

Real name: Tiffany (29)
FH's name: Carlo (32)
Occupation: job-hunting (me), MD (him)
Married: April 21, 2006
Started charting (date, if known): October 2004
TTC: 2007-2008

[chinadoll]

My concern in this chart is more that you had a temp drop today - it's probably a blip but I'd be watchful

Why would this concern you?

[kemaji]

Updated to here.

chinadoll -- The only reason to worry about that temp drop was if it hadn't gone back up the next day because that would have indicated that you may not have O'd. Because your temps went back up, it isn't a concern.

[Clattercote]

chinadoll - What Kemaji said :-) ... The concern with any temp drop after a supposed temp shift is whether the temp shift was an actual shift, and especially when your original question was based on the fact that you usually have a later O date. Combine that with the fact that the temp drop was below the coverline, and that raises a question - but like Kemaji said, since the temp rose again, not a problem.

[tgr68]

Well, I think AF is on her way. My temps dropped this morning, and I've had the most awful stabbing cramps since right before I fell asleep last night.

[portlandbride]

I think I am going to join you ladies. I bought TCOYF years ago before I had DD#1. I really need to re-read it at this point, but I think that this wil work best for us. I really hated being on the pill and would rather not go back on it. My DH will get a vasectomy when we decide we are done having children but I am not ready to make that call quite yet.
Anyway, here are my stats:

Real name: Brandi (33)
DH's/FH's/BF's name: Preston (31)
Occupation: Full-time Mommy right now, Director of HR in a previous life
Married: 9/16/01
Started charting: Soon
TTC: Unknown if we will try for a third

[akacharlotte]

Thanks Taylandra and Clattercote! Congrats Clattercote for graduating to TTC!

X-posted from Maybe Mamas

I just got back from the doctor's office. My pap came back abnormal so I had to have another colposcopy. I have atypical cells and tested positive for HPV. Evidently this does not affect fertility and we will not have to wait to TTC but it still freaks me out. My doctor said from the naked eye it does not look too bad but we need to wait for the results. She tried to reassure me so I would not freak out. I'm still freaking out but not as much as I was earlier.

[tlew12778]

Welcome Brandi!

I had cryosurgery for a CIN 1 dysplasia back in 1998. Back then, there were not cheap and efficient tests for HPV so they never did one, but my gyn at the time told me it was the most likely cause. She was so flippant about it too, checking out my hooha and being like "oh yeah it's almost always caused by warts". :eek: Anyway with the cryo, and subsequent visits to differents gynos to find one that I actually liked, I was told that the surgery pretty much removes any traces of the virus bc it is local. I went for follow up PAPs every 3 months for a year, then every 6 months for two more years and they all came back normal. I've only had to go yearly since then. It doesn't affect fertility (even though they froze off half my cervix) but it still skeeved me out.

[heather1029]

Hi ladies.

Question: If you start your period late in the day (I just started for sure at about 7 p.m.), do you start a new chart then, or do you wait until the next day?

[tgr68]

Heather~I usually start a new chart on the first day of bleeding whether it occured in the morning, afternoon, or evening.

[tlew12778]

Same here... first day of red blood = CD1.

[kemaji]

Updated to here.

Welcome, Brandi!

[LeslieandPaul]

i had really bad cramps this morning. I had a vitamin shot (i work at a naturopathic office) and it's helped a bit (they just went away about an hour ago). The thing is AF hasn't actually started. I had some spotting yesterday and then today i've just had heavier spotting (not enough to classify as light AF). I usually get cramps when AF is arriving, not beforehand. I also haven't had any for a few months (since they were so bad i had to go out at 10pm to get a hot water bottle). AND my temp hasn't dropped which it usually does the day before or day of AF. I don't know what is going on! Here's my chart (http://www.fertilityfriend.com/home/977c7)

[LeslieandPaul]

AF arrived. I guess my body's just being a little wonky.

[lil_geek]

lil_geek
Real name: Tara (28 - in 2 weeks!)
DH's name: Terry (26)
Occupation: Internet Programmer
Married : May 13, 2006
Started charting : September 19, 2006
TTC: Spring/Summer 2007

Well ladies, looks like our TTC date may move up a few months. We were planning our trip to Italy for May, but DH has decided the April trip (yes, the one over Easter) would be better. Save a TON more $$ and possibly start to TTC then.

In other news... we had a very big scare last week.... CD 16 (with O pegged on CD 18) I thought we had a condom break. I worried myself sick for hours and then (TMI) made DH fill it with water. Looked safe... but (again...TMI) there wasn't much in it. This past week has been fine, but the longer in my LP I get the more I have been thinking! My LP's have been steadliy lengthening so I know this will be the longest just to bug me!!

[akacharlotte]

I usually get cramps when AF is arriving, not beforehand. [/URL]

Hmmm...maybe it is the cold weather. :) I had the same kind of thing with AF this month. On Wednesday I had cramps. I took some meds and they went away but I was preparing for AF to arrive the same day....within an hour or so. Instead AF arrived on Friday.

TlewI'll learn the results Tuesday or Wednesday. She told me I will have to come in for paps every 3 months regardless of the results until I have 4 normal paps in a row and then every 6 months until I have two normal paps in a row.

I also count the first day of red blood as CD1.

****
Since I had the biopsy and am still spotting I do not want to check CM internally. The toilet paper method never works for me. We can't have sex for 2 weeks anyway so unless the procedure throws off my average O day I'll still ovulate during the the no sex timeframe. Why is it when you know you can't have sex you get horny as all get out?? ;)

[21daisygurl]

Hi ladies, I have been MIA b/c school is SO HARD this term. GRRRR.....
Nothing new w/ me. I am on CD 21 I htink and no sign of O. My temps were going lower an dlower and lower until it hit an all time low. And then shot up today. it LOOKS like O but if you look at my chart overlays, my temp today is just my normal baseline in a normal cycle. I thought the batteries were dying in my thermometer but I checked it and it is ok.
I don't know why my baseline has been so low this cycle. Maybe it has to do w/ my homeo remedies.
Anyway, here is my updated stats

21daisygurl
Real name: Aislinn (28)
DH's/FH's/BF's name: Keith (31)
Occupation: Registered nurse working in research and going to Grad School
Married: June 3, 2006
Started charting (date, if known): July 23 2006
TTC: August 2008

[JFlo]

I thought maybe you ladies can help me with something that's been on my mind for a couple weeks. This is my 3rd cycle charting since going off BCP. Past 2 cycles (and cycles before I went on BCP), I O'ed at CD14 and CD15. Seems like on this cycle, I O'ed on CD11.

At the very beginning of this 3rd cycle, I was on some strange hours at work that my body is definitely not used to. I was pretty stressed at this time. Can stress cause my body to O early? I always thought that stress caused late ovulation.

Anyone have any input? Thanks!

[tlew12778]

I've seen stress do weird things to cycles. Nothing is textbook. You can also have random early Os. It sucks bc it changes your 7 day rule for a year!

I mod a board on gynecology and in the last 2 weeks 2 people have had early ovulation due to illness.

[21daisygurl]

That is interesting tlew: I always thought it would DELAY ovulation. Not cause it to happen early. VERY interesting. That does mess with the safe rules doesn't it?

[tlew12778]

I suppose but it's so rare that I don't think about it too much. I mean, I've had random early o's too which would mess with the safe rules for that month... regardless you are always supposed to watch other signs for impending O so something should technically give you a hint that it's around the corner.

[Supergal16]

Hi Ladies - Hope everyone is well. I haven't been around much, because amazingly my cycles have been nice and normal and predictable. This month, I'm a bit confused. I've had some roller coaster temps, and EWCM has been a bit sporadic...and now, FF has called O on CD11. Which is WAY early for me (is usually CD 16 or 17, w one stragler on CD14 last month.) I'm kind of inclined to think FF called it too early and that my actual O day was yesterday, CD13. I know it will be helpful to wait and see my temps for the next couple of days. I'm just thinking based on my history, plus the EWCM on CD11 & 13, that CD13 is more likely O day. Any thoughts?

http://www.fertilityfriend.com/home/164549

[tlew12778]

I don't agree with CD11. Only more temps will tell if it was CD13 but you even had EW on CD14... Also, your CL would be much lower than your last chart. What is your average CL?

[tlew12778]

Ugh. The last 2 months my LP was only 11 days. 4 months ago it was also 11 days. It hasn't been 11 days since before I was dx'ed with PCOS. Everything else is normal though. But it's very annoying, and I don't really want to have to deal with it when we TTC. I liked the idea of a 13 day LP.

[Supergal16]

Thank you, tlew! You were right - CD11 def wasn't O day. Now that I've had 3 more temps, I beleive O was on CD13 and FF has updated as well. CL is more in line w prior months as well.

[21daisygurl]

Hi ladies,
Hope you are all having a lovely weekend.

I am very frustrated w/ my cycle. i just had ANOTHER anovulatory cycle and it was 22 days and the bleeding was SOOOOO erratic. It would go from spotting to heavy to spotting to nothing all in one day. It also has been like 8 days long so far. i am calling the MD on Monday if it is still here. It is nuts.
Otherwise, nothing new here!
:)

[tgr68]

This has been a crazy cycle as well. I'm not too surprised though, between having a cold the whole time and not feeling like temping and then our heater going out and having to crank up the heater blanket. :( Plus, I've been under an unusual amount of stress the last 2-3 weeks.

My CM (and intuition) say that I've O'ed this cycle, but I don't want to call it officially in the next couple of days since my temps have been bouncing all over the the place.

Blah!

[kemaji]

Updated to here.

I've been sick (again), so all last cycle was a wash. AF started over the weekend and I'm planning on charting regularly for this one.

[mobe63]

i am getting nervous, i am 17 DPO, and no AF...i've been cramping and bb's hurt. we dd (protected) on CD11 I O'd day 16 and had no EWCM. should i test or wait a little longer?

[tgr68]

I would test. 17 DPO sounds like an awfully long luteal phase to me.

[tlew12778]

I don't agree with the crosshairs. Granted, the CM doesn't coincide but FF is also considering your presumed CP which I never trust. Based on the temps (which are steadier) I would put O on CD19 which would only make you 14DPO.

[kemaji]

I agree with tlew regarding your O date, but if it will relieve some stress, by all means go ahead and test.

What is your average LP?

[mobe63]

Threadmistress add me to the anti-grad list...I got 2 BFP's today! Opps. We are really excited, just a bit shocked

[tgr68]

Congrats!! H&H 9 months to you!

[tlew12778]

Oh man. What rule was broken? Or was it condom failure? We've only had one of those in the entire history of all the threads!

Happy and Healthy 9 months to you and your DH though!

[kemaji]

mobe -- H&H 9 mos to you! I am definitely curious to know what rule was broken also.

Updated to here.

[lil_geek]

Congrats mobe!

[mobe63]

i mis-typed...unprotected dd on CD11....we tried the "pull out" method, I thought that was 100% fool proof!!! HaHa. I had creamy-ish CM, but no EW however this is my 2nd cycle after BCP, all kinds of opps, but we have been talking baby for awhile. We are really excited and praying for a healthy 9 months and a healthy baby!

[heather1029]

Congratulations mobe! How exciting!

[mindy2137]

Mobe!!! Congrats....even if is is unexpected. Geesh....that makes me wonder about this cycle for me. Unprotected on cd 11! Oh no...

[tlew12778]

Oh almost time for a new thread...

Lots of UDD going on around here... for the newbies, just as a reminder, you should not UDD in your first 3 cycles AT ALL. After that, you should not UDD past CD6. You should not really use the -7 days Doering rule unless you have charted for AT LEAST 6 months, if not a year (and 6 months only if you have regular cycles IMO).

Oh and remember, any sign of CM and those rules go out the window and you must stop UDD. Honestly I can't think of one old-timer on the thread that currently uses the Last Dry Day Rule. I know that Clatter was considering it, but she has moved on. I am too afraid to use it and I have charted for over 2 years.

[tgr68]

I've been charting for 4 years. My mucus patch is pretty predictable and usually pretty long, so I do use the LDD. Otherwise, according to Deoring rule (and others), my fertile phase starts a couple of days before AF leaves. I admit though, LDD is the most liberal rule and VERY risky, even when you do know your body!

[tlew12778]

Your fertile phase starts a couple days before AF arrives?! That's one short LP! ;)

[kemaji]

I want to chime in and add to what tlew said. The very minimum amount of time to chart without any UDD at all should be 3 months, but if you're coming off hormonal BC, oftentimes it takes that long for your body to regulate, so you still won't know what your "normal" cycle is until longer. I've been charting for almost 2.5 years and I didn't feel comfortable UDD for 9 months. I don't use the last dry day rule either, because I've had so many aberrations in my cycle and mucus patch, that I know that anything can happen.

The other thing I wanted to say, and I know we say this pretty frequently, is that you should never, ever rely on the charting software to confirm your O. Both FF and Ovusoft were written with TTC in mind, so they will be a bit more liberal in calling O based on the signs you are entering. As with any program, they do not know your body the way you do. FF is notorious for calling O before there are three high temps after a shift, but as TTA-ers, none of us should be calling O until there are 3 confirmed high temps and a dry up of CM.

ETA: Also, if you have EWCM after what the software thinks is an O, chances are it isn't.

[tgr68]

Your fertile phase starts a couple days before AF arrives?! That's one short LP! ;)

Nope. A couple of days before AF leaves!

[tlew12778]

My bad. Read that wrong.

You know, I sort of have the same issue now but I cannot use the LDD rule bc I have like no dry days now. It's really odd... but it's like either take the supplements to lengthen my shortening LP (and deal with no dry days), or have a short LP.

[21daisygurl]

You know ladies,
I wonder if maybe I dont really belong in this group. As sad as that makes me. DH and I haven't used protection or followed the rules really in 7 months b/c I don't ovulate. So it isn't that we are charting to avoid so much as charting, and not ovulating.

So, that being said, I will catch up every now and then but I probably don't belong here. I can't take credit for charting to avoid knowing that I am not doing it properly!

I wish you all the best. :)
Threadmistress you can remove me from the list. I have no group to belong to so there is nowhere to move me!

[lil_geek]

Daisy gurl... there is a PCOS group... not sure if it is TTC or TTA or just PCOS support.

[21daisygurl]

Thanks! I will check it out. :)

[tlew12778]

I started a thread a long time ago entitled something like "Does anyone have PCOS but is not TTC" in the FP section.

There is a PCOS and TTC group too I think. Not aure about TTA though...

[jnettie]

You know ladies,
I wonder if maybe I dont really belong in this group. As sad as that makes me. DH and I haven't used protection or followed the rules really in 7 months b/c I don't ovulate. So it isn't that we are charting to avoid so much as charting, and not ovulating.

So, that being said, I will catch up every now and then but I probably don't belong here. I can't take credit for charting to avoid knowing that I am not doing it properly!

I wish you all the best. :)
Threadmistress you can remove me from the list. I have no group to belong to so there is nowhere to move me!
Don't go! I hardly ovulate at all myself!

I have been MIA from this thread for some time now because I haven't been able to start charting just yet, until today. I haven't had a real period since Sept. or Oct. (I actually don't remember which anymore) But AF started today, so I'll start temping tomorrow morning.

[21daisygurl]

Oh thanks jnettie for making me feel like I belong here! I just think that if I am not following the rules, I can't be here and take credit for NOT getting pregnant. DH and I use NO protection, ever. No matter where in my cycle it is. We havne't for 7 months now!

Maybe you and I shoudl start up our own group of women with LONG cycles who don't ovulate. :)

[tlew12778]

Daisy - I know how you are feeling. I actually stopped temping for a while when my cycle was so long. It's just disheartening (and boring). We used condoms though. Are you two ok with a kid now? If not you might want to look into a diaphragm or something. You can still do that and temp just to see what's going on.

This (http://www.constantchatter.com/forum/showthread.php?t=3124&highlight=pcos) is the thread on started on having PCOS but not TTC. It made me remember all that stuff about IR and whatnot. Were you tested? Incidentally, I have the PCOS Diet Book which is an interesting read. I got an e-version of it for like $14 I think and I just printed it out.

[21daisygurl]

Tlew: Thanks for the link. I will look at that. What is the PCOS diet book called? It would be worth looking into for sure. As for the IR, I actually have severe hypoglycemia. I have done about 3 glucose tests in my lifetime to figure out why I faint so easy!

As for the baby, we would be ok with one if it happened. I mean, I am in grad school, but you can take mat leave and I have a full time nursing job and DH has his career, so it wouldn't be the worse thing that could happen to us. I think that if it DID happen, it would be a miracle.

However, I don't really belong on the TTC links b/c we aren't actively TTC. So it is a bit frustrating. And I sorta feel like noone really gets me (Except those who also have the same issues) b/c we are hoping for an accidental pregnancy but we aren't being proactive to get pregnant because we also want to wait a bit. It is so hard to explain.

I appreciate everyones help. I will probably hang around b/c you guys have so much information that so so wonderfully helpful. But I won't take credit for charting to avoid! I am just charting to figure out if I am ovulating or pregnant!

Also, tlew, we were for a while using the sponge (My doc doesn't do diaphragms...she recommends the sponge only) but it seemed so pointless for the time being that we were doing that. So we abandonded that pretty quickly.

[tlew12778]

It's The Natural Diet Solution for PCOS (http://www.ovarian-cysts-pcos.com/). I read it... haven't done it. I am not IR, like you I suffer from low glucose. But it has a lot of recipes in it that sound really good :p. And the info it good. I am sort of lazy about the whole PCOS issue since I am regular right now. I was going to implement the book hardcore if I did not get back to normal on my own. Conveniently, it's good if you have a DH that is protein obsessed like mine is. It's full of low-carb recipes.

[tippy]

Wow, I suck! I haven't been here in a good minute! Nothing much happening over here. I am on CD4 of my 37th cycle. I can't believe that it will be 3 yrs of charting in March!! I am so proud of myself. :D :cool: ThreadMistress, could you please change my stats?! Thanks!

tippy
Real Name: Tiffany (26)
DH: Dennis (25)
Occupation: Engineer
Married: June 26, 2004
Started Charting: March 30, 2004
TTC: 2008-2009

ETA: Welcome to all the newbies!! And Congrats to all those expecting!!

[kemaji]

daisygurl, I agree, you don't have to leave just because you're not ovulating. If you were, you'd be following the rules, right? As you can tell, we have a number of women who are in your shoes. If you still want me to remove you, I will but don't feel as if you have to leave. :)

[kemaji]

Updated to here.

(daisygurl, I still haven't removed you.)

[lil_geek]

tlew or anyone else.... I know someone here posted a link to drugs that can affect fertility. I am on cortisone cream which is a mild steroid and my O is delayed (not greatly at this point so it could be a fluke)... and I am trying to find if there is any connection. One site said yes in high doses, one no, and one that cortisone is a steroid = derived from testosterone which would make sense to mess things up!

[tlew12778]

Do you have TCOYF? In the back there is a table with all the drugs and how they can affect your cycle. For cortisone it says it can significantly delay your ovulation and cause bleeding irregularities (which I assume means spotting).

[lil_geek]

I do, but I'm at work when I thought of it. Interesting to know... thanks! (I'll check it out more at home)

[tlew12778]

There's nothing really more to check out :|. That's literally all it says. It depends on how much steroid you are taking. I use hydrocortisone cream in the summer (mosquito season) like it's going out of style and it doesn't affect my O. I also take an inhaled cortosteroid during allergy season (for my asthma) and it also does not affect my O. But everyone is different. I thought the stress of the wedding would have affected my O, but it didn't, so I must have some really stoic hormones.

[lil_geek]

Oh, very possible I am jumping the gun on trying to figure out why. But I thought I would check it out. I guess best way would be to stop and see if my cycle get's back on track and if the next one is normal.

[jnettie]

I bumped tlew's PCOS thread:

http://www.constantchatter.com/forum/showthread.php?p=1202968#post1202968http://www.constantchatter.com/forum/showthread.php?p=1202968#post1202968

[21daisygurl]

jnettie: Thanks for bumping that thread.

Threadmistress: Ok, I will stay! :)

I hate to leave you guys. you know so much and I love staying here. :)

[lil_geek]

still waiting to O. Not impressed if this is all from the cortisone cream. And otherwise I am not impressed anyways! I have my physical next week so I will mention then.

I also am kind of debating killing my term. I replaced the battery less then 2 months ago and the L keeps flashing. I think I need to bite the bullet and find somewhere to ship a BD brand one to me.

[spa_girl]

Hi - I'm new to charting and actually I'm still finishing up this cycle of BCP. I'm hoping to get started charting on the next cycle. I just got my thermometer yesterday and I copied the TCOYF charts this morning.

I have a question about the charts though - there are 3 different birth control charts in the back of TCOYF and I just copied them all. What is the difference and which do you guys prefer? I was thinking I would start charting on paper before computer - is this a good idea?

Anyway - just wanted to poke my head in and say hello. I've read all the entry posts so now I'm just trying to get to know you guys. :)


screen name: spa_girl (LJ); KSLee29 (old school WC)
Real name: Kathy, 30
DH's/FH's/BF's name: Brad, 32
Occupation: consultant - database marketing
Married: 09/08/02
Started charting: March 2007 (probably! will update when I start)
TTC: unsure

[tlew12778]

Welcome to the thread spa_girl!

Most of us chart on FF just bc it's free. It's a lot easier for the rest of us to contribute towards interpretation if it's online and we can see the chart. A few of us also chart on paper but I think almost everyone enters their data into FF or OS. The pros vs cons of FF vs OS are on the front page.

[LeslieandPaul]

Started spotting at 9 dpo yesterday. That's early, even for me. But that means only a few more days until cycle #24! I can't believe it's been 2 years already!

[tlew12778]

Watch out for that in the future. Spotting before 10DPO can imply LP defect. Once or twice is no big deal, but if it becomes the norm, you will want to bring it up with your dr.

[tlew12778]

While I was on the subway platform today waiting for a train, I was thinking about a post that someone made on a board I mod on iVillage. I can't remember what she wrote but her chart very strongly implied a double ovulation, especially given the fact that she has a history of multiples in her family. Anyway I got to wondering today if double O would lead to EWCM after a temp rise. BC the first corpus luteum would start to break down, causing a temp rise, but the estogen surge from the 2nd O could still cause EW, no?

The strange things I think about while commuting... :rolleyes:

[Marcilla]

Anyone experience really static temps pre-o? I'm around CD 12 (can't exactly remember, and haven't uploaded to Ovusoft yet this cycle) and my temp has been 97.7 all but 2 days this cycle. If it weren't for those two temps, I would think it was my thermometer, but it did read another temp when I tried it in the afternoon yesterday.

I can't think of any reason why this would be a bad thing, persay, but it is just kind of weird. Makes me feel sort of robotic...;)

[heather1029]

Anyone experience really static temps pre-o? I'm around CD 12 (can't exactly remember, and haven't uploaded to Ovusoft yet this cycle) and my temp has been 97.7 all but 2 days this cycle. If it weren't for those two temps, I would think it was my thermometer, but it did read another temp when I tried it in the afternoon yesterday.

I can't think of any reason why this would be a bad thing, persay, but it is just kind of weird. Makes me feel sort of robotic...;)

Are you writing down the temperature as soon as you take it, or are you using the memory function on your thermometer? Because I've noticed that my memory function often takes me to 97.7 instead of the actual temperature that it just read. If not, yeah, my temp stays pretty dull until O.

Also, how long have you been temping? My first two cycles of BCP had very static temps pre-O, but then they got wackier as the hormones left my system.

[tlew12778]

Anyone experience really static temps pre-o? I'm around CD 12 (can't exactly remember, and haven't uploaded to Ovusoft yet this cycle) and my temp has been 97.7 all but 2 days this cycle. If it weren't for those two temps, I would think it was my thermometer, but it did read another temp when I tried it in the afternoon yesterday.

I can't think of any reason why this would be a bad thing, persay, but it is just kind of weird. Makes me feel sort of robotic...;)
Steady temps = steady hormones. This is a good thing provided you are sure it is not your therm that is broken.

[kemaji]

Welcome, spagirl!

Marcilla -- I usually have pretty steady temps pre-O, usually between 97.3 and 97.5. Every once in a while it will be lower.

Updated to here.

[Marcilla]

This is cycle 6 charting for me, so I guess the further I get from BC the steadier my hormones must be getting. And I do check when it actually temps, so I can't blame the thermometer.

Thanks for the reassurance :)

[Ember]

Hello successful charters! I am a newbie, who's getting married in 3 1/2 months and is seriously worried about screwing this up! I have a few questions, and I'm sorry because I realize that somewhere way back when you have probably answered all these.
First off, my doctor says I should just get on a low dose pill and that most people don't have depression/libido side effects. I'm tempted to just get on the pill because it's 'easy', and because my fiance and I will be moving across the country, getting new jobs, and starting at new schools, and I'm worried about having really irregular cycles due to stress. Can any of you advise about a) the pill and b) the difficulty of charting when you're first married and during a stressful time?

Also, if I did go on the pill, then had horrendous side effects and got off and tried to chart, how difficult is that? Is post-pill charting hard to manage?

I think I just haven't gotten enough confidence yet. It's important to note that my fiance is really supportive, and is fine with the idea of charting.

I look forward to learning stuff from you guys!

[tlew12778]

There is no telling if the BCP will have negative side effects for you. Everyone is different. Also, each pill is different. Many girls have to try 2-3 BCPs before finding one that works for her. That said, it would put you on a predictable schedule. You would not have a period per se, but you would have withdrawal bleeding every month. You cannot have a real period bc the BCP prevents you from ovulating. No ovulating = no real period.

You can certainly chart after going off the BCP, but you might have some whacky charts in the beginning as the hormones wear out of your body.

Personally if you want to consider charting, I would start now so that you can figure it out before the wedding. Are you sexually active? If not, you would not have the issue of birth control to deal with, but could concentrate on learning about your cycles. If you are, you would have to use protection until the wedding more or less (you should use protection for the first 3 months of charting).

[raven077]

Hey Ember! I still lurk around here even though we're TTC now. :)

Just wanted to share my $.02 since I started here immediately after stopping 12 years of BCP. I CTA for 10 months/11 cycles and will have my first Chartiversary at the end of this month (Can I still have one even though I'm not TTA avoid anymore? :p). First off, charting isn't as daunting as it seems once you have a few cycles under your belt. And you really should be using protection in the beginning anyway until you have gotten used to your body and it's signs.

Charting post-pill varies from woman to woman. I had a very short (22 days) first post-pill cycle, but it appeared text-book normal other than that. I had CF and a nice temperature shift for ovulation. Subsequent cycles were all pretty easy to understand. Some women see some whacky temps, others have an anovulatory cycle, still others report no changes at all. It all depends and as for side-effects of the pill... I had been on many different kinds over the course of my BC career. Some made me have interim bleeding, others actually made my acne worse (if you can believe it!). And for me, I definitely agree with the low libido thing, though I didn't recognize it as such while on BCP. I just thought I was tired or too comfortable in the relationships etc. But being off them, I have come full circle. Often mentioning sex more than DH at times! :eek: Even if we don't act on it, he knows the interest is still there and it's a little mind-blowing for both of us, actually. Especially after years of "drought" so-to-speak. :rolleyes: (We've known each other for 15 years and been together for 8 years so it's easy to fall into a routine.)

But it's nice to not have to be a slave to medication like that anymore. To think, "Oh crap. I forgot to take my pill.. should we use back-up?" or "Oh crap. I forgot to take my pill, what if I'm late?" With charting, you know exactly where in your cycle you are. You can choose to abstain during your fertile time if you're really concerned about pregnancy or you can use a barrier method (i.e. condoms, foam etc). Even at 10 months, we still generally used condoms in the beginning of my cycle since I still wasn't super comfortable with the Last Dry Day rule yet, but I was getting there. Now we don't have to use them at all! :D

Anyway, I am a definitely charting convert and personally, wouldn't go back on hormonal BC if you paid me. But, that being said, you need to do what you feel most comfortable with at the time. Charting is a bit of work in the beginning, but definitely has it's rewards. Good luck with your decision AND with your upcoming wedding!

[Ember]

In response to tlew12778, I've charted one cycle (somewhat successfully I think...I'm on day 22 now) and my fiance and I are not sexually active. I have a free trial of the Ovusoft program, and I've been using it.

I had a five day period, and then on the 7th and 8th days of my cycle I had very watery and wet CM with some old blood. Then on the 9th day I was dry, and on day 10 I started with some crumbly/creamy and moved toward what I judged as peak day on day 14 with eggwhite/stretchy. I'm just wondering, do other people have a couple days of watery after your period? If so, how do you learn to know if it's just watery cm or fertile cm? Perhaps I just need the experience of more cycles? I just thought it was wierd because the ovusoft said I was infertile on day 7 and 8 but according to the dry day rule I wouldn't have been, would I? Ovusoft listed me as infertile till day 10.

Thanks to both of you for your responses. They were really helpful. Right now I think my plan is to focus on charting and see how it works out for me, and if I freak out the month before the wedding that I can't do it I'll try BCPs. I just don't want to become a psycho due to hormones, and so I'm going to try to go the natural way first.

[jnettie]

Hello successful charters! I am a newbie, who's getting married in 3 1/2 months and is seriously worried about screwing this up! I have a few questions, and I'm sorry because I realize that somewhere way back when you have probably answered all these.
First off, my doctor says I should just get on a low dose pill and that most people don't have depression/libido side effects. I'm tempted to just get on the pill because it's 'easy', and because my fiance and I will be moving across the country, getting new jobs, and starting at new schools, and I'm worried about having really irregular cycles due to stress. Can any of you advise about a) the pill and b) the difficulty of charting when you're first married and during a stressful time?

I think that if you have a doctor that is willing to work with you on BCP, and you want to give it a try, go ahead.

That said, I, personally, wouldn't go back to BCP to save my life. (Well, maybe to save my life ;) ) I had such a horrible experience. Possibly every bad side effect you can think of. No sex drive. Depression. I was a wreck. And DH was very very worried about me. But my Doctor didn't really warn me about any of this, nor was she ever really willing to work with me on types of BCP. She just kind of tossed a bunch of free packs at me with a prescription.

Another thing to think about...the first 2 or 3 months of BCP are the most unpredictable. And you said you are getting married in 3 1/2 months. Maybe not the best time to start on BCP. ;) Maybe wait until after the wedding to decide. Try charting for now, and just use condoms until you're comfortable.

[tlew12778]

I had a five day period, and then on the 7th and 8th days of my cycle I had very watery and wet CM with some old blood. Then on the 9th day I was dry, and on day 10 I started with some crumbly/creamy and moved toward what I judged as peak day on day 14 with eggwhite/stretchy. I'm just wondering, do other people have a couple days of watery after your period? If so, how do you learn to know if it's just watery cm or fertile cm? Perhaps I just need the experience of more cycles? I only have watery CM after AF if I am taking supplements. It doesn't go away until post-O for me. If you see watery CM then you need to start using backup. Fertile CM overrides all other rules.

Are you sure it was not arousal fluid?

[21daisygurl]

Ok ladies,
I have a question. I know the #1 rule is not to trust FF or Ovusoft software. that being said, I am wondering why the heck they gave me a coverline??? I have no noticeable temp shift that I can see. However, my CM and CP are lining up. I try not to rely on CP too much b/c it is hard to be accurrate, but my CM certainly is easy to read. Do you think I O'd?

Also, I have been having cramps for two days now. They feel like menstrual cramps but I haven't had cramps since coming off the pill. This is my first cycle where my temps are pretty level so I guess it is possible my cycle is more of my own "normal". Do you think AF is on her way? I sure hope so. I would love to have a normal length cycle back to back with the last one (even if they are anovulatory).

Any thoughts on my cycle?

oh, and the open circles are b/c I either got woken up early and took my temp at 4am instead of 5am or b/c I was up late working on a school paper (the last open circle is b/c of this)

Thx ladies

[tlew12778]

Daisy - I don't think you have o'ed. With PCOS you can get strange CM patterns. If AF comes I would call it an anov cycle. There is no visible temp shift as you said. If you had o'ed, even weakly, there would be a small shift.

[jnettie]

And since I seem to be the fool that can't figure out how to use a thermometer... a couple quetions and observations.

So, I've noticed two things about taking my temps. One, I have to make sure my mouth is closed (seems obvious, but apparently I'm kinda slow), otherwise the temps are really really low. Like 96.5 low. I'm guessing when I asked that question about low temps, that may have been what I was doing wrong. :rolleyes: Yeah, I'm smrt.

Second, I've noticed that my temps are higher when I'm using my big fluffy down comforter than when I just use one blanket. It's been below freezing here lately, and our house is old and drafy, so I start out the night with the down comforter, but am sweating by the time I wake up in the morning if I haven't kicked it off in the middle of the night. Which also means a huge shift in my waking temps.

I am getting better at observing my CM, though! This is my first round of real charting, but I've been watching since at least October.

21daisygurl, I had my first real cramps this last period since I've gone off of BCP about 9 months ago. I used to have crazy bad cramps every time, but this time it was only mild. Certainly interesting to note.

[meagle]

Hey all! I'm not around the boards much anymore, but still charting 3.5 years and going strong! (I became part of the WC group back in the first half of 2003.) I came across this article on Friday morning and thought you'd appreciate it.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/17282285/

That's right -- charting made mainstream news! :)

[LeslieandPaul]

That's awesome!
I started cycle 24 the other day! I have been charting for 2 years! I can't believe it's been that long.

[tgr68]

meagle~Very cool! Thanks for posting that link! :)

Leslie~Congrats on your chartiversary!

[lil_geek]

Leslie - congrats of 2 successful years!!

Me - STILL waiting to O! I am not really happy, up to CD 35. It looks like my body has tried twice... and my VERY low temps from 2 weeks ago are back to 'normal' pre-O range.

My Chart (http://www.fertilityfriend.com/home/15c0db)

Any PCOS ladies have charts they can share with me from initial dx? tlew - you have mentioned that it was a specific cycle the 'clued you in'?

[21daisygurl]

Leslie, Congrats on your charterversary!

Tara, Check out my charts. I am constantly anov, month after month. I was dx a long time ago but my charts are textbook anovulatory PCOS.

As for me, looks like AF is on her way without ovuation again. Sigh...at least the cycles are short!

[tlew12778]

Yeah but honestly I only had one cycle that was crazy. That is how I knew something was wrong. I just swapped out my Jan chart for my May 2005 one so you can see it.

[lil_geek]

Perfect, thanks. Given my prior 'not really a diagnosis but we'll base it as that anyway' from when I was 16 I wouldn't be surprised. My chart (I think) looks more like yours then daisygurls. My temps don't seem to be as erratic as hers. But something just isn't 'right'.

I have a follow up the end of may for a mole, so if nothing has happened then I will get (at least) try to get an ultrasound ordered and provera perscription filled.

Thanks! (you guys are way more helpful the dh!)

[tippy]

meagle, thanks for sharing! it is so exciting to see that charting has made news. now i have something to show people when they start looking at me like i have 3 heads :)

leslie, congrats! isn't it exciting?? my 3 yr chariversary is coming up, and i am thrilled!! it is just such a great feeling of accomplishment to know that i have been able to do it all with out bcp :cool:

hope everyone is doing well!! :)

[jnettie]

Can you change my charting start date to Jan. 2007? I just recently started.

Anyway, a CM question:

So you got your dry days, and then Sticky CM as your non-fertile CM, then Egg-white and Watery as fertile. But what is Creamy? I'm slightly confused. It's been described as both fertile and non. I think I'm having creamy...it's lotiony and smooth like described in TCOYF, certainly not like Sticky CM, but there's really not been a temp shift. Can you have fertile CM and not be ovulating yet, or anovulatory?

[tlew12778]

The order is:
dry, sticky, creamy, watery, EW

Creamy is non-fertile but it cannot be used in reference to the Last Dry Day rule. The latter is just last truly dry day as far as I know. Not last-non-fertile-CM day. For the Doering Rule you just subtract 7 from your earliest O, but if you have short cycles, or you O really early, you cannot use this rule. Also, if watery CM shows up before the magic -7 day, you must stop UDDing. You can only really use these rules if you have a few charts under your belt though. Until then you should 1) always use protection and 2) rely more on the first 5 days rule for pre-O UDD.

Yes, you can have fertile CM and not ovulate. This is why OPKs cannot be relied on to call an O. You can also O without fertile CM.

[jnettie]

Great, thanks!

Well, I have absolutely no confidence in DTD without condoms just yet, so that's not an issue. ;)

[MizLarner]

MizLarner/chart link (http://www.fertilityfriend.com/home/993ed)
Real name: Ces (24 - soon)
DH's/ name: Jason (26)
Occupation: Student teacher
Married: 9/13/03
Started charting (date, if known): Jan 2005
TTC: Aug. 2007

Background info:
I was diagnosed with endometriosis when I was 16. Of the several doctors I saw while trying to find out what was wrong, only one had real expectancies that I would ever become pregnant. I became pregnant the first time within a couple of months of being married, and pregnant with my second 7 months post-partum. Before I got pregnant, AF was horrible - I haven't had any difficulties since having my babies! It's wonderful!

Original plans for DH and I had been to hold off on our #3 until #2 was 2 years old.. but I'm tired of waiting. I should be a provisional 1st year teacher beginning in August, so I can't get pregnant before then - having a baby before the end of next school year (read: not completing the year) might keep me from getting licensed! So I am wanting to TTC beginning in August. Until then - I need to TTA!

I started charting just before I got pregnant with #2, and that is the only one I've done anything besides charting AF on, so I don't really know what I'm doing. I would chart CM but I really don't get the differences between the labels. What I mean is, I understand the differences, but I don't know how to determine what label to put with what I see.

Mostly I've been charting to figure out how much longer I have until AF starts again, since my cycles are still screwy from breastfeeding. I guess I'll just try to be better at checking my temp. Oh - and it is always UDD with us. I hate bc, DH hates condoms. It works for us ;) My theory is that God is bigger than I am, and if he decided I needed to have another baby, it would happen whether or not we use any form of birth control.

There's a question - why is a BBT any better than a regular thermometer? Shouldn't it be fine if I'm making sure I use the same one at about the same time, every time?

[tlew12778]

Welcome to the group Ces!

A BBT is more accurate than a regular thermometer. Also, most have a memory function which comes in handy for charting.

To distinguish CM it helps to 1) check internally and 2) look at the marks left on your undies.

[tgr68]

I think I may have O'ed early this cycle. I am on CD18, and this morning my temps shot up with Peak Day on CD14 and dry today. My average O date is CD 17-19. :)

[kemaji]

Updated to here.

Welcome, Ces!

[spa_girl]

Morning ladies! Just thought I would pop back in to say that I am officially charting now. I started last week as I finished my last pack of BCPs. I don't have any major news but just thought I would say hello again. I'm sure I'll have questions before long but for now I'm just trying to get used to taking my temp and looking for signs. :)

[PookiePrincess]

This might sound crazy, but I am so excited about this cycle. I had stretchy CM and EWCM (and I rarely have either) the last few days and this morning my temp was up. I knew it was coming and hopefully it stays up. I'm just excited to have a normal cycle where I know exactly what is going on!

[Linz]

Ok, this may be a really stupid / ignorant question but can you not chart if you are on the BCP? TIA.

[kemaji]

You *can* chart just to get used to charting, but the information is basically useless because your cycle is hormonally regulated. AF isn't a true AF, it is really break-through bleeding, off hormonal BC, your cycle could be shorter or longer than 28 days, and you won't get accurate (for you) CM while on BCP.

[textualgirl]

Hello everyone. I'm just checking in. I was sensibility on WC. I'm coming up on my 4-year charting anniversary and all is well. I just wanted to check in and see how everyone else is doing. I hope well.

Happy March!

[21daisygurl]

Hi guys,
I am just checking in too.

This cycle is infuriating. I am sure it is going to be super long again. I got excited b/c last week I had spotting but it progressed to NOTHING. It was too light to be considered AF so here I go again.

ON the plus side, i had real EWCM this cycle twice already. It only took me seven months off the pill to see it. But I am so happy I had it....even if it didn't mean anything :)

[spa_girl]

Hey ladies - I'm on about Day 10 or so of charting and am noticing a fair amount of range in my temps. First of all they are typically pretty low (97 or lower) but then I have ranged from 96.4 to 97.4 so far. I'm assuming this is just normal but thought I would check in with the experts. ??? :confused:

[tippy]

hey ladies!
just wanted to check in too. i just started cd1 of my 38th chart a couple of days ago. unfortunately AF brought with her some bad cramps! :(

welcome to all the newbies!!

congrats, textualgirl, on your chartiversary!! :)

[tlew12778]

Do you temp at the same time everyday? Also, how are you temping? Orally or vaginally?