Breastfeeding Help and Support

[adoredh]

Happy also commiserating - MIL said DS should be started on rice cereal since he nurses so much (every 2 to 3 hours, like a normal BF baby) she said she gave DH rice cereal when he was just a couple weeks old because he was so "hungry" (he was formula fed) Even my mom thinks DS should start rice cereal sooner then the 4 to 6 months the Peds recommend.
My favorite saying right now is " I'm going with the advise of our Ped, who has gone through years and years of medical school" It puts their noses out of joint, but I get my point across :p

Hawaii (((HUGS))) I think it was after the first two weeks, I was also thinking about giving up BFing, or at least adding a bottle of formula in to have him sleep longer at night. It truely does get better after those couple of weeks, and this is coming from a mom who just spent the past 24 hours cluster feeding her son almost every hour, on the hour :D
I just wanted to share what helped me through those first couple of weeks, my mom's BFing support group from the LC office that I go to. It's so huge to be able to go once a week and talk about the issues you're running across and get feed back from mom's that have been there. This board is also a huge help, but there's nothing like talking about BFing in a room full of mom's BFing their DC's

Good luck!

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Cluster feeding I learned what that meant last night and today! DS is almost 6 weeks - growth spurt? Last night was soooo hard! It's not so bad during the day, gives me an excuss to hunker down and cuddle with him all day, but at night, please let me get some sleep! Seems that by the time I finally fall back asleep after getting him to sleep, he's up again wanting more! Hope I can get more then 15 mins in at a time tonight! (also back ach from not being able to nurse in a chair, we're still tied down with the heart monitor so I have to nurse sitting up in bed.)

[moderngal]

daycare~ I can say we're pretty lucky in this regard since the director BF'd her 4 kids. Still, once in awhile a teacher will say something like "oh, C seems really hungry" or something like that. I say something like "oh there will be plenty of time for that soon enough." Then I drop it. No one at my daycare has really pushed me, but they also know that he has eczema and I have told them we'll need to be careful about what he does get when it is time.
Honestly, I would sit and down and talk to the director of the daycare. Breastmilk is an infant's ideal food and the AAP recommends exclusive BF'ing for 6 months. You, the parent, get to decide what is best for your child- not them.
(and if you need support on the daycare thing... it is a good thing!!)

extended nursing~ My plan is to have no plan. ;) We are almost at our 6 month mark, which is huge to me. I plan to pump until we hit 1 year. At that point, I'll stop pumping and just nurse DS on demand- until I get sick of sharing my girls or he self- weans. Whichever comes first. (I guess that is sort of a plan) :cool:

[BeachBum]

I must say that BFing is very frustrating at times expecially when DS is crying and refusing to latch on when it's time to eat. I keep thinking of how it will get better in the long run but I'm so frustrated since it takes me up to 2hours to feed him during our overnight feedings. He just fusses at the nipple like he doesn't know what it is. Is that normal?? During the day it's a little better but at 4am I'm contemplating the switching to formula issue. Do I just have a fussy baby? When it comes time for feeding I actually get scared and nervous too. Not just cause of the breast sensitivity but because he crys so much.

I just wanted to offer some support. It gets better, SOON, I promise! My DS, also took 2 hours or so to eat at night when he was a newborn. Very soon all feedings will decrease in the time it takes them. Please try to stick with it and avoid giving him formula at night, you will feel so good about your BF relationship once you've gotten a few weeks under your belt.
As for "not knowing what it is", it could be a bunch of things. For my son, my milk flow was just too fast or strong for him. He would bob off the boob because it was overwhelming him. Othertimes I think my nipples were too "soft" for him to get a good latch. Often pinching them and pulling on them helped him latch on better.
You can do this! :D

[SiValleySteph]

happy, your daycare is annoying & ignorant on this matter. Are you happy with them otherwise?

My son didn't even start daycare until 7 months and I sent only breastmilk for at least another month. I never got any grief about it. They were excited when he got food, but it was always my choice, as it should be.

[Candy]

Cluster feeding I learned what that meant last night and today! DS is almost 6 weeks - growth spurt? Last night was soooo hard! It's not so bad during the day, gives me an excuss to hunker down and cuddle with him all day, but at night, please let me get some sleep! Seems that by the time I finally fall back asleep after getting him to sleep, he's up again wanting more! Hope I can get more then 15 mins in at a time tonight! (also back ach from not being able to nurse in a chair, we're still tied down with the heart monitor so I have to nurse sitting up in bed.)


adoredh
Take your son into bed with you. ;) I received many extra hours of sleep by nursing Maya while sleeping.

happy1nuv Ouch! Not a fun situation.

[snowzilla]

happy, your daycare is annoying & ignorant on this matter. Are you happy with them otherwise?

My son didn't even start daycare until 7 months and I sent only breastmilk for at least another month. I never got any grief about it. They were excited when he got food, but it was always my choice, as it should be.

I agree with SiValleySteph here. I'd be raising hell if my child's daycare made a demand like that - they're totally out of line. Oooh, it makes my blood boil just reading that they're making you get a note from your ped. :mad:

[DianeCourt]

I'm calling a lactation consultant tomorrow, but I'd thought I'd post here to see if anybody could offer any support:

I'm so upset.....DD has only gained 4 ounces in two weeks. We didn't believe the public health nurse's scale (she came for a home visit today), so I took her into the Dr's office to have her weight double checked. Well, the nurse's scale ended up being right on. DD was 8 lbs 15 oz at birth, and only weighs 8 lbs 7 oz now, at 3 weeks. It just doesn't add up......we're feeding 8 - 10 times per day (sometimes 30 min on each breast, I let her come off on her own), her diaper is wet at every feeding, and she's having 3 - 6 bowel movements each day, too. I suspect that I have a supply issue, so we're trying to see if she'll take a supplement after I BF. Tonight she gobbled up the 3 oz of breastmilk I had pumped & stored, no problem. I'm thinking that's why she's extra fussy every evening, too...poor baby is probably hungry.

I don't think I can handle all of the uncertainty surrounding breastfeeding anymore. It's more a source of stress than enjoyment for me, and I'm wondering if we won't both be better off if I transition to formula 100%. We go back in next Monday to have her weight checked again, so I'll try to stick with what I'm doing + the supplement 'till then. Any other suggestions?

[wendstress]

Diane - I'm no BFing expert, but I can tell you with 100% certainty that every drop of breastmilk she gets from you is worth it's weight in gold! You pass on immunities, nutrition, and lots of other good things! I know it can be frustrating, but she's still very young and I guarantee you that it gets to be much better!

I think you're right on in talking to a lactation consultant. Before you go the route of formula, there are things you can take to boost your supply (fenugreek, for one).... Or you could BF, and supplement with formula after a nursing session.

BTW - Most babies are fussy in the evening! ;) It probably has little to do with what she has in her belly..... They just get cranky! James is 6 months old and still gets cranky at night....

[Marisa]

Diane -- I agree, try to avoid formula until you can speak to a LC. If you think of it as if it's 'medicine' -- something that *may* be necessary for your child's health -- then you'll also exercise the proper caution and speak to the right experts before you begin giving her any. If that makes sense. (It's a little past my bedtime. :))

Has anyone checked your baby's sucking? If she has a lazy suck, she could nurse for a half hour and not get much milk. Is it possible she's 'tongue-tied' -- where the frenulum or flap of skin beneath the tongue extends all the way to the tip of the tongue? It's a condition that's very fixable with a quick procedure in the dr's office, but it can have a real impact on baby's ability to efficiently suck.

If you're supplementing, try to give her the milk in a cup rather than a bottle -- a small, soft medicine cup will do. If it is a problem with a lazy suck, a bottle will only hurt her progress if you try to work with her to get her to nurse more efficiently.


Happy -- that is absolutely outrageous that they would insist on a dr's note for not giving solids. What authority could they possibly have in that situation??? If I were you I'd really think about asking them for their written policy before submitting to their request. But that's just me. :)

[NYN]

i was just going to say that! most babies have fussy evenings so your DD sounds totally normal. i hope the LC helps you out - best of luck to you!

happy: i am so angry for you. i would get the note from my pediatrican and i would write them a loooonnnnngggg letter explaining everything that you posted about the benefits of breast milk + every other benefit you can think of. i would have gone NUTS on them.

extended nursing: this is one of those things that i know i want to do but if i do it i will either have to deal w/ my [very vocal] family's opinions which makes me think i will cave and not do it. my otherwise very supportive DH isn't very convinced so i keep choosing events/activities where i know there will be a lot of APers who nurse toddlers. i really feel that once you see a few toddlers nursing you start to realize that there is nothing weird about it. i know that at one point i thought it was weird to see a 3-year-old nurse but i don't remember ever feeling that way if that makes sense. it's just a matter of him getting used to seeing it.

[miel]

New York Novia--

This is interesting. I thought the tolerance of my family toward extended nursing was due to our Hispanic background...or maybe that it was part of it?

Our babysitter, who is Dominican, thinks it's funny when my daughter nurses, but in a nice way...

I am probably not right about the tolerance. It's just that my uncle nursed 'til he was 5 and of course there was teasing! And my sister did too and that is also a family joke...but not in a mean way.

When I was pregnant that sister wanted me to have the baby when she was visiting me so she said to my stomach "if you come out now you can nurse until you are five!"

I never thought anything about anyone nursing since my mom did nurse my siblings for a while but I thought to myself 'oh, I can't do that! That is too hard!" And it is hard. But I still do it!

[happy1nuv]

thank you ladies... your outrage on my behalf is very comforting, especially since dh shrugged his shoulders and said, "eh... they're just coveiring their a$$"

I do plan to compile a nice few pages of reference for them, along with my pediatricians note with quotables from people/places like the aap, who, la leche, dr sears, and anyone else I can think of that is an "authority" on the subject. Speaking of which... I know I read of a study that linked starting solids with sleep - and it debunked the, once they start solids they sleep better theory. Does that sound familiar to anyone, and do you know where its from? I want to include that too since thats what I think the daycare is really after ... (I'm not in love with my daycare, but thats because I see it as a necessary EVIL, so I kinda look not to like it - after all, its not me ... of all the places I looked at, it was the most promising, but there is one more center that just opened recently that I have been tempted to look at.. they're just GIVING me incentive to find the time to do so...)

[cynder]

happy1nuv First off, that is so wrong and out of line but I think you know that. Second, I would be so offended if they told this to me in a letter. How cowardly is that?!? I would have appreciated something like this to be communicated in person if they felt so strongly about it. I think what you are doing is right. Does the daycare have a handbook. Do they state any feeding policies in the infant room. They should not have to dictate how you parent your child?

[lady1297]

extended nursing I was at my MOPS meeting this morning and meet another EBF!! It was so nice to see/talk to someone in person!! Her daughter is a month younger than my son so we are right there in understanding each other. We talked a bit about night weaning, but neither of us knows how to do it, so we agreed it must not be the right time. As for opposition, I hear some, but I don't mind it much. I just nod and say something like "I understand, that's interesting" and move on. I'm not looking to get into things with people who don't care if their opinions fit me and my family.

happy1nuv Interesting. I would definitly ask them why your son needs to be on food right now. In writting. And then go from there in educating them and reminding them that this child is paying for them to be there and for them to be caring for him, not for them to be parenting the child.

[lil_nance]

Just stopping by to brag about making it to the 4mo mark. DS is is a happy healthy BF baby, all 15lb 14oz of him. :)

[hope0805]

I'm sure someone has posted about this/asked this question before, and apologize, but I need some advice on storing pumped milk in the freezer. I have been exclusively BFing for 14 weeks now and am preparing to return to work, part-time for now, and then 4 days a week in January. At the beginning I had a problem with oversupply, so pumped some then, and have been pumping off and on when I have time. I have a fairly big freezer stash right now that I'm proud of (probably 24-36 4 oz servings), but am a little bit concerned with the storage containers I've used because I've had some leakage and want to make sure that from here on out I'm using the best thing I can.

I need to use bags if I can because we only have two refrigerator/freezer combos (one in the kitchen and an extra in the basement) and don't want to buy a stand-alone freezer unless absolutely necessary. But I can't seem to find any bags that work for me 100%. Below are the problems I've had. Any input on things I might be doing wrong, suggestions, or other products/methods to try would be greatly appreciated!

Medela CSF Bags: I find these very hard to close due to the twist tie instead of the ziploc. I have also had some milk leak out of the top even though I store them upright (in a coffee cup in the freezer until they are frozen solid, then in a separate sealed container in batches) and don't overfill. They also take up a lot of room because you cannot lay them flat.

Lansinoh "My Mommy's Milk" bags: When I found these I thought "hallelujah!" But then I've had several leak. I believe that they are leaking out of the top of the bags when I lay them flat (which the manufacturer actually *recommends*, and which is obviously one of the reasons to use zipper bags) even though I am triple checking BOTH of the zipper seals and I am only putting in 4-5 oz of milk when they are supposed to store 6 oz.

Gerber Seal N' Go bags: I've only used one of these, but read somewhere that, although they say they are freezer-safe, they are not good for storage because they are only single ply plastic and therefore do not protect the milk as well. If this is the only "issue" with these (e.g., they do not leak, like the others, which is obviously a huge concern!), does anyone think this can be remedied by putting the bags of milk inside of another container, such as a freezer zip-loc or a sealed hard plastic container?

Also, anyone who freezes in bags notice that the bag always indicates there is *more* milk than a bottle will show? For example, if I pump into a bottle, it will measure 4 oz, but then when I pour into the bag, it shows 5 oz. Frustrating!

Thanks for any advice/tips on how to take care of my liquid gold!

[Marisa]

Hope, I think that the Gerber bags inside another freezer bag would be a great solution to your dilemma. I noticed that as well, that the bags would never accurately show how much was inside. I got in the habit of marking the number of oz. as well as the date/time just to be sure I remembered how much was really in there when I defrosted.

[Sarah]

Lady and Sarah!

Hooray! I really need help.

I guess--Sarah did your girl wean herself? What happened that reduced her nursing?

I ask because my baby is way, way, way into nursing. I mean, her ideal day would be to nurse ALL DAY! AND NIGHT!

So just thinking in terms of the future I'd like to know what's in store, possibly--as each kid is different.

Kind of. Not really. She was never a huge comfort nurser. IME, most toddlers go through fits and starts about nursing. Most, I think, have periods where they want to nurse all the time and then periods where they could care less. I had been a SAHM (except for school 13 hours/week) until my DD was 2, and then when she turned 2.5 I started teaching FT, and was gone all day. So she couldn't nurse much except when I was home. She had been down to maybe 4 times a day- wakeup, midday, after nap, and bed. I was gone for two of those, and then I got pg and my supply tanked. She continued to nurse until I was like 16 weeks pg, but I don't think she got much. Eventually I started distracting her from the morning BF by jumping out of bed quickly and getting her breakfast, and I eventually nursed her for the last time on Easter morning. It was not CLW at all, but it was very respectful, IMO. She maybe complained about it once or twice, and may have cried once, but that was it. I gently told her she could snuggle me or have some milk in a cup, and she was okay.


Lady-- I am the same way...There are some benefits to nursing but on the other hand it is not easy with a toddler.

I was saying one QOTD or WEEK can be: What are the benefits of extended nursing? What are the drawbacks?


For us, the health benefits were the biggest reason to continue. Anecdotal evidence means little, but my DD was rarely sick. I was glad to keep nursing her through last year's cold and flu season.

I was also continuing because it was a good comfort for her and a great way to connect, even as she grew older and much more independent.

I basically just saw no reason to stop, and so didn't. I did begin to feel uncomfortable with her nursing at the very end- when she was about 2.75. I don't know if it was a psychological thing or because I was pg, but I did start to get a little skeeved. Not that I judge others nursing kids who are 3+. I think it's awesome. I think I had just reached my personal comfort level, with that child. I may nurse this baby longer, who knows.

DRAWBACKS--

it's time consuming and tiring and even painful sometimes. Lately when she gets totally freaked I honestly have to NIP and that is something I hate doing. I live in fear someone who knows me will see me doing this. (I felt a little better about it when she was an infant but there's this huge stigma associated with nursing toddlers and even though it is unfair it does get to me).

I'm not even really sure it's good for her. She's kind of dependent on the breast and maybe doesn't learn how to do things like calm herself...

But mainly my big, huge fear is that weaning right now will traumatize her--this is something she thinks she needs...it's a huge part of her life...she would not understand, I don't think, if all the sudden I was like--NO WAY. She looks a little rejected when I say 'no' for reasons of time or because we are in public or what.

Weaning doesn't have to be all or nothing. You could, if you felt you needed to, set limits on NIP or whatever. You will be able, as your kid gets older and more verbal, to say, "not right now, wait until ____" and she will get it. I NIPed until my DD weaned, but I know it's not for everyone, in every culture or every family. You could get her used to cow or soy or rice milk in order to give her something so she'll wait until you're home.

And when you do eventually fully wean, you don't have to (and IMO, should not) go cold turkey. You can start with "don't offer, don't refuse" and see how far that gets you. Then you could start some gentle weaning techniques, like telling her she can only nurse in one specific chair (they often will not ask if they know they have to go all the way upstairs to nurse), or limiting it to before nap/bed, etc. It can be a slow process, where you teach her how to comfort herself, not just slam the door in her face and leave her to figure it out. It's pretty normal and healthy to have a strong connection and attachment to your mother and to nurse well into your toddler or childhood years. There's never been any evidence to prove ot suggest it's dangerous psychologically or otherwise. She will learn to comfort herself, but she's still only a baby or toddler, KWIM? We don't tell kids her age to suck it up when they fall down, right? So it's not really much different to nurse her for soothing than it is to rock her or kiss her or snuggle her.

[Sarah]

Happyinluv-

Oh boy, I would be annoyed. Have a sit-down with the director, show her the AAP statement about EBFing until 6 months, and refuse to send anything else. Ridiculousness.

[snowzilla]

Marisa, sorry to bother you with this - but do you happen to know Hale's stance on Robaxacet (Methocarbamol -Acetaminophen) and whether it is safe to breastfeed while taking it?? I'm looking all over his website and not seeing the info I'm looking for. I've done a doozy on my right shoulder and shoulder blade, and it is making it virtually impossible to pick up Avery right now.

TIA,
Carla

[Marisa]

Carla -- he points out that it's approved for BFing moms by the AAP, and mentions to watch for sedation in the infant. :)

[snowzilla]

Thank you! :)

[mollyeilis]

I'm so upset.....DD has only gained 4 ounces in two weeks. We didn't believe the public health nurse's scale (she came for a home visit today), so I took her into the Dr's office to have her weight double checked. Well, the nurse's scale ended up being right on. DD was 8 lbs 15 oz at birth, and only weighs 8 lbs 7 oz now, at 3 weeks. It just doesn't add up......we're feeding 8 - 10 times per day (sometimes 30 min on each breast, I let her come off on her own), her diaper is wet at every feeding, and she's having 3 - 6 bowel movements each day, too. I suspect that I have a supply issue, so we're trying to see if she'll take a supplement after I BF. Tonight she gobbled up the 3 oz of breastmilk I had pumped & stored, no problem. I'm thinking that's why she's extra fussy every evening, too...poor baby is probably hungry.


About the birth weight, something that's been discussed here is that birthweight can be "off". Did you have pitocin and other fluids during labor? If so, those can go through to the baby, and make the baby heavier with water-weight than baby would have been. So the birth weight isn't "correct" to begin with.

Did any of that happen? If so, it makes it harder to figure out how much she should weigh.


I just got out my Dr. Sears Baby Book, and he mentions the possiblity of not getting enough hind-milk. When you nurse her, do you switch breasts for every milk-meal? If so, don't. Nurse her from the same breast for two sessions in a row, to increase the hind-milk she's getting. That's the fatty stuff.

In the book: Dr. Bill notes "There are babies who are normally slow weight-gainers. They are often "banana" body-type (long, lanky) babies who put more of their calories into height than weight, or normal petite babies from petite parents. Unlike the failure-to-thrive infants, these babies produce the normal number of stools, and their skin does not have a losse, wrinkly appearance."

[mollyeilis]

I must say that BFing is very frustrating at times expecially when DS is crying and refusing to latch on when it's time to eat. I keep thinking of how it will get better in the long run but I'm so frustrated since it takes me up to 2hours to feed him during our overnight feedings. He just fusses at the nipple like he doesn't know what it is. Is that normal?? During the day it's a little better but at 4am I'm contemplating the switching to formula issue. Do I just have a fussy baby? When it comes time for feeding I actually get scared and nervous too. Not just cause of the breast sensitivity but because he crys so much.

Also, the nurses/staff at the DR's always say "he's so mad" like it's NOT normal for a naked newborn to cry when he's on his back. They drive me nuts:mad: If DS is not swaddled he's not very happy unless we are holding him, so he crys otherwise. Will that change too?? I keep wondering if he'll ever be happy outside his tight swaddle.

(After I gave birth I seriously wanted to walk out the next morning cause the staff is soooooo awful there.)


Baby is not even 2 weeks old, right? Think of it as you getting a new job. Not even 2 weeks into the job, you'd hardly know everything, right? You might be nervous or not know everything exactly, you'd still get jittery! It's the same for baby! And for you, actually. :D You're both new at this!


Don't make any decisions at 4am. OK?


I think baby being confused about nipples in the dark is normal. And baby being confused sometimes is normal. I know my guy was. Heck, sometimes he STILL pops off and stares at my nipple as though it were the oddest thing he'd ever seen in the world. Like he's never seen it before. And then he remembers and pops back on. :rolleyes:

Crying is normal. For both of you. :p

I was very lucky in that hubby would wake up at night with us (for about a month, at least), and if baby was fussing, he'd take him. The two of them would walk around, hubby singing to him, bouncing him, sort of de-fussing him. Once they were done, Eamon would either really really REALLY want milk NOW, or he would at least have chilled out a bit. And then I could put him back on my boob and he'd get back to business.

Can your hubby help? Will your hubby help? He should help. :)


I'm sorry the nurses are being such dingbats. He's not mad, he's cold! And sad to be out of your arms! He spent so long in your belly, all curled up and warm, and he's not even used to being out for less than 2 weeks, and people want him to be naked in the cold, all stretched out! Of course he's sad. Sad, not mad. And if he's mad, eh, who cares? Ignore them.

As for leaving the next day, I know PLENTY of people who do that. I know many who leave mere hours after. :)

[pgbg]

Hawaii Reading your post brought tears to my eyes -- I felt exactly the same way. On top of that I had (and still have) SO many unsupportive people (DH's family) questioning why I was BF in the first place. So...know that it does get better! I look at my and DS's BF relationship and it's amazing how far we've come in only 11 weeks. He used to do the grunting/head bob/fussing at the boob thing all the time. I read here once that someone likened his cries to him saying "Gimmee the boob, gimmee the boob" when all the while the nipple was right in front of him! I used to remember that and smile in the middle of the night, it struck me as so funny. But do know that he'll get better at it -- as mollyeilis said, he's knew at this!! My biggest recommendation is to read this board religiously throughout the day. It was my biggest inspiration and still is where I get my only support for BF. :o
I also went through a time thinking my milk was causing him harm, because he'd seem so miserable at feedings -- crying, pulling away. But then other times he'd latch right on, and look up at me with milk dribbling down his face and would seem so content. So while it's normal to be afraid of feedings, I think problems are less common than we might think.
Finally, DS was that "fussy baby" too for a while -- we couldn't put him down or he'd never stop crying. That got better at about 6 weeks I think...less having to jiggle him and rock him all the time to get him to go to sleep.
So yes, it will get better!!! Hang in there :)

[SiValleySteph]

Hawaii, I sent you a PM. There are some breastfeeding support groups in our area that are free. I can tell you that the El Camino one is really helpful and I'm sure the Good Sam one is too. They are staffed by a lactation consultant and it can just be so relieveing to be around other new mothers who know how your are feeling.

El Camino Hospital's Group (http://www.elcaminohospital.org/1868.cfm)
Tues/Thursday 12-1:30

Good Samaritan Hospital
Tuesday 2-3:30
408-559-2229

ETA - I'm assumming you are in the San Jose area! :cool:

[NYN]

for those of you who are having issues w/ fussy babies and thinking it is your milk causing harm....please know that my DD is the happiest, most smiley baby ever and even she has her fussy periods. it's totally normal and i promise, it DOES get better!!

miel: i think that in the americas it's different (more normal to breast feed). i do notice that the extended breast feeders i see around here are mostly south american. i am from spain and oddly enough i can't think of anyone i know who BF -- at least not in my town (i go back often). my dad spread the news over his last visit that i was exclusively BF as if it was a novelty (my parents, i have to say, have become very supportive...almost proud) and two of my cousins called me up to talk about it -- they definitely find it funny but NOT in a good way and if i hear one more person tell me i will stop once she bites me, i will scream, lol.

all that said, i welcome being the freak in my family. ;) like i keep telling everyone, i have a happy and healthy baby so i must be doing something right, HAHA.

oh, and i brought it up in my LLL meeting today and i thought it was cute that the leaders kept on calling it "biologically normal breast feeding" instead of extended breast feeding. thought that was cute.

[Candy]

I've successfully nursed Maya for 9 months! YAY! I love our nursing relationship. :D

[magdesilver]

Congrats Candy! I can congratulate you in person next week :)

[Sebski]

New mom here with a couple of quick questions...

I was supplementing with formula until my milk came in and exclusively switched to the boob yesterday. Since then, my little man has been having more explosive diapers than he had been having previously. They aren't a huge mess, but I just wanted to make sure that noisy/loose poops are normal.

Also - is it typically harder to get a BF baby to burp after a feeding? He seemed to burp more easily after a bottle while we were supplementing than he is now that he's a boob guy.

Thanks for your help and I apologize if these are stupid questions!

Edited to add another question... how long does a 'typical' feeding run? DS seems to nurse for about 20 min on 1 boob and then only about 10 - 15 on the other when I switch him over. Is this ok? Should he be nursing longer?

[magdesilver]

-The pooping is normal. BF babies have very liquidy poop, so it will be different from the formula poop! It is normal for it to be very often (my DD would poop during every feeding, sometimes in between too! so fun!) and you will often hear it, totally normal!
-I only burped my baby if she seemed uncomfortable, which wasn't often. She would usually let out a burp on her own after a feeding, if she needed to. BF babies don't take in as much air since there isn't air in the breast.
-Your BF times sound perfectly normal as well. As your baby gets older the times will decrease but that sounds just right for a new baby!
Congrats on switching back to 100% BF, you're doing great mama!

[LeslieR]

I was going to say the same thing about burps. I only burp DS if he acts like he needs to burp (i.e. fussing at the boob). Otherwise, he either burps on his own or he doesn't.

About how long a feeding should last-that's up to baby. The nurses and the LC in the hospital told me to let him nurse as long as he wanted and for him to delatch himself. I went with this for a while until I realized there were times he was asleep and still sucking away.:rolleyes: Now when he is still attached and I know he's asleep, I'll pop him off and put him down.

[Sebski]

Thanks so much for the quick responses! I have to say that I'm surprised how quickly DS took to the boob, but we found at the ped's today that he already put on 2oz since coming home from the hospital on Saturday! :D

DS always falls asleep at the boob too and I feel bad trying to burp him for 5 min and chance waking him up.... so it's ok to put him down straight from the boob if he falls asleep? He doesn't seem fussy while feeding...

Thanks again!

[HollyMN]

I have a question....if I eat total junk, is my milk not as good as if I eat healthfully? Here's the deal. My ds just got his first ear infection (3.5 months), and I've just taken his health for granted. He's a full term baby, breastfed, not regularly exposed to other infants/kids, no second hand smoke, etc. So he's got a cold which led to an ear infection, and I don't know where it came from or how to prevent it in the future.

I've been eating junk lately. I went to a CC Halloween party which had two kinds of delicious cake and they sent me home with leftovers. Then we went trick or treating, and I eat all the candy. Then my DH went grocery shopping and got two cartons of ice cream "free with purchase". Then on Friday work had donuts for Veterans Day. But I don't think the word got spread, because there were tons of leftovers and I ate more than my share. All this in two weeks.

This weekend, I stopped the madness and am doing stuff to boost my own immune system for my sake (I'm working and also breastfeeding, so when my good sleeper starts to wake up every 2-3 hours to nurse for his cold, I don't want the lack of sleep to make ME sick). I'm wondering if I didn't have all the antibodies to pass to him, and if making myself better would help make him better faster.

[Marisa]

Sebski -- you got some good advice already! :) It sounds like if he's starting to have normal BF poops and he's gaining well, then it's fine to let him dictate the length of feedings. Be sure that he gets 8-12 in a 24-hour period, newborns can be very sleepy. My own problems with my DS in the beginning came from the fact that he was so willing to nurse for only a few minutes, then go to sleep for a couple of hours... and I was so beat I was willing to let him. As long as he's on for about 15 minutes or so and sucking vigorously at least part of that time, you should be fine.

Are you still in my area? I know a great LLL group I can recommend. ;)


Holly -- the quality of your milk should not really fluctuate if you eat more junk food than usual. They've actually done worldwide studies of breastmilk, and the women in countries where the general population could be considered malnourished actually produce breastmilk that is quite similar to the milk produced by women in countries like ours.

It's wise of you to want to eat better for your own health, but our bodies are programmed to make sure that baby gets the best of everything, first. :)

[moderngal]

I feel bad trying to burp him for 5 min and chance waking him up.... so it's ok to put him down straight from the boob if he falls asleep?
I never burp DS in the middle of the night or if he's fallen asleep at the breast.

[pgbg]

I also have a question about length of feeding times...DS was always somewhat fast. I never took him off, but he would pop off the boob in less than 10 minutes even as a newborn. Now he kind of pops off after a few minutes sometimes, but then will continue to suck when I put him back on. We repeat this a bunch of times per feeding, then do the same on the other boob. My question is that in the middle of the night, he usually will suck for longer than during the day, and then fall asleep. Should I wake him up to eat more? Would he sleep longer if I get him to eat more?

[NYN]

i never burp dd at night either and during the day i can only get a few good burps out of her. she also was always a very efficient feeder. i don't think she ever spent more than 12 minutes at the breast (yes, i timed it b/c i was so obsessed the first few weeks, lol) at the beginning and now she is on and off w/in 5-8 minutes.

i have a question i forgot to post before: what opinions do you have regarding vitamins (for the baby, not for you)? my pediatrician is really pushing me to give DD a vitamin supplement in liquid form. i basically ignored her b/c everything i have read (and i vaguely remember marisa saying this too -- but i was PG when i supposedly read this so who knows) points to it not being necessary. then at the last w.b. visit i confessed i wasn't giving them to her and i got chastised and frankly, she scared me into doing it. of course i did it only once or twice b/c DD acted like i was poisoning her (they DO taste horrible - it's like straight iron, yuck!) so i keep conveniently "forgetting" for the day. but i do feel really guilty about it and i'd like to hear opinions if anyone has any.

[moderngal]

NewYorkNovia, my ped said she's supposed to tell me to give it to DS, but she knows I don't and said it's not a big deal. I told her I did some research on it at LLL and kellymom and wasn't convinced of the benefits- she agreed and said she didn't give it to her kids either.

[SiValleySteph]

NYN, Our ped basically told us it was our choice and we told him we didn't want to give the supplemental vitamins to our son, so we don't. He didn't give us a hard time at all. We didn't even take the perscription (are they prescription?).

[LexyLou]

I'm so envious of you ladies who don't have to burp DC at night. If I don't burp her there is hell to pay. I've done it a couple of times hoping to get her to sleep right away and within 2 hours she's scream with gas pains. Hopefully as she gets older her system will get stronger.

Question-

DD is a drinking machine. When we give her EBM we give it to her in 4 oz but she always still seems hungry and I have to put her to the boob anyway. We haven't been in the postion where I haven't been home when we give her the bottle but in the near future there will be. Is it normal for a 7 week old to take 5+oz at each feeding or is she over eating?

[SD601]

Alexis, I remember DS at about that time (or earlier--eek!) taking 4-5 ounces in a bottle. I remember thinking, how can a 10 pound baby eat almost six ounces in one sitting? However, my DS only took that amount for about a week. Now at 13 weeks he eats about 3-4 in a bottle. Rarely does he eat that much, and I would give it to him if he acted like he wanted it. I would let her eat if she's not spitting up. It may be a growth spurt, or perhaps she didn't eat that much from you all day and is making up the calories in the bottle.

[LeslieR]

NYN, IIRC, Marisa said that ten minutes in a sunny window would do the same trick as the vitamin supplement. I could be wrong, though...

Sebski, if there's one time I NEVER burp DS, it's at night. I have a hard enough time getting up out of the glider to put him in his crib without waking him up, no way I'm smacking him on the back to burp him.:p And truthfully, I'm so sleepy and braindead in the middle of the night that it never occurs to me to burp him. I would probably only do it if he was fussing at the breast and I knew he needed to burp, but I don't recall one time at night where I have had to burp him yet.

[Marisa]

Alexis, I just found this link for someone else --

http://www.kellymom.com/bf/pumping/milkcalc.html

It might help you decide how much milk you should be leaving her. Basically she says that by the time baby is a month old, the stomach capacity should be anywhere from 2-5 oz., so it clearly is something you'll have to pay attention to with your own baby and evaluate for yourself. That's a wide range of variation! :)


NYN -- the AAP's new breastfeeding guidelines still recommend the use of Vitamin D supplements for breastfed babies over 2 mos -- that's their only official position on vitamin supplements for a baby your age.

But what Leslie says is correct -- in our part of the world, there is enough sunlight exposure that your baby should be fine with just minimal average time near an open window.

As for iron, a breastfed baby will have stores of it available for at least (roughly) 6 months, and the iron in breastmilk, while not plentiful, is much more bio-available than from other sources. In other words, there's not as much of it as in formula, but what is there is easily used by the baby.

Sometime in the second half of the first year, most peds will do a finger prick test for anemia. If they find that iron levels are low, steps can be taken at that point to either supplement baby with vitamin drops, or offer more iron-rich foods (if baby is eating solids regularly). This test can be performed earlier than 6 months if there is concern. I believe that 'normal' for a breastfed baby is somewhere in the 10-11 range.

My own son was anemic shortly after his first birthday. Up until that point I had simply decided not to fill the prescriptions for vitamins, but once there was a need I got the iron-rich supplement and used it for a month to get his levels back up. Since he was slow to take to solids, I also used that time to get him interested in a few foods that would give him a more natural source of iron -- sweet potatoes, yogurt fortified with baby cereal, meat, etc. You can also cook in a cast iron skillet, to increase the iron content of the food.

Joey's iron levels rose within a month, at which point I stopped the drops (not like we were able to force too much of it into him either, those things are rank!) We continued to offer him iron-rich foods, though, and at his re-check at 18 months his levels were still normal.

[EJM]

Lex: I asked about overfeeding last week as we were giving Avery 4oz at 3 weeks and she was still wanting more. This week we've cut back to 3oz, but do the bottle during the day when we are a little more awake and not so desperate to soothe her and get back to bed. It does take more rocking/soothing but she has stopped the screaming and sucking her hand with 3oz, which is her signal for more. DH also is giving her the bottle more slowly (more burping and entertaining during the feeding). Marisa had suggested that maybe she drinks too fast to realize she was full before we got to the 4oz. I'm guessing that was partially it, as the slowing down definitely helped. I think she also wanted so much more last week because of the 3 week growth spurt, and is now back to being satisfied with less. In fact last night she didn't even want all 3oz.

Does anyone here suffer from migraines? All the prescription medicines I normally take fall into the "not sure what effect it has on BFing" category and I don't want to take any chances. I lived without them through the pregnancy, but I'm not the best mommy when I have one and a screaming infant to care for. Going on my second day of the latest one right now I feel like I'm getting desperate for something other than Advil which does nothing. I'll ask my doctor again, but I usually get the same answer that large studies haven't been conducted on these types of medicines.

[Kiley]

DS is 13 weeks and EBF. He's been at daycare for 4.5 days. Before, he ate every 2 hours and slept through the night. Now this is his "schedule" -

6:45am - BF
11:00am - 4 oz
12/12:30pm - BF
3/4pm - 3.5 oz
5pm - BF (longer session than usual)
6pm - BF (longer session than usual)
7pm - BF (sometimes)
and then he's up 1-3 times during the night.

He's fed on demand with me and at daycare. Is he getting enough to eat? He's a big boy - 20 pounds (97th percentile). I'm worried he's not eating enough because he used to eat so much when he was with me all day and still does on the weekend. He's not a fan of the bottle. Should I have daycare try feeding him on a schedule like every 2-3 hours? Should I increase the amount in the bottles (I just send 4oz bottles)? Daycare says he seems satisfied with what he's getting.

[shellbell516]

Kiley - Rachel did the same thing during her first week at daycare. I think part of nursing more in the evening is it's comforting for her from not being with me all day. She's been there a month now and doesn't need to nurse as often or as long before going to bed.

[Marisa]

EJM -- can you give me a few names of the meds you'd like to try? You can PM me if you prefer. I can look them up in Hales and email you copies of the info so you can make your decision.

Kiley -- I absolutely agree with Michelle. It's definitely common for babies to go through a 'transition' when they start daycare, and nursing more at night is part of that. It's a re-connect with mom. However, even those of us who did not go back to work at that age found that our babies loved to 'cluster feed' in the evenings for a couple of weeks, sometime in the 2-4 month range. It may have something to do with mom's milk being slightly lower in general at that time of day (that's true for just about everyone), but that's why you might hear the dinner hour being referred to as a 'witching hour' for baby.

[Kiley]

Thanks for the replies, Marisa & Michelle.

Another question - why isn't he eating every 2 hours at daycare when he does eat every 2 hours when he's with me?

[EJM]

Marisa -- thanks for the help! I usually take Zomig (5mg if that makes a difference), although I'm willing to try others if it won't affect Avery. The general category of meds are "beta blockers". I have had success with acupuncture, so I'll try to go more if I cannot take the meds until we no longer BF.

[Surftraitor]

I'm currently suffering from BF nipple pain. DS has never been a great latcher and I've suffered through it now for almost 6 weeks. When it got really bad, I would take a day or two off and pump. Right now we give him 3 bottles a day (DH helps with feedings) and all other feedings are BF.

Now, I'm at my wits end. Both nipples are cracked and scabbed and his latch ons are so painful it takes my breath away. I've been taking the Ibuprofen my OB prescribed when I checked out of the hospital. This helps a lot with the pain, but I'm down to only 3 more pills. I'm just so confused--are his latch ons still bad, or are my nipples in such bad shape that its hard to heal? I'm convinced that even a perfect latchon is going to inflict pain. I religiously apply lansinoh after every nursing. I try to let them air dry. Last night, I had really bad shooting pain in both breasts it woke me out of my sleep. I really don't want to stop BFing, but I don't know how much longer I can go. I'm home alone with DS all day, so breaking away to pump isn't very simple, since DS usually needs my attention when I'm hooked up to the pump.:rolleyes:

What else can I do? Can I try using Neosporin on my BBs to speed healing so long as I clean it off before nursing?

[Marisa]

EJM - in his 2002 edition Hale does state that there aren't studies yet on Zomig, and suggest sumatriptan (aka Imitrex) as an alternative. Is that a possibility you could discuss with your dr? LMK your email if you'd like scans of those two pages from Medications and Mother's Milk.

Surf -- have you considered using a nipple shield until you have a chance to heal? I don't like to suggest it lightly, since they can be a PITA too (they're like giant contact lenses, if you drop one at night! :D) Still, it was the only thing that allowed me to heal after a couple of weeks of very bad latching, scabbing, etc. etc. It will give you a way to protect your nipples without the added work of pumping.

I used them with my son for about 4-6 weeks, until I healed and felt confident enough to nurse without them. By that time his latch had improved and he was just bigger, so he was able to take more of the nipple into his mouth.

They sell them at Target in the baby feeding aisle -- they're Medela. Six bucks, I think. If you find it could work for you, I'd go and get a spare or two -- like I said, they can get lost and it's good to have a backup.

[newyorkgirl]

Surftraitor, it's actually better to use Polysporin than Neosporin. I think neomycin, the antibacterial agent in Neosporin, is somewhat toxic to baby. I'm not an expert on this, but I think you can think about using a nipple shield while your nipples heal. Others on this thread can probably tell you more about it.

Meanwhile, in addition to applying the Polysporin, I totally recommend something like the all-purpose nipple ointment, recommended by Dr. Jack Newman, especially since you mention the shooting pains and those are often a precursor of thrush. (We've battled thrush on and off for 2-3 months.) The handout is here (http://www.breastfeedingonline.com/3b.html). But I basically mix up 2 parts (1 oz tube) Polysporin (to fight off bacterial infection), 2 parts (1 oz tube, but I think it comes in a 0.84 oz tube) Lotrimin AF (to combat thrush), 1 part (0.5 oz tube) 1% hydrocortisone cream (to help with inflammation). You can also take OTC ibuprofen, like Motrin, at 600 mg (I think this is 3 capsules) 3-4 times a day.

Finally, do you have a lactation consultant that is IBCLC that you can have look at the latch and help you with it? We visited the LC when we had problems around 8 weeks and, while DS's latch was fine, she helped us find a couple different positions that made nursing even easier and even improved DS's latch more.

Keep it up! I know it's really hard! The first 6-8 weeks are like this and it often gets easier after that. *hugs*

[Kiley]

I know (from experience) that the first few weeks of bfing can be hard and painful with your first baby, but what about the second/third, etc. baby?

ETA: And DH wants to know if your nipples go back to normal afterwards, ie. not always hard :rolleyes:

[maggieb]

Bf'ing was painful with #2 also, but not quite as bad. I went to see a LC with #1 and #2 and after both visits I walked away with more knowledge and a better latch, which improved the pain a lot.

What's different about bf'ing #2 is that I don't stress out nearly as much about weight gain and how much the baby is getting. With Helena I stressed out so much about it and now with Marisa I stress, but it's not near as bad. Overall my bf'ing experience has been better with #2. :D

[EJM]

Thanks Marisa! Unfortunately the one time I tried Imitrex I felt so terrible and out of it, I wouldn't trust myself to be alone to take care of the baby. I would be afraid I might fall asleep and not hear her, it was that bad when I took it. Is there a newer edition of the Hale book? If so I'll check our local bookstore to see if there is a more current write-up on Zomig.

[mollyeilis]

Surftraitor, rather than putting the Lansinoh on your nipples after baby's meals, have you considered putting the lanolin on baby's mouth right before starting a nursing session?

I had yeast for ages (not because of that!) and sometimes the only way I didn't scream when he latched on was b/c I would smear the lanolin on his mouth. It made latching on a bit easier, he just sort of slid right on.

And then it was gone by the time he was done eating, allowing me to air dry my nipples without them covering the yeast with the lanolin (nice breeding ground for yeast).

Also, have you considered that it might be yeast? I had yeast without Eamon ever getting full-on thrush with white patches in his mouth. Most he ever had was a nasty awful diaper rash, but never did have the white patches in his mouth.

*****
"why isn't he eating every 2 hours at daycare when he does eat every 2 hours when he's with me?"

Because he likes eating with/from you, better than with the people at daycare! :) I'm sure there are more reasons, that's just the most fun one. :D

I've heard often that babies will simply wait until the "source" gets back, until they eat or eat a lot. From how often I hear it, it must be yet another one of those variations of normal!

[Dally]

EJM--Just want to offer <<hugs>>. I get migraines, too. I was lucky that during PG my migraines basically vanished (made me want to be PG all the time! Too bad I don't want a zillion babies. :p ). Since DD was born, I've only had two really bad headaches--the ones where I am incapable of taking care of DD. I have my DH and family on call if/when that happens. When I was on leave, DH had to stay home from work one day because of my migraine. It's scary when you can't take care of your baby. I'm still off of all meds (have been since I became PG), but once in a while I take excedrin to stop a migraine from coming (sometimes it works; sometimes not). Drinking iced tea can also help. Other than those caffeine-laden things, I try to stay away from caffeine. If you have a headache but it's not unbearable yet, it sometimes helps to put a cold compress on your forehead and/or the back of your neck, but warm your hands and feet. (Not easy to do with a baby, I know...maybe when DC is napping?) In any case, migraines are so different for everyone, so maybe none of these things will help. Mostly, I just wanted to offer empathy. It's definitely hard.

[Surftraitor]

marisa--thanks so much for the shield advice. I went to Target today and bought three of them. The first try threw DS for a loop, but he adjusted and we're working on it. Its definitely less painful.

[kelseyledare]

Hello, I am new to this thread and would love some advise about thrush. I BF my 5 month DD once daily and then pump twice daily. I was doing well with this until early this week when I developed a plugged duct and then right mastitis. I was able to massage the plug free and am taking dicloxicillin for the mastitis. I felt better for one day and then white plaques appeares on my nipples along with severe pain radiating up both breasts. I spoke with the LC who immediately suspected thrush. So now I have begun miconazole cream 3-4x per day, and my DD is on nystatin 4x per day. It has been less than 24 hr, but I'm still having severe pain, similiar to my initial BF days. I am unable to nurse, only pump on light settings due to the discomfort.

Is there anything else I could do for relief? Would adding Diflucan by mouth for myself help? It is tough BF and working, but I really want to make 6 months exclusive before starting cereal.

[mollyeilis]

For anyone with migraines, my hubby used to get killer ones that would keep him in a dark room for a day or more. Once we met and I was able to adjust his spine (I'm a currently non-practicing chiropractor), over the course of about a year his migraines all but went away. He can't even remember the last time he had a full-blown migraine.

So for anyone who wants to explore it, you might want to look into it. I personally practiced Network Spinal Analysis, if anyone interested wants to google it to "find a practitioner".

[Marisa]

kelsey -- I did find that when we had thrush, the first time was so severe that diflucan was the only thing to knock it out. Joey was also having symptoms (a nice yeast rash in the diaper area) so I didn't even want to fool around, I went straight for the big guns. :)

Even if you do decide to go for the prescription, you can help combat the yeast right now by avoiding all processed sugary foods until your symptoms subside, and pick up some acidophilus at the drug store -- it's a probiotic supplement that will restore the levels of 'good' yeast-fighting bacteria in your system. While you're battling, thrush, you can take 2 capsules, three times a day (a regular "maintenance" dose would be 1-2 caps, once a day).

[Kiley]

Plugged ducts for the third time here! :( The first two times I think happened from over supply and engorgement. This time it's because of the evil underwire nursing bras that I've been wearing since I'm back at work for one week. Can anyone recommend a great non-underwire nursing bra/tank and where to buy? Also, how am I going to get rid these plugged ducts (both sides, but one side is worse) when I'm at work and my baby's not?

[LILRTL]

I have to celebrate. I NIPed for the first time yesterday!!! :D It was so...so...liberating?! lol I got no dirty looks, no comments, just a few smiles from older women. I may actually do it again... ;)

[Natrat80]

Congrats Lora! :D

[kinaida]

Hi all,

I'm just here to subscribe :) I'm due with my first in 2 weeks -- and I'm committed to breastfeeding, but scared about it too. I'm reading Dr. Sears' Breastfeeding Book, watched a video from Medela/LLL and am planning on reading The Art of Breastfeeding. But I feel like this is one of those things that you won't really "get" until the baby is here!

I'm sure I'll be asking all of you ladies for advice in a few weeks!

[pgbg]

Plugged ducts for the third time here! :( The first two times I think happened from over supply and engorgement. This time it's because of the evil underwire nursing bras that I've been wearing since I'm back at work for one week. Can anyone recommend a great non-underwire nursing bra/tank and where to buy? Also, how am I going to get rid these plugged ducts (both sides, but one side is worse) when I'm at work and my baby's not?

Hi -- I have 3 of the same bra from Target that I love -- I'd tell you the style but I'm wearing it right now!! LOL. :)
When I get home I can check. It has a very supportive band that I love, and I used to only wear underwires pre-BF.

[kelseyledare]

Thanks, Marisa. I am still hurting as badly after 24 hr on the cream so I'd like to try the Diflucan. How many times a day did you take it- just once? I will try to get to the drug store tonight to get some acidophilus as well.

Will hot or cool compresses help? All of a sudden, I am developing little plugged ducts all over the place, when I never had any previously, even during the early days with lots of engorgement.

[prudies]

Anyone want some free fenugreek? I have an unopened bottle of the stuff, and I feel bad throwing it out. I'll send it priority mail wherever. Email me at jsplitter@yahoo.com.

[celina]

Prudies,

I emailed you. :)

[Kristen78]

New Visitor here!

My daughter is 2 weeks old today. I decided to give my pump a try this afternoon while she was sleeping. Her pediatrician said it was OK to start pumping whenever since breastfeeding was going so well for us. She gained 14.5 oz last week!

Anyways, I have my SIL's Medala PIS pump. Whats a normal amount of milk to get out on the first try pumping? I admit I was inpatient and only sat there pumping for 5-10 minutes. I got a little over an ounce combined from both breasts. Is that OK? Its 4pm now and I pumped around 3:45 and last fed my daughter around 2:45.

When I do try to give her a bottle what amount will she probably need? LIke an ounce or 2?

Thanks for any input!

[Sebski]

Marisa I would love the # to the LLL group near me! We seem to be doing okay for now (knock wood) but I'd love to have it on hand just in case! How does it work - can I call them w/ ??? or do I have to attend mtgs.? Not sure how soon I'll be venturing out w/ the little one... so the phone might work better for me now in the beginning. Thanks!

Another question about hiccups... do BF babies hiccup more than formula fed ones? DS almost always gets the hic's after a feeding. Whether I burp him or not... thanks!

[Sebski]

Hi Kristen! :) Great questions about pumping... I tried last night for 15 min on each boob and only got about an ounce total. :confused: Thought it would be more... looking forward to seeing what the experts here say! ;)

[Kiley]

Your supply will be at it's highest in the morning so if you pump then, you'll get more than you would in the afternoon/evening.

An ounce is good for your first time pumping. I think that as your body gets used to the pump, you might express more.

For trying a bottle 1-2 ounces is good for a two week old.

I'm not sure about the hiccups, but DS still gets them at 3 months but they've tapered off some. He had them all the time in the womb.

[Hawaii2SJ]

Just stopping by to thank you wonderful ladies for the tips and encouragement for a new BFing mom. It's been a rough week and a half. DS refused to BF on Wednesday so we went to the DR and they gave me a nipple shield. My breasts were too hard to latch onto and they hurt like heck. It''s made it alot easier and DS is getting better at latching after I remove the shield and I don't feel as nervous and freaked out when I feed him now.

Sebski- My DS does the exact same thing after eating....hiccups. I asumed it was normal. He also had hiccups pretty often when he was still in my tummy too.:p

It is normal right?? Should we be concerned?

[moderngal]

hiccups are normal. my DS had them in my belly, too- every night around 9pm. as a newborn, he got them at pretty much the same time, too. now he's 6 months old and rarely does it anymore.

So DS is 6 months old now. I am so happy that we've made it this long breastfeeding. We have no plans to stop at this point, either. It's a very good feeling. :)

[Marisa]

kelsey -- I had the 14-day Diflucan pill -- I took it only once. I'm not sure what the advantages/disadvantages are of the different types.

Kristen! Congratulations, and what a weight gain! You must be so proud. :)
It's normal to get only an oz or so -- do keep in mind that she gets more by nursing than you do by pumping, your body responds better to baby than to pump. :) Keep trying, it will I also agree with Kiley, 1-2 oz. is fine to start, you'll see how she does and you won't waste any if she's not interested.



Seb -- the LLL #s in Essex Cty are here: http://www.lalecheleaguenj.org/search.php?COUNTY=Essex&Submit=Find -- Lindy is one of the main leaders of the Montclair group; Rena doesn't often lead meetings but she does like to take phone calls. They're both very nice. :)

Hiccups don't have anything to do with the method of feeding. In a baby this young they're a symptom of an immature nervous system -- which is why it improves as baby gets older. :)

[Sarah]

CONGRATULATIONS Moderngal!!! That's a wonderful accomplishment. Keep on keepin' on. :)

(oh, and randomly, I saw your ped today, and she was great, thanks. better than that other guy at the same place who we had been seeing)

[Kristen78]

Thanks! My baby woke up about 10 minutes after I posted and she wanted to eat and milk was dribbling out of her mouth afterwards so I guess she was still getting a good amount even if the pump didn't get it out. So thats good!

[LeslieR]

kelsey, I'm on a 14 day course of Diflucan now. I apparently had a very severe case because yesterday was day 7 and the first day I noticed my nipples not looking so red and sore. Today was the first day I nursed without extreme pain. My dr had me take 2 the first day and one every day after that.

[EJM]

Kristen and Sebski: I'm not an expert by any means, but just my personal experience. I've been pumping for about 2 weeks now, I started regularly when my DD was 2.5 weeks. The first time I pumped I only got 1-1.5 oz and was worried about how little it was. Now just 2 weeks later I pump in the afternoon or evening (when my supply is probably less) but usually the first time I have a chance to sit down, and get 6-8oz from both sides. I pumped once in the morning last week and got a good 8-9 oz. I think most of my increase is because she is now eating so much more when she nurses, so it up-ed my supply, especially her 3 week growth spurt when she nursed constantly (at least it felt like that) for 3 days. :)

[Daniel's Kitty]

I would only get a couple ounces at first. Now I get about 4-5 normally.

[happy1nuv]

Hey ladies...

Today marks me breastfeeding exclusively for 6 months... tomorrow we start solids (sweet potatoes). I have mixed feelings about starting...I'm excited about it, but at the same time...my lil ones growing up...

About the pump... I've been pumping at work, and never get more than 3-6 oz, combined. I've been taking fenugreek and eating oatmeal/granola, and it doesn't seem to be helping. So... I'm not sure if that helps or not...

Update on daycare dilemmas:
So, I had a talk with the owner about why she sent me that note demanding solids. It was a good talk .. she said that she is very pro-bf, she bf her kids and usually supports the "too few" women who choose to bf exclusively for the first 6 months. BUT, because of how much Nic fusses/cries and the way he gets so excited and attacks his bottles, they feel he is hungry. It's not a policy type thing...its my case only. So, now she has me second guessing myself. I told her that we were starting solids on Saturday and that if all went well, I would be sending them with him, but that if it was a failure, we were going to back off and try again later. She didn't like hearing that, and repeated (even though I DID get the drs note) that he can't be there for 8 hours a day without food. (Ummm... I usually send 3-4 bottles...he usually drinks 2-3 ...i am NOT starving my child. But... am i?) We did go see the ped last Tuesday (ear infection)... Nic is up to 15 lbs, 7 oz (with a diaper on) ... so his weight gain is good. She's not concerned about him at all weight wise, and he has plenty of wet/dirty diapers... Am I insane to let this lady get to me?

thanks
:)

[newyorkgirl]

happy, congrats on making it 6 months. I totally look to you and the other long-term BFers - I sure hope I make it that far. :)because of how much Nic fusses/cries and the way he gets so excited and attacks his bottles, they feel he is hungry. Does he do this at home too? Has he always fussed/cried at daycare? I am wondering whether this has more to do with the fact that he is at daycare (and not with you) than whether he doesn't have enough food. If they think he is hungry, is it possible to send another bottle, rather than send solid food?

[lorialys]

Hiccups don't have anything to do with the method of feeding. In a baby this young they're a symptom of an immature nervous system -- which is why it improves as baby gets older. :)

I usually lurk, breastfeeding is going pretty well for me and my son (5 weeks today!) but I had to comment about the hiccups thing.
I had read that hiccups are an early sign of overstimulation. Not sure why they would happen right after a feeding if that's the case, but that's what I've read.

[adoredh]

hiccups are an early sign of overstimulation
TTA with that!! Collin always gets them when he's playing under his gym or when he sees something that is intresting him - ie his legs are kicking like crazy and his arms are going like mad and he's "yelling" at what he's looking at. I let him go for a couple of minutes, and watch his cues for when he gets too upset, but it never fails, he always gets hiccups! LOL!

Glad too hear that Bfing is going well Lorialys and congrats on the 5 week mark! Collin is 6 weeks today, can you believe how fast time is going by?!?!

Glad to see all the questions about breast pumps - mine ( Purely Yours) is due to arrive sometime today. Hope I'm able to get more then one oz in 45min to an hour of manual pumping I had been getting!

QOTD DS is starting to not "fish" his upper lip out when he nurses. It doesn't hurt right now (past few days) is this something that I need to worry about correcting? I'm just now able to BF on the left side with out pain and really starting to enjoy our Bfing relationship, I'd hate to have his latch cause problems, but it's hard to correct him ALLLL the time. Thanks ladies!

[lady1297]

I usually send 3-4 bottles...he usually drinks 2-3 ...i am NOT starving my child. But... am i? So tell them to give him another bottle!! If they aren't using what you send them and are saying that he's hungry, why aren't they giving him another bottle! That doesn't make sense to me. And food doesn't count for hunger just yet, it's to experiment with and practice with. He's not going to take 2 oz of food immediately, he'll eat one spoonful for every 6 or so, so it's not going to fill him up. I'd tell them to give him an extra bottle if he's hungry.

[LeslieR]

Probably a dumb question, but has anyone found it to be true that thawed breastmilk is really only good for 24hrs? I have a bag of bm in the fridge that's beein in there since last weekend. I smelled it and it didn't smell bad. Just wanted to get a definitive answer before I dump out the liquid gold.:)

[Renrel]

Hey there all. I am not sure if there is anyone hanging here who can answer a question on extended nursing issues but I figured I would try. I know most of you are still working getting through the first 3, 6, 12 or 18 months.

I have been nursing for 2 years now (yeah me!). The last couple of months we have been having a problem on and off with sore nipples. I actually get a small sore of sorts that seem like they might be related to his upper teeth. I don't know why after all this time we are now having a problem and I don't know what to do, other then trying to give that side with the boo boo a rest. DS delatchs and gives me a look if I say owe or start to tense up due to pain. He knows he is hurting me and it bothers him. He will ask to switch sides and then later tell me that the other side does not hurt anymore, does not have a boo boo and is ok. If I try to put him off he tells me he like it with a boo boo. :rolleyes:

Also, he is showing no sign of weaning. If anything he seems to want to nurse more. When ever he gets slightly frustrated or bored, if I am there, he will ask to nurse. I love having this tool for actual boo boos and when he is really out of sorts as well as to give him nutrien and maintain our strong bond, but I don't like being availalbe 24/7 (sort of- I do work full time but visit at lunch each day) as a binki subsititute. For instance, he will be working on a jigsaw puzzle, a favorite activity these days. He will get slightly frustrated finding a piece. He sees me and announce it is time to nurse instead of working through the puzzle. He will go back to the puzzle after spenidng some time with me, but I don't really want to be used for this kind of comfort. But refusing usually leads to tantrum/melt downs which I also don't like. And I don't feel right using nursing to sooth that kind of a tantrum for obvious reasons.

Any ideas?

[Marisa]

Leslie -- it does go bad much more quickly than milk that's just been refrigerated, freezing will kill some of the live cells, etc. But I would smell it, or taste a tiny bit, and see, before I threw it out.

If it's nasty, in my experience, the baby will not take it.

[dbers]

Along those same lines - what's the deal with frozen BM? I will be traveling out of town, and will need to thaw some frozen BM when I get to our destination as my parents will be babysitting. Can I somehow transport it frozen? Or should I let it thaw as we're traveling? How do you thaw frozen BM?

Also - I plan on having one glass of wine at a wedding this weekend - this is fine right? No need to "pump and dump"??

Thanks!

[wendstress]

Along those same lines - what's the deal with frozen BM? I will be traveling out of town, and will need to thaw some frozen BM when I get to our destination as my parents will be babysitting. Can I somehow transport it frozen? Or should I let it thaw as we're traveling? How do you thaw frozen BM?

Also - I plan on having one glass of wine at a wedding this weekend - this is fine right? No need to "pump and dump"??

Thanks!

To transport frozen EBM, put it in a cooler and put a bag of ice on top of the milk. Do not to open the bag of ice, because as it melts around the bags it could cause uneven temperatures. (I donate to a milk bank, and this is how I was instructed to transport my milk).

To thaw EBM, just put it in the fridge overnight, or put it in a cup of cool or even warm water. I guess, though, that if you are going to use warm water, it is better to start with cool water and slowly add warmer water.... Marissa should know for sure on that one.

Also, no problem with a glass of wine. My LC said that if you get to the point where you can feel it, you should pump and dump. But a glass, or even two, is fine.

[dbers]

To transport frozen EBM, put it in a cooler and put a bag of ice on top of the milk. Thanks! I only have 2 or 3 little cups to transport - can I use, for instance, the insulated cooler that comes with my pump and the ice pack provided? Or will that not keep it cool enough?

[jeggink]

dbers When I was looking at a milk bank, they told me not to use ice as it is warmer than the frozen milk. They told me to make sure the cooler is pretty full and stuff with newspaper. That would keep it frozen better than ice. HTH :)

[majorgal]

I haven't been on this thread since it was on the WC, but I just wanted to pop over and say thanks.

I am one of the lucky ones who had very few issues with BFing, and we are nearing our 7-month mark. DS has yet to have formula, and we started solids about a month ago, but he still gets five servings of BM a day (nurses three times and two bottles of EBM at his child center). Everyone here was so helpful in the early stages--sometimes just reading about similar concerns was reassuring enough. I just think it is terrific that this thread has been going strong for so long. I was pretty set on nursing for a full year with no formula and this thread has definitely helped me with my convictions on that...so, thanks!

Sidenote to Marisa: I love your avatar. We just got the full set of Mr. Men and Little Miss books on E-Bay for a Christmas gift for Aidan. They were my favorite as a child and I was so happy to find the full set.

[kelseyledare]

LeslieR- thanks so much for your response. I am doing the same course as you. Is your baby on nystatin or other treatment? I am on day 2 of Diflucan and have not seen relief yet, but your info gives me hope to hang on. I pump at work and have noticed a decrease in suppy recently as well.

[moderngal]

Sarah-- glad you liked our ped. we saw her today- my son just loves her. :) we had seen 2 others for sick visits recently, too- one we liked, one we didn't. guess it's kinda of the luck of the draw there.

[Surftraitor]

How do I manage oversupply? DS keeps spitting up after I BF, but never when I give him EBM. Lately when i pump, i'm getting more out of one BB than he would normally eat from a bottle. I'm so engorged after 3 hours that I'm leaking and uncomfortable. DS usually eats every 3-4 hrs.

Am I making things worse if I pump after DS eats? It just seems like he's not emptying out my BBs and getting the precious hindmilk. He seems to be going through a growth spurt this week--could that be causing my oversupply?

[magdesilver]

Surftraitor- you might have an overactive let-down. See info at kellymom here (http://www.kellymom.com/bf/supply/fast-letdown.html).
I had this, and one thing that helped a lot was switching to one-sided feeding sessions. I'd just keep DD on one side for the whole BF session unless she completely emptied that side and was still hungry (but at such a young age, usually she would conk out after just the one side). You could still pump the other side if you're building up a stash or live with it for a few days and your body will adjust to the one-sided feedings.
Also, it's very normal for babies to spit up after feedings, it may seem like a lot of milk but it's probably just a very small amount. If your baby seems happy, I wouldn't worry about it at all. Your baby will grow out of the spitting up eventually. I wouldn't pump after a feeding because that is signalling your body to make more than he needs, likely making it worse. If you're uncomfortable you can hand-express or pump a tiny bit to take the edge off, but don't empty the breast because that signals your body to make even more.

[Brink]

Hi everyone, I'm new to this thread but have been BFing for about 8 wks now. It's going pretty well. It still hurts when she initially latches but only for a minute.

Question - I have used the bobby while BFing at home and we are both used to having her raised up. When we have tried to BF in public we have a really hard time because I have to hold her head up and we both get really frustrated. For those of you using a bobby at home, what are you doing when you are out?

[NYN]

brink: you will eventually get the hang of it. i remember thinking i would need the boppy forever and then one day i realized i hadn't used it in ages. one thing i did was always feed her on my left side, which is the side that felt more natural to me, when i was NIP. when i worried to much about keeping things even (i feed off of one breast at each feeding) i got nervous. i actually only started feeling comfortable NIP off of my right breast a few weeks ago.

DS is starting to not "fish" his upper lip out when he nurses.
my DD never really fished her lip out (she does on occasion but not regularly) and my LC said that though she would prefer to see more inner lip, if it doesn't hurt me i shouldn't worry about it. she never caused my nipple damage by doing this.

happy: don't question yourself!! point out the fact that he doesn't have the fourth bottle. as someone else said, solids at this point are for learning, not nutrition.

surftraitor: some things i did...fed on one breast only per feeding, fed off of the same breast for two feedings, (i.e. 9am, left breast; 11am left breast; 1pm, right breast; 3pm, right breast), side-lying position. when it got very bad i used cabbage leaves and sage tea on the advice of my LC -- don't do this on your own...you don't want to dry up.

----
DD had her first vaccination today. she took it well (better than i did anyway) but thank god i had the magic bb to make things better. ;)

[ihearttx]

My DD is 3 months old tomorrow..and I'm proud that she has been EBF since birth!

Anyway, my question is once she is 6 months old, how many BF sessions will she have each day when she starts solids too. Will it still be 7-8 feedings every 24 hours?

I have been struggling with the idea of weaning her to formula because I have been on a limited diet since she was 2 weeks old and it's hard on me.

However the last 24 hours, I have started thinking that I can possibly stick it out. It is hard also because I have never NIP because she can be a fussy eater and I am very modest. I have a "hooter hider" and feel like I could probably nurse in my car if I needed to.

Anyway, my main question is, after 6 months, will the actual nursing sessions decrease or are the solid foods just extra meals?

Thanks!

[Marisa]

brink -- I had the same problem at first, and would confine myself to NIP in the car (where I could have my boppy and get comfortable) or in the rare mother's room that actually had a glider and a footstool (usually at the Buy Buy Baby or BRU). I felt bad, because I didn't want to seem like I was ashamed of NIP, but this phase doesn't last too long -- once baby has better head control it's a lot easier to go boppy-less. Maybe around 2-3 mos?

ihearttx -- solids will be mostly for practice for the first couple of months, you're just trying out new foods and seeing how she reacts, letting her practice.

Good for you, sticking it out with BFing! :) If your DD is sensitive, then you really are doing the best thing for her by giving her breastmilk.

I remember how tough it was, I was on an elimination diet for about 8 months with my DS. Hopefully as your DD gets older, she will be more able to tolerate you adding foods back, that's what I found to be true with my son. I began adding small amounts of dairy back after he was 7 months old.

[HGMorgann]

ihearttx for us, by 6 mo. the actual number of feedings decreased - but not really do to solids - but because she ate more at one feeding.

I don't know exactly why you are on a limited diet - dairy sensitivity for baby perhaps? But, I know some people who have been able to start slowly adding foods back into their diet as their baby gets older and their tummies can handle more. I don't avoid anything now, except pork, but during the first 4 mo. or so, I needed to limit dairy and some veggies.

[ihearttx]

ihearttx for us, by 6 mo. the actual number of feedings decreased - but not really do to solids - but because she ate more at one feeding.

I don't know exactly why you are on a limited diet - dairy sensitivity for baby perhaps? But, I know some people who have been able to start slowly adding foods back into their diet as their baby gets older and their tummies can handle more. I don't avoid anything now, except pork, but during the first 4 mo. or so, I needed to limit dairy and some veggies.


Yes, I'm on a limited diet due to possible dairy sensitivity. When she was 2 weeks old, she started totally freaking out. The pediatrician said to cut all obvious dairy and he also gave me a big list of foods that "might" cause gasiness. I don't eat anything on that list. I don't have milk or cheese, but I know due to eating out that I've had butter in my foods. And I haven't had to get serious about the cow's protein thing so I'm not sure if she was just extra gassy or if she truly has a dair sensitivity.

Anyway, thanks for your help. You too Marisa! I am just not sure what I want right now. I am so proud of myself for sticking it out, though, like you said. When we took her to the doctor at 2 weeks, I really wanted to quit then. And now we've made 3 months.

I guess I will just play it by ear for now. If I start adding back in foods to my diet will I be able to tell right away if they cause her issues? Like if I eat peas, will we know within a few hours if she freaks out?

Yes, peas are on the list of no nos my doctor gave me.

Thanks for your help and support!

[ihearttx]

HGMorgan..ps...why do you limit pork? Just curious.

[catmom]

re: the boppy and nip
For a long time, I just took the boppy with me if I had to NIP. I had the "boppy diaper bag," which was nice, but it was kind of a lot to carry. By about 3 months I figured out that if I just put my regular diaper bag on my lap and laid my DD on top of it, it worked almost as well. I really can't nurse my DD without *something* on my lap to elevate her... I just never got the hang of it, and she's so heavy now that I just can't imagine holding her up the whole time she's nursing.

[majorgal]

ihearttx : DS is now 6 1/2 months old and his frequency of nursing has defintiely changed. We have gone from 7-8 sessions a day to a very regular schedule:

Wake up: Nurse then cereal and fruit
Mid-morning: 8 oz. bottle at his child center (EBM)
Lunch: Cereal and veggies or fruit, then nursing
Mid-afternoon: 8 oz. bottle at his child center (EBM)
Dinner: Cereal, fruit and veggies (quite a bit) then nursing

The solids have not replaced any of the nursing, really. It's more that, because he is now sleeping through the night he no longer gets those extra sessions.

[LexyLou]

I know that it's normal for a breastfed baby to go 3+ days without pooping as long as they don't seem to be in discomfort but lately DD has been only going every other day and she does seem like she uncomfortable. She's always been gassy but now she's really gassy and farting up a storm. Her farts are louder than some adult farts and she's always writhing in pain and I can tell she's trying to poop (or fart) a lot on the days she didn't poop...when she does poop it's a total blow out.

Is it even possible for a breatfed baby to be constipated or is this normal? This poor girl is not going to get a break on the gas issue.

[mollyeilis]

So she's 2 months old? I vaguely remember some changes going on around that time. So I would say it's normal. Then again, I think just about anything that happens is normal. :D

Also, every few months it seemed like *something* changed in terms of E's poop (just changed again recently). So just b/c her first 2 months have been rough, gas-wise, doesn't mean it will ALWAYS be so. :D

[Tulip]

My DS is nursing with a nipple sheid right now. Does anyone have any advise or tricks to get him to nurse without it?

[Marisa]

You know I told you this before but.... time. :) Time is a big factor when you're using the shield, trying to quit too soon can be frustrating for both of you.

I had the most success with nursing without the shield when Joey was either a) sleepy or b) not terribly hungry... I could start with the shield and he'd get some milk, then remove it and he'd continue to nurse.

But we used it on and off up until he was 2 months old... it was appropriate for our situation and it allowed us to keep breastfeeding under stressful circumstances. I wouldn't rush to ditch it if it's still helping.

[diedra1027]

Tulip - My DD and I used a nipple shield until she was 5 months old. We've finally weaned off of the shield, but I think the route we took would be considered VERY unconventional. DD started having weight gain issues (I think due to the shield) and we had to start supplementing. Once DD figured out how to take a bottle, she wanted nothing to do with the shield and we were able to get rid of it. When I was reading everything I could get my hands on about weaning off a shield, most articles recommended starting the nursing session with the shield and then quickly removing it once you feel let down. That's probably the best thing to try first, but I wanted to include our weird little story in case that might help you further on down the line. DD is now off the supplements and gaining weight perfectly :).

[ihearttx]

ihearttx : DS is now 6 1/2 months old and his frequency of nursing has defintiely changed. We have gone from 7-8 sessions a day to a very regular schedule:

Wake up: Nurse then cereal and fruit
Mid-morning: 8 oz. bottle at his child center (EBM)
Lunch: Cereal and veggies or fruit, then nursing
Mid-afternoon: 8 oz. bottle at his child center (EBM)
Dinner: Cereal, fruit and veggies (quite a bit) then nursing

The solids have not replaced any of the nursing, really. It's more that, because he is now sleeping through the night he no longer gets those extra sessions.


Thank you Majorgal..that really helps a lot! I think I might be in this for the long haul now!

[kindermom]

...She's always been gassy but now she's really gassy and farting up a storm. Her farts are louder than some adult farts and she's always writhing in pain and I can tell she's trying to poop (or fart) a lot on the days she didn't poop...when she does poop it's a total blow out. Is it even possible for a breatfed baby to be constipated or is this normal? This poor girl is not going to get a break on the gas issue.

I have asked this of my peditrician every time we have seen her (and a few times between). While my DD has the opposite problem as you (she was pooping 4+ times a day including at least 1 blow out), my DD struggled alot with pooping. She would cry and grunt and get red in the face for most BMs. The pediatrician called her "dramatic" and to not worry about it. She and the LC kept telling me that her digestive track was still developing and that EBF babies rarely had constipation. FWIW, just after her 2 month check up she stopped the drama queen routine, at least when it came to pooping.

[Sebski]

HELP! DS was doing so well before... now he's waking up anywhere from every hour to every 2 hours to feed... I feel like a human feeding machine! He's 10 days old - is this normal? Will he taper off a bit? When? Please tell me that nursing won't be so non-stop at some point!!! :(

[mollyeilis]

DS was doing so well before...

He's still doing well!!!

now he's waking up anywhere from every hour to every 2 hours to feed...

Aw, newborns....

I feel like a human feeding machine!

Yep!

He's 10 days old - is this normal?

YES YES YES!!!!!!

Will he taper off a bit?

Yes!

When?

Ooh, don't know. Baby knows. Silly babies, why can't they talk? :D

Please tell me that nursing won't be so non-stop at some point!!!

At some point, it will not be so non-stop.



You will see, soon, the results of this nursing. Your milk will likely increase, and in a couple days you'll pick him up from a nap and he will be noticeably heavier. Or taller. Or both.

:D

[mollyeilis]

Wanted to add...take a bunch of pictures right now. Pick an outfit or diaper (if you're CDing), pick a background (a sheet, a blanket, something). Pictures.

Then perhaps every day or every few days, take pictures of him in the same outfit/background/whatever.

Watch him grow! Height, weight, simple filling out...it's amazing to get photographic evidence of the growth during spurts. :p


for example:

a few days old (http://images.snapfish.com/3455756323232%7Ffp58%3Dot%3E2327%3D%3C23%3D84%3B%3 DXROQDF%3E232354%3B7735%3C5ot1lsi)

about 10 days later (http://images.snapfish.com/3455756323232%7Ffp46%3Dot%3E2327%3D%3C23%3D84%3B%3 DXROQDF%3E232355%3A364698ot1lsi)

about 3 weeks old (http://images.snapfish.com/3455756323232%7Ffp54%3Dot%3E2323%3D657%3D7%3A8%3D3 2326576%3B7%3B94nu0mrj) (the purple is gentian violet)

(why did I bathe him so often? weird. it's not like he was running marathons or playing in mud puddles...odd)

[moderngal]

Sebski~ sounds like a growth spurt to me. My DS has done all of the typical growth spurts a little early (like at 2 weeks instead of 3 etc). It'll last a day or 2 and then be normal again.


So I figured out why DS has been up all night for the last few nights... we have teeth!! His bottom 2 are cutting through and look like they must really hurt. Poor little man. Now that I know what's going on, I feel better about it. DS is a big time comfort nurser, so he and I have been spending quite a bit of quality time together at 3am. It makes a WOHM very tired. :rolleyes:


I have a question about starting solids... Our original plan was to start DS with home made sweet potatoes on Thanksgiving Day. Our pediatrician was ok with that, but she seemed to be a little concerned with his iron intake since he gets no formula, we're not doing cereals, and I (stupidly) admitted to being somewhat lax about taking vitamins/ eating well myself. So, what can I do/ give DS to make sure he gets all the iron he needs, even if my diet isn't great? We've been planning to make all of DS's food ourselves- at least in the beginning when he's still mostly nursing. TIA. :)

[HGMorgann]

Moderngal - taking a multi-vit would be an easy to begin with solution. I would also check his iron at 9 mo.

babies for thousands of years did just fine on BF alone w/ no processed rice cereals and mom's not taking multi-vits.........

But it is a blessing to be able to check his levels - so I would do that just to put my mind at ease.

[majorgal]

ihearttx: No problem. I really got a bit anxious before we started the solids trying to figure out the balance. I found it really fell into place. It's really nice that things are so predictable....and I don't feel like as much of a feeding machine, either. Good luck with all of it!

[lil_nance]

DS is 4mo and has decided to add back an early morning feeding anywhere between 4-6am. Not sure why. I miss my sleep.
Typical night for the last month or more had been:
7:30-8:30 Bed
11:30 Feeding (I usually wake him before I go to sleep)
12-12:30 Bed
7-8:00 Wake up for the day

The past 3 days or so he's woken up crying. I feed him and he goes back down for another 2hr or so. Last night he had huge feeding at 11:30pm but woke up the earliest yet at 4am. Is this a new pattern? Any way I can get him to STTN again.

[Dreshny]

Nancy: All babies are different, but my DS goes through periods when he sleeps through the night and periods when he doesn't. If I remember correctly, at around 3 months my DS STTN for about 2 1/2 weeks, and then he stopped again.

Could be a growth spurt, could be a developmental growth spurt (when he does a new thing at the end), could be teething. I've learned to just go with it. :rolleyes: My mom, the child development expert, says that babies go through periods of equilibrium and disequalibrium. Apparently, they sleep better after the 3-month growth spurt, then go through more developmental changes that affect their sleep.

But every baby does things differently...

[mollyeilis]

If I were concerned about E's iron levels, and I'm not, but if I were, I'd take him to a nutritionist. I was looking around on medical college websites, and the closest I found to a nutrition program was at Case Western, and they have an RD, registered dietician, as the head of their infant nutrition program.

So why go with someone who *maybe* had a course in nutrition, and probably barely knows about infant nutrition, when you can go straight to the horse's mouth, to someone for whom nutrition is their life's work?

But I'm not really convinced that anyone truly KNOWS how much iron should be in a nearly all breastfed, vegetarian toddler, and our family ND hasn't said that he appears anemic...so I don't worry about it. :D

[Marisa]

MG -- your diet isn't going to really change the content of your milk. I went through this myself when Joey's iron levels were low at 1 year, but there's really nothing you can do to increase the iron content in BM, even if you have an awesome diet. However, the iron in BM is more bioavailable than that in formula, so what is there gets put to good use.

As for the sweet potatoes, they're actually a really good source of iron. I think it's great that you're interested in making his food, whole foods are so good for him. :) Here's a list from Kellymom.com that really helped me when I was looking for iron-rich things to add to Joey's diet:

http://www.kellymom.com/nutrition/vitamins/iron.html#ironsources

Since Joey's low iron levels came up at his 1-year visit, I had more freedom to choose from that list -- some things are not appropriate for babies under 1 year. But if you're really concerned about iron, you can definitely have your dr. do a finger-prick test at the next visit. In most cases, a BF baby will have stores of iron to take him well into the second half of the first year.

[Tulip]

Tulip - My DD and I used a nipple shield until she was 5 months old. We've finally weaned off of the shield, but I think the route we took would be considered VERY unconventional. DD started having weight gain issues (I think due to the shield) and we had to start supplementing. Once DD figured out how to take a bottle, she wanted nothing to do with the shield and we were able to get rid of it. When I was reading everything I could get my hands on about weaning off a shield, most articles recommended starting the nursing session with the shield and then quickly removing it once you feel let down. That's probably the best thing to try first, but I wanted to include our weird little story in case that might help you further on down the line. DD is now off the supplements and gaining weight perfectly :).
Our situation is weird as well. DS was down quite low from his birth weight in the hospital and they gave him FF to supplement without my consent. After that it was almost impossible to get him to BF period. He was getting FF and EBM for the first 4 weeks. 2 weeks ago he finally started to nurse with the shield. Since then I've gotten him to nurse once without it halfway through a feed. He's still getting about 50/50 with the BM and the FF so it's a battle for me to get him to nurse period still sometimes.

[Brink]

Thanks for the advice on BFing in public and how to support their little heads. We went out to dinner tonight and I ended up rolling up my jacket and using that. I guess whatever I have on hand at the time will work. It was the first time I didn't have to run out to the car and BF there. Much better.

[happy1nuv]

I totally agree with everyone who said not to rush ditching the shields. I tried that and it was a very painful week (for me) ... We started using them and backed off more gradually an it was much better (we did a lot of starting with sheild, then ditching it quickly...I think we used them off and on through 5 - 5 1/ 2 months)

Kellymom's page has a study about iron in exclusively breastfed babies:
http://www.kellymom.com/nutrition/solids/delay-solids.html
(scroll down a bit) ...thought it was interesting...

:)

[JillyB]

I've been successfully BF my DS for almost 4 months now! And I've been lurking here every step of the way, and I just wanted to thank ya'll for "sharing" all of your questions/experiences/suggestions!! You are a very valuable resource for me, and I think of ya'll as "experts" ready to support/help in whatever way you can. Thanks again!

I'm sure I'll be back with questions or input, but I just wanted to "out" myself!! :D

[newyorkgirl]

Nancy, you and I are going through the same things! Bennett started STTN about three weeks ago for about 1 1/2 weeks and then started waking up again. Granted, he's also dealing with being sick, but he has been waking up a couple times every night - and I do the same thing with waking him up to feed before I go to sleep.

The only thing I would suggest is seeing if you can rock him to sleep before feeding him. Sometimes, Bennett just needs some help going back to sleep, especially if I let him cry a little too long before going to him. Also, try putting on one of DH's t-shirts or sweatshirts before picking him up so he doesn't smell your BBs and immediately want to nurse. And then, when they realize don't get food when they wake up, they sometimes (not always!) will stay asleep or go back to sleep on their own when they wake up in the middle of the night.

ETA: love the new picture in your avatar. Connor is so cute!

[chloechloe]

Marisa--I read the post earlier about iron and how ourdiet doesn't reflect the contents of BM. Is this true? I always feel guilty when I eat like I did yesterday....cereal, soup and fries and a burger, not very healthy. I don't do it every day but still feel like I have tainted my BM. Is it okay to eat yucky food once in a while???

[majorgal]

The only thing I would suggest is seeing if you can rock him to sleep before feeding him. Sometimes, Bennett just needs some help going back to sleep, especially if I let him cry a little too long before going to him. Also, try putting on one of DH's t-shirts or sweatshirts before picking him up so he doesn't smell your BBs and immediately want to nurse. And then, when they realize don't get food when they wake up, they sometimes (not always!) will stay asleep or go back to sleep on their own when they wake up in the middle of the night.

I would suggest having DH go in to help soothe DS/DD first. This made a huge difference for us.

[pgbg]

I have a question for those who NIP -- do you cover DC's head completely with a blanket? I haven't tried anywhere but the car, so I'm not sure how it would work and I'm wondering how your DC tolerates being under a blanket. I guess I could practice at home...but then if he pops off, I'd have to fish under there to help him latch back on...sigh. It just seems so nervewracking!

[LILRTL]

NIP I don't cover DS's head up until someone walks by. (Yes, I'm a veteran now - 2 times NIP. :p) But really. I gently lay the blanket over the back of his head. If someone gets close, I pull it up. From my (2) experiences, it has been a whole lot easier than I ever thought it would be!

[newyorkgirl]

NIP - it depends on where I am and what I am wearing. Sometimes, I will cover up if I need to be more modest. The optimal situation is where I'm wearing a nursing camisole with a cardigan - that way, DS is nursing and I pull the side of the cardigan to cover him/myself up a little bit (but I can still see him and put him back on if he pops off).

[Kiley]

NIP - I don't cover us up. I usually wear a nursing tank top and button down sweater or zip sweatshirt and feel that covers us up enough.

[Marisa]

Jilly -- congratulations on 4 months! Thank you for the positive feedback, I love this thread. I wish there was a way we could do this kind of thing in real life too, sometimes. :)

chloe -- it really is fine. Of course, you'll feel better and have more energy overall if your diet is better, but your milk won't suffer. It's programmed into our biology to use the body's resources FIRST for the milk, and then mama gets whatever's left over. :)

Studies have been done worldwide that show that even across cultures and in societies that don't have the access to nutritious food that we do, there are not signficant differences in the breastmilk. No matter what we eat, our bodies know how to keep giving our babies the good stuff. :)


pgbg -- when my DS was little, I did try the blanket trick sometimes, but it never really worked out -- made him a little crazy, he'd work harder at getting the blanket away from his face than actually nursing. The ring sling was a little better, until he got too big to nurse lying down in it. I found the easiest way to NIP was to wear a t-shirt with a cardigan or button-down over it, so I could lift the t-shirt and the cardigan would cover us from the side and a little around the front. I had a blanket handy but I doubt I ever needed it.

[maggieb]

NIP: I wear a strechy tank underneath a long-sleeved t-shirt or sweater and it's perfect. I just lift the t-shirt a bit and pull down the tank and I'm not exposed at all.

[mollyeilis]

NIP: I wear a strechy tank underneath a long-sleeved t-shirt or sweater and it's perfect. I just lift the t-shirt a bit and pull down the tank and I'm not exposed at all.

ITA. Bought some $5 tank tops from Target in different colors, and am good to go. NIPed all the way through Disneyland like that. :D

Although I generally don't NIP b/c E loves to pop off and stare, I like to be prepared, and having a tank under my shirt helps.

[Sarah]

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I have a question for those who NIP -- do you cover DC's head completely with a blanket? I haven't tried anywhere but the car, so I'm not sure how it would work and I'm wondering how your DC tolerates being under a blanket. I guess I could practice at home...but then if he pops off, I'd have to fish under there to help him latch back on...sigh. It just seems so nervewracking!

I don't use a blanket really. ONly when she was first born. I generally wear a men's "A shirt" under my long sleeved tops (it's cold here!) and pull that down in the front. Then I'm totally covered. I have large nipples (sorry) and I cover any nip that shows with my fingers. Most people have no clue what I'm doing.

[NYN]

i also don't use the blanket. i feel like it is so much more obvious that you are NIP w/ the blanket. i lay the baby across my belly so it just looks like i am cradling her anyway. i NIP everywhere and no one has ever said anything to me (or even looked at me like they knew what i was doing) yet.

[moderngal]

Thank you for the comments re: iron. I really don't see the need to to give baby cereals and was a little surprised that my ped mentioned it. I'm glad I'm not the only one. :) Although I did see an organic one at Whole Foods tonight and I suppose if I really need to increase his iron, I wouldn't be completely opposed to using that. (but I'm holding off on that for now).

NIP~ Well, I don't use a blanket because I think that draws more attention to the fact that I'm nursing. Honestly, if I can find a place like the Nordstrom mother's room, I prefer to go there and sit in a comfortable chair and relax. But if I do nurse out in the open, I usually wear a nursing top, so you really can't see anything anyway.

[moderngal]

Awhile back I posted about a basket of BF'ing supplies for my friend's baby shower... just wanted to post what I finally got together:

*Boppy
*Boppy cover made by someone here
*Lansinoh cream
*Lansinoh wipes
*Lansinoh breast pads
*Gerber warm/ cool relief pads
*Mother's Milk Tea

I also got her a sleeper and a frame-- I think it'll look great together. Now I just need to get the perfect basket to put it all together in. :)

[Marisa]

moderngal -- is it the mixed grain one? That's the one I finally wound up buying for Joey, but I only did it after he was a year, after his low-iron result. I mixed it in his yogurt, until it took on more of a 'custard-y' texture. :)

[PrincessCrappy]

Help! We just got back from the peds office. We had to up my son's reflux medicine for the third time - he's now on 1 mL of Zantac 3 times a day. The ped we saw questioned how often I'm feeding him and I said I feed on demand, which right now seems to be every 2 - 3 hours, unless he's upset and I feed to soothe him. She said that is part of the reflux problem - I'm feeding him too often. She suggested that I feed him every 3.5 hours. If he seems like he wants to eat sooner than that, I should give him a few ounces of Pedialyte. Does this sound right? He's 11.5 weeks, shouldn't he just be getting his mama's milk right now? I hate the idea of introducing something else to his system. Obviously if what I am doing right now is hurting him, I will change it. I just want a few other opinions before I do this. I am so, so sad by this.

[NYN]

princesscrappy, i don't know anything about reflux so i can't answer you correctly but i just wanted to point out that my dd is 4 months and there is still NO WAY that she would be able to go 3.5 hours w/out eating. as it is she barely goes more than 2 hours w/out wanting to eat. and the whole pedialyte thing...i don't really understand that. if the object is to keep food out of his system, how would the pedialyte be any better than breast milk? this is the kind of thing i'd talk to an LC about first. good luck.

[HGMorgann]

Princesscrappy, hmmmmmmmm. The pedialite comment really throws up a red flag for me. I went and searched Kellymom. and this is what it said in regards to true reflux in BF babies: I hope its helpful...it directly contradicts what your ped said: "Aim for frequent breastfeeding, whenever baby cues to feed. These smaller, more frequent feedings can be easier to digest. " I tend to trust Kellymom more than pediatricians who many times, unfortunately, have limited knowledge in breastfeeding.
From here: http://www.kellymom.com/babyconcerns/reflux.html
Gastroesophageal Reflux Disease (GERD)

A small percentage of babies experience discomfort and other complications due to reflux - this is called Gastroesophageal Reflux Disease. These babies have been termed by some as ‘Scrawny Screamers’ (as compared to the Happy Spitters). There seems to be a family tendency toward reflux. GERD is particularly common in preemies (due to their immaturity) and in babies with other health problems. GERD usually improves by 12-24 months.

Following are symptoms of GERD -- there are varying degrees and need your doctor's involvement to diagnose:

Frequent spitting up or vomiting; discomfort when spitting up. Some babies with GERD do not spit up – silent reflux occurs when the stomach contents only go as far as the esophagus and are then re-swallowed, causing pain but no spitting up.
Gagging, choking, frequent burping or hiccoughing, bad breath.
Baby may be fussy and sleep less due to discomfort.
Warning signs of severe reflux:

Inconsolable or severe fussiness or crying associated with feedings.
Poor weight gain, weight loss, or failure to thrive. Difficulty eating. Breast/food refusal.
Difficulty swallowing, sore throat, hoarseness, chronic nasal/sinus congestion, chronic sinus/ear infections.
Spitting up blood or green/yellow fluid.
Sandifer’s syndrome: Baby may ‘posture’ and arch the neck & back to relieve reflux pain--this lengthens the esophagus and reduces discomfort.
Breathing problems: bronchitis, wheezing, chronic cough, pneumonia, asthma, aspiration, apnea, cyanosis.
GERD may cause babies to either undereat (if they associate feeding with the after-feeding pain, or if it hurts to swallow) or overeat (because sucking keeps the stomach contents down in the stomach and because mother’s milk is a natural antacid).

Current information on reflux indicates that testing or treatment for reflux in babies younger than 12 months should be considered only if spitting up is accompanied by poor weight gain or weight loss, severe choking, lung disease or other complications. Per Donna Secker, MS, RD in the article Gastroesophageal Reflux Disease , "The infant with significant reflux who seems to be growing well and has no other significant health problems benefits most from little or no therapy."

When GERD is suspected, many doctors first try a trial of various reflux medications (without running tests), to see if the medications improve baby's symptoms. If testing is done, a 24-hour pH probe study () is the current “gold standard” for reflux testing in babies; this is a procedure where a tube is placed down baby's throat to measure the acid level at the bottom of the esophagus. A barium swallow (upper GI) is not so invasive (baby swallows a barium mixture, then an x-ray is taken) but is not really effective for diagnosing reflux in babies, since most babies will reflux when given barium. An upper GI will not identify whether baby's stomach contents are higher in acid or if there has been any esophagus damage due to reflux, but it will show if there are any blockages or narrowing of the stomach valves that may be causing or aggravating the reflux. Additional tests may be recommended in certain circumstances (see the links below for additional information). In rare cases, when baby has very severe reflux that is not relieved by medication, surgery may be recommended.



Breastfeeding Tips

Aim for frequent breastfeeding, whenever baby cues to feed. These smaller, more frequent feedings can be easier to digest.
Try positioning baby in a semi-upright or sitting position when breastfeeding, or recline back so that baby is above and tummy-to-tummy with mom. See this information on upright nursing positions.
For fussy, reluctant feeders, try lots of skin to skin contact, breastfeeding in motion (rocking, walking), in the bath or when baby is sleepy.
Ensure good latch to minimize air swallowing.
Allow baby to completely finish one breast (by waiting until baby pulls off or goes to sleep) before you offer the other. Don't interrupt active suckling just to switch sides. Switching sides too soon or too often can cause excessive spitting up (see Too Much Milk?). For babies who want to breastfeed very frequently, try switching sides every few hours instead of at every feed.
Encourage non-nutritive/comfort sucking at the breast, since non-nutritive sucking reduces irritation and speeds gastric emptying.
Avoid rough or fast movement or unnecessary jostling or handling of your baby right after feeding. Baby may be more comfortable when help upright much of the time. It is often helpful to burp often.
As always, watch your baby and follow his cues to determine what works best to ease the reflux symptoms.


What can I do to minimize spitting up/reflux?

Breastfeed! Reflux is less common in breastfed babies. In addition, breastfed babies with reflux have been shown to have shorter and fewer reflux episodes and less severe reflux at night than formula-fed babies [Heacock 1992]. Breastfeeding is also best for babies with reflux because breastmilk leaves the stomach much faster [Ewer 1994] (so there’s less time for it to back up into the esophagus) and is probably less irritating when it does come back up.
The more relaxed your infant is, the less the reflux.
Eliminate all environmental tobacco smoke exposure, as this is a significant contributing factor to reflux.
Reduce or eliminate caffeine. Excessive caffeine in mom's diet can contribute to reflux.
Allergy should be suspected in all infant reflux cases. According to a review article in Pediatrics [Salvatore 2002], up to half of all GERD cases in babies under a year are associated with cow’s milk protein allergy. The authors note that symptoms can be similar and recommend that pediatricians screen all babies with GERD for cow’s milk allergy. Allergic babies generally have other symptoms in addition to spitting up.
Positioning:
Reflux is worst when baby lies flat on his back.
Many parents have found that carrying baby in a sling or other baby carrier can be helpful.
Avoid compressing baby’s abdomen - this can increase reflux and discomfort. Dress baby in loose clothing with loose diaper waistbands; avoid “slumped over” or bent positions; for example, roll baby on his side rather than lifting legs toward tummy for diaper changes.
Recent research has compared various positions to determine which is best for babies with reflux. Elevating baby's head did not make a significant difference in these studies [Carroll 2002, Secker 2002, Craig 2004], although many moms have found that baby is more comfortable when in an upright position. The positions shown to significantly reduce reflux include lying on the left side and prone (baby on his tummy). Placing the infant in a prone position should only be done when the child is awake and can be continuously monitored. Prone positioning during sleep is almost never recommended due to the increased SIDS risk. [Secker 2002]
Although recent research does not support recommendations to keep baby in a semi-upright position (30° elevation), this remains a common recommendation. Positioning at a 60° elevation in an infant seat or swing has been found to increase reflux compared with the prone (tummy down) position [Carroll 2002, Secker 2002].
As always, experiment to find what works best for your baby.
If your child is taking reflux medications, keep in mind that dosages generally need to be monitored and adjusted frequently as baby grows.

What about thickened feeds?
Baby cereal, added to thicken breastmilk or formula, has been used as a treatment for GER for many years, but its use is controversial.

Does it work? Thickened feeds can reduce spitting up, but studies have not shown a decrease in reflux index scores (i.e., the “silent reflux” is still present). Per Donna Secker, MS, RD in Gastroesophageal Reflux Disease , "The effect of thickened feedings may be more cosmetic (decreased regurgitation and increased postprandial sleeping) than beneficial." Thickened feeds have been associated with increased coughing after feedings, and may also decrease gastric emptying time and increase reflux episodes and aspiration. Note that rice cereal will not effectively thicken breastmilk due to the amylase (an enzyme that digests carbohydrates) naturally present in the breastmilk.

Is it healthy for baby? If you do thicken feeds, monitor baby’s intake since baby may take in less milk overall and thus decrease overall nutrient intake. There are a number of reasons to avoid introducing cereal and other solids early. There is evidence that the introduction of rice or gluten-containing cereals before 3 months of age increases baby's risk for type I diabetes. In addition, babies with GERD are more likely to need all their defenses against allergies, respiratory infections and ear infections – but studies show that early introduction of solids increases baby’s risk for all of these conditions.

The breastfeeding relationship: Early introduction of solids is associated with early weaning. Babies with reflux are already at greater risk for fussy nursing behavior, nursing strikes or premature weaning if baby associates reflux discomfort with breastfeeding.

[SD601]

Carrie, have they tried any other meds? DS is on prilosec AND Zantac, and the combination of those has really made the difference in his reflux. He's now gaining weight like crazy. I think you should continue to feed on demand. If he's spitting up frequently, maybe try smaller, more frequent meals, but I am amazed your Ped isn't trying any other meds.

[Marisa]

Carrie -- the pedialyte thing is a red flag for me, too. It sounds like your ped has quite a bit of experience with formula fed babies and may not fully understand how to support a breastfeeding relationship.

The point of pedialyte would be to hydrate a baby that is unable to keep down a milk feeding. However, medically, breastmilk is considered a 'clear fluid' -- you know, how before you have surgery or something they tell you 'nothing but clear fluids for 12 hours beforehand', something like that. Pedialyte is for babies whose diet consists of cow's milk. Unless your baby is truly sick and unable to take anything else (--and even then!) -- I don't see where it has relevance to a BF baby.

Kellymom brings up a good point, is the reflux something that's causing him a lot of pain? In other words, is he, as she says, a 'screamer', or a 'happy spitter'? If he's otherwise happy, the reflux-like symptoms may come from your having a strong supply -- my son had the same problem for several months, until my supply settled and he became big enough to handle it. Try feeding entirely on one side for a block of time, say all feedings within a 2- or 3-hour stretch. He'll still get the fatty 'hindmilk', and your body will adjust and not produce more than he'll need. He'll get the chance to do a little 'non-nutritive' sucking, as Kellymom suggests, to speed up his digestion.

[Dally]

PrincessCrappy--My DD had reflux and did fine with frequent feeding. I have no idea what your Dr. is talking about, but I think if you delay feedings you will just have a crying baby. :( (And crying makes the reflux feel worse!) When my DD was your DS's age, she ate every 2-3 hours. Sometimes she ate more when the reflux bothered her because the milk soothed her. One thing that helped a lot was keeping her upright for a while after nursing her. I used to hold her upright even after her night feedings. It was tiring, but it worked. She also took zantac for a few months, but she's better now and doesn't need it. Babies usually grow out of GERD. BTW, my DD is six months old now, and she still rarely goes 3.5 hours between feedings! I definitely think you should trust your mama instincts on this one. :)

[PrincessCrappy]

Thank you, thank you, thank you for all of your advice! The pedialite came up when the ped realized Griffin is eating 2 - 3 hours around the clock = not sleeping through the night. She said a baby his size (14.8 lbs) and age (11.5 weeks) should be able to go longer during the night without waking. Basically I think she was saying the pedialite would trick him into eventually not needing to wake for feedings during the night. My mama alarm went off with the thought of introducing yet another foreign substance into my baby's body. It also doesn't make sense to me to screw with his eating habits when he is THRIVING. Most reflux babies fail to gain weight and he is gaining an average of half a pound a week. I'm going to call for another appointment tomorrow to see our regular ped. I'll ask about other meds and get her thoughts on what today's ped suggested. I have a feeling I may be looking for a new practice, though...

[Marisa]

She said a baby his size (14.8 lbs) and age (11.5 weeks) should be able to go longer during the night without waking.

You know, this to me is further proof that she's dealing more with FFed babies. Breastmilk is digested within about 1-1.5 hours after a feeding. If he's a sensitive kiddo, he may wake frequently at night when he senses that his tummy is empty. It's entirely normal for this to happen up to (and even past) the six month mark, though as baby hits those 3-mo and 6-mo spurts they can hold more milk in their stomachs and stretch out those feedings a little longer.

I'm glad you're getting a second opinion. Is there some kind of breastfeeding support group, or LLL that meets near you? I think it might help for you to have a place to turn when you're faced with these kinds of decisions -- people who can look at your chubby baby (8 oz. per week is awesome!) and tell you how wonderfully healthy he is. ;) They may also have ideas for more BFing friendly drs if you do wind up deciding to switch. :)

[LexyLou]

I really didn't think I would NIP often out of fear but I have done it on multiple occasions. Including at an outdoor table at a semi fast food restaurant and today on the airplane.

Awhile back a couple of the ladies on this thread mentioned the Hooter Hider. I LOVE it and use it all the time. It's so private that if someone were to have an issue with my NIP then it's their own problem because most people wouldn't even know I'm nursing.

http://www.hooterhiders.com/product.html

[Daniel's Kitty]

I NIP in my sling normally, and since it has a giant tail that I cover him with if it is cold or I hear people coughing I don't think people really notice much unless he eats so fast that he is making gulping noises.

It is more family that have issues with my bfing, since they say you can't bf a teething baby. We are trying to adjust to teaching him not to bite, but I am going to smack the next person who tells me that it is time for bottles.

[mollyeilis]

they say you can't bf a teething baby. We are trying to adjust to teaching him not to bite, but I am going to smack the next person who tells me that it is time for bottles.


Woo, now that's a laugh! My guy cut his 16th tooth 1 year and 2 days after cutting his first tooth, and he has nursed throughout.

Try that one on your silly family!

...and now he's working on his second molars, and is nursing even MORE often than just a few weeks ago! :eek:

[miel]

Oh my God my baby has a whole mouthful of teeth! She's teethed the whole way through. Ouch!

[newyorkgirl]

It is more family that have issues with my bfing Yeah. Why is that? My mother always asks me on the phone, "Are you sure he's getting enough to eat? Why aren't you supplementing?" And my DH has more issues with my NIPing than I do. :rolleyes:

[NYN]

Basically I think she was saying the pedialite would trick him into eventually not needing to wake for feedings during the night.
of course it would b/c pedialite is a fancy word for formula...definitely talk to the regular doctor about it and i applaud you for following your instincts.

[Dreshny]

Yeah. Why is that? My mother always asks me on the phone, "Are you sure he's getting enough to eat? Why aren't you supplementing?" And my DH has more issues with my NIPing than I do. :rolleyes:

I guess I'm lucky that MIL nursed DH for 16 months. DH wants me to nurse DS at least that long, but I keep telling him we'll see. :) My grandmother, OTOH keeps asking me about supplementing...:rolleyes: Ahhh, the older pre-1960s generation.

[maggieb]

Carrie: I call bs on your ped. Like so many others have mentioned...first off, most reflux babies benefit from smaller, more frequent feedings. There is no way Marisa can go 3.5 hours during the day without eating. She nurses about every 2 hours during the day. Secondly, the pedialyte comment it total bs. I am so upset by this dr. Your son needs nothing but his Mama's milk...especially since he has reflux!!! I agree that maybe he may need another medication unless he is a happy spitter. Marisa is not a happy spitter and we switched from Zantac to Prevacid. I haven't noticed any improvement yet. I hope you find another dr who is more understanding and knowledgable about bf'ing a baby with reflux. Good luck!

[Dally]

My mother always asks me on the phone, "Are you sure he's getting enough to eat? Why aren't you supplementing?"

My family is generally supportive, but I still get that. My stepmom in particular makes a lot of comments about DD "not seeming satisfied." What the heck does that mean, anyway? DD is growing great and has MORE than her share of wet/dirty diapers. Plus, she's a really happy baby who rarely cries. My Dad keeps saying that now that DD is getting solids, she'll surely sleep better (nope, hasn't made a difference in the three weeks since she started them). :rolleyes:

I'm proud that I've grown DD on mama's milk--and I fought hard to get away from supplementing in the early days--so it's hard not to take it personally when people think my milk isn't "satisfying" DD. :mad:

[majorgal]

Kellymom brings up a good point, is the reflux something that's causing him a lot of pain? In other words, is he, as she says, a 'screamer', or a 'happy spitter'? If he's otherwise happy, the reflux-like symptoms may come from your having a strong supply -- my son had the same problem for several months, until my supply settled and he became big enough to handle it. Try feeding entirely on one side for a block of time, say all feedings within a 2- or 3-hour stretch. He'll still get the fatty 'hindmilk', and your body will adjust and not produce more than he'll need. He'll get the chance to do a little 'non-nutritive' sucking, as Kellymom suggests, to speed up his digestion.

Totally agree. Aidan was a big spitter for a while--due to both my strong supply and a dairy sensitivity. But, because he was gaining well and never seemed upset by the spitting, he was never on meds. Now, at nearly 7-months he rarely spits anymore.

FWIW, until Aidan was about three months, he ate every 2 to 2.5 hours. Now, he STILL eats every three hours, though he his STTN. He did not start STTN until he was six months, though (at about 22 pounds). My gut says that if he is hungry at night at this stage, feed him. Trust your gut on the PediaLyte.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

I am about to head to the ILs on Thursday....I am bracing myself for the 'you're STILL nursing?!?!?' comments. I have already told DH that when the topic comes up, HE is the one addressing the issue and giving the reasons why we will continue to nurse until Aidan is at least a year old.

[LeslieR]

We've been really lucky so far in that we haven't gotten ANY comments at all. My MIL has been super supportive in telling me how proud I should be of myself and of what Luke and I have accomplished together. She even told me she wishes that she had bf DH and his brothers.:D I have gotten some off the wall questions from a couple people about what else I'm feeding him since he is such a big boy. I guess they can't suggest that I supplement since it is obvious that he is so healthy.:rolleyes: The only negative comments I've gotten (and I don't even know if I can really categorize them as negative) have been from DH in regards to Luke "always eating" or "eating too much". We have gone round and round about it.:mad: He hasn't said anything in a while, so hopefully I finally got through to him.:p Otherwise he has been very supportive as well.

NIP, I bought a Hooter Hider and used it twice at Luke's Christening. It wasn't really NIP, though, because I was in a room by myself with the door closed. lol Anyway, I really liked the HH-super easy to use and I don't think it bothered Luke at all.

[solongtogo]

I'm on my third week back to work and I've never been able to get more than 9 oz during the 3 times I pump at work, so I started supplementing DD because I can't produce enough. Today it hit me why...I'm not letting down when I'm pumping. What can I do to encourage this reflex? I'm going to the same area to pump, I'm using a hands free bra, and I've got some pictures of her around. I also read magazines or do cross stitch while I'm pumping and not work...so what can I do to get this reflex to go?

[Marisa]

Lisa -- try bringing something of hers that really smells like her -- the pheromone thing can really help! Also try closing your eyes and almost 'meditating' for a minute -- people say "think milk!" which always seems so cheesy to me, but it's kinda true. Don't concentrate hard on it, but just think for a minute and sniff her blanky or whatever. Go back to the magazine once you've gotten going.

[majorgal]

Lisa: I have also found that massaging my breast can work, too.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Question to the group: I have been back at work for nearly four months now and I have been successfully pumping enough to make sure there are two bottles for Aidan at day care, and generally some extra. But, over the last few days, I have noticed that Lefty is really starting to slow down production--it used to be that 2-3 hours after feeding Aidan at night or in the morning I could get at LEAST 3 oz. (usually 4) out of Lefty when I pumped. Twice in the last five days when I pumped before bed I got NOTHING out of Lefty (did fine with Righty) and this morning when pumping at work I only got a smidge shy of 2 oz.

Aidan is sick and was refusing to nurse yesterday (ear infection...so I was spoon feeding him BM) and I am really sick now (not taking any medication), so I am wondering if that has anything to do with it. I have upped my oatmeal intake, and have had some MM tea, but I won't take fenugreek anymore--it gave Aidan diahrrea. Any advice?

[newyorkgirl]

Can someone just reassure me that my supply won't dwindle now that DS is starting to sleep longer hours? As it is, DS measured a little low at his last weigh-in, even though he was right on track and perfectly happy and thriving. I'm just worried he's not getting enough because he's definitely also starting to go longer between daytime feedings. I'm a little wary of trying MM tea and oatmeal because I did them early on when I was worried about my supply and I went in the opposite direction (and have been working on reducing oversupply ever since). But I will if I need to.

Is it okay to go through the night without pumping if DS doesn't nurse? I only have the Avent manual since I SAH and don't need an electric, and I have a really hard time pumping if DS isn't nursing on the other bb. If not, I will try to get a secondhand PIS or something.

[Marisa]

Erika -- as long as he's not getting his nutrition elsewhere yet, your supply will adjust. You might find that he continues this trend for a little while, and you'll be making less overnight after a few days or so. You might also find that his sleep schedule will shift again, and he will want to nurse more at night (totally common and normal at his age, esp. as teething starts -- nursing makes it feel better!)

It's also perfectly normal for a baby this age to have shorter nursing sessions and go longer in between. The three-month growth spurt is a pretty big milestone as far as that goes, sometime not long after that most moms notice their babies spending more time playing and less nursing. His stomach is larger and can hold more milk at once, so he can stay satisfied longer.

[Allegra]

there goes my baby howling again. I'm at my wits end. She bites me when nursing. I think my supply is tanking - I don't know whether its from stress, pain or if AF is planning on showing up. I realized her shrieking at nap time maybe due to her not getting any milk. She's also not having as many poopy or wet diapers and the poop she's having is fairly crumbly. I just left her with her dad cause I couldn't deal with it anymore tonight. she sits there and pounds on me while nursing, pumping her head back and forth if I swaddle her and if I don't swaddle her - aiy yai yai. She MAULS me with her hands. I am so not happy with our nursing right now. I really thought I could make it at least a year after we started (I originally said once she had teeth I was weaning her) at this point I feel like giving her formula tonight just to get her to be quiet and GO TO SLEEP. sigh. ideas? I eat oatmeal but I've never had a supply issue before (more like the opposite problem)... cr*p. I better go help her dad.
Allegra

[mollyeilis]

"I also read magazines or do cross stitch while I'm pumping"

I'm guessing you have an electric pump? :)

What if, for awhile, instead of doing that, you really concentrate on your babe? In my pumping times, I found thinking HARD about baby while chanting "feeding my baby,feeding my baby, feeding my baby", to the "beat" of the Isis, worked really really well. So, rather than distracting yourself with reading and whatnot, just really focus until you let down?



re: pedialyte...I've been noticing that their commercials recently have been comparing it to sportsdrinks. They are saying, basically, don't give a sportsdrink to your little one, give pedialyte since it's better...

Which tells me that they are BARELY "better" than Gatorade, and they are being defensive. :)

I sure wouldn't give my babe Gatorade, so why pedialyte? :confused:



OK so I just searched. 8 oz of the stuff is 24 kcal. 1 liter is 100 kcal.

Marisa, I forget, how does this compare to breastmilk, or heck, even formula? Is it anywhere near the calories?

OK, searched on kellymom....

breastmilk is 22 kcal/oz

OK, perhaps I'm nuts, but it would make no no no sense to supplement (to try to trick baby with more??? calories so he can sleep) with something that's 24 kcal per 8oz, when breastmilk is 22 per ounce, would it?:confused:

[PrincessCrappy]

Thanks again to everyone for their advice and additional research. I ditched my plan to see our regular ped and instead went straight to an LC. I am SO glad that I did. She just totally reassured me that my instincts were right (and all of the super smart, supportive women of the CC were right too!). She thought it was insane to give the baby pedialite and to expect him to go so long between feedings. As all of you suggested, she said smaller, more frequent feedings would be best. She also thinks I have a strong supply that causes him to gag and spit up (Marissa, I think you and Joey dealt with this). She helped me reposition him and things seemed a lot better almost immediately. We didn't talk much about the reflux - she suggested I still talk to my ped about switching meds. But she does think we'll see improvements just with the small changes in position and frequency of feedings she suggested and more frequent breaks for burping.

I really want to sincerely thank all of you for your input. You really helped a nervous new mom gain some confidence in her instincts!

[Koala_Gurl]

PrincessCrappy - Yeah for the LC and for you trusting your instincts! :)

[LexyLou]

Question about Vitamins and supplements...

Because I have given up most of the veggies that I normally eat I would like to supplement my fiber. Would taking a daily fiber pill cause gassiness in my DD the way high fiber vegtables like brocolli do?

Also, I don't drink caffeine but I'm dragging. DH suggested I take a B12 supplement in addition to the B12 in my multi. Is this safe to take?

Thanks!

[newyorkgirl]

Thanks, Marisa.

Yay, PrincessCrappy! I'm glad you're feeling much better. :)

[JillyB]

Just wanted to share the USA Today article that my hubby just forwarded to me...

http://www.usatoday.com/news/health/2005-11-22-breastfeeding_x.htm

Love getting more and more "proof" that I'm doing the bestest thing for my little man...and me too! :D

[madmartian]

Hi ladies, I need your advice. This morning, I noticed 2 bright red pimple-like bumps about 3/4 inch away from each other just outside the areola on the same breast. I can't feel any hardness in the breast. It's slightly painful to the touch (just like a pimple) and the pain is on the surface.

If there was only 1 I'd think it was just a pimple and not think twice about it, but 2 makes me suspicious. I recently got back from a 4.5 day trip without my 7 mo old DD. I pumped 5-7 times per day (she nurses 5 times per day), and I thought I did a decent job pumping because my milk supply didn't dip. She's been nursing well since I came back.

Could I have an early-stage plugged duct?

[kelseyledare]

I am having a big dip in supply after the mastitis and thrush. I was wondering if this was common? Anyone else had a similar experience?

I am only able to pump once at work so it is hard for me to build my supply back up. I am taking Reglan to try to help as well.

[chloechloe]

JillyB--Thanks for that article, I knew it reduced diabetes in the baby but not the mom. Now that I keep hearing that I should wean (dd is 14 months) I should print out the article, as 3 of my 4 grandparents were diabetic, any help I can get I will take! Thanks again!

[HollyMN]

Just a followup on my baby not taking a bottle, then only taking a little bit when I went back to work. I wondered how my 15 lb 3.5 month baby could sleep through the night and eat only 2 oz while I'm at work and still get enough? He must have wondered the same thing and decided to take back the 2 AM feeding. He dropped it at 6.5 weeks and had slept through for two months, but after I was back at work for a few weeks he decided he wants the feeding back. :( In the July and August babies threads a lot of babies are regressing in sleep right now, but I'm convinced he needs to eat and that's why.

Well, I have a 4 day holiday weekend here, so let's see what happens. I'm going to feed him like crazy during the daytime.

My DH is with him while I'm at work and has been dropper feeding him in the last week or so. It's just as messy and takes as much time as trying to get him to take a bottle, and my DH likes it better than trying to get him to suck. So he is getting his little 2 oz snack by dropper. He just uses the dropper from the Mylicon bottle. I don't know how long he'll do this, but where do I buy just a dropper? I just checked Target. Also, what's the best way to clean it?

I think I get the expression, "you can lead a horse to water, but you can't make him drink".

[newyorkgirl]

Holly, if your DS is taking from a dropper, he would probably eat from a syringe as well? If you go to your local pharmacy and ask at the pharmacist's counter, you can probably get a 5ml syringe for free, which will probably make the feeding go a little faster than with a tiny dropper. There was a brief period where my DS was on bottle strike as well, and we tried the dropper only to get frustrated because it was taking so long. Luckily, the pharmacist had given us a 5ml syringe along with his Nystatin prescription, and we used that to feed him (after washing it with soap and hot water). But I do know they will give it to you for free because we lost one and I had to go back and ask for another.

[shirsty]

This is a great thread, I've learned a lot just by reading along, but could use some advice. I think my 4 week old is going through a growth spurt, he typically only nurses from one side at a time and is satisfied with that, but for the past 24 hours or so has been nursing for longer periods of time and from both sides. The last 2-3 times he's nursed it's seemed like he's 'drained' both sides. I know he's just telling my body to produce more milk, but I feel like I'm just barely satisfying him! I am letting him nurse on demand and trying to hang in there and not get freaked out that he's not getting enough. He is producing plenty of wet and dirty diapers, if anything the # has increased over the past day or so.

Coincidentally I also tried pumping for the first time this morning, about 20 mins. after nursing him, after it felt like he drained both sides. I got maybe a 1/4 ounce from pumping, and he was wanting to nurse again about an hour after I pumped. He didn't seem satisfied with nursing so I ended up giving him the little bit I had pumped. So now I'm worried that by trying to pump I'm taking away from what he would normally get! I know intellectually that it's supply and demand, just looking for some reassurance. Did I just pick a bad time to start pumping??

We have been bfeeding exclusively for 4 weeks (yay us! :)), and I am wanting to start on a freezer supply and have him take a bottle from DH occasionally in prep for me returning to work. Thanks for any advice anyone can offer!

[majorgal]

shirsty: I have read that your body will 'restock' and be able to give a 'full' meal again 20-30 minutes after the last feeding. The supply may not be as abundant as it is if you go two hours, but the baby should get enough.

It's normal for many women to get only a tiny bit from pumping shortly after a feeding. In the next few weeks, as your baby gets a bit bigger and eats more your supply will likely increase and you will be able to pump a bit more and start stocking up. I started doing serious pumping when my son was five weeks old and by the time I went back to work when he was 14 weeks old I had about 400 ounces in the freezer. I found that I was able to pump before I went to bed and got a good amount and then when I woke up (Aidan was getting up twice a night for feedings) I usually had enough to feed him on one side and pump the other. That's where I got a lot of my extra supply.

It does sound like your baby is going through a growth spurt...I promise it won't last forever, but I remember how crazy that was!

[kindermom]

Does anyone know if Benzocaine is safe to take while breastfeeding? It is the promary ingrediant in Chloraseptic lozenges. I have a killer sore throat that will not go away. I could not find the ingrediant on Kelly Mom.

TIA

[Marisa]

From Dr. Hale himself:

As for benzocaine, it is known to induce methemoglobinemia in infants, and its use directly in infants is not really recommended much anymore. But following it use in the mother, the amount that would enter milk would probably be incredibly low and would not even approach the levels required to induce this problem.

[kindermom]

Thank you Marisa. You are great!

[newyorkgirl]

What are the differences in efficiency between a manual pump (like the Avent Isis) and an electronic one (such as the Medela PIS)? I have been using the Isis because I SAH and don't really need to pump, but DS is now beginning to sleep long stretches at night, and I need to pump to be comfortable to sleep, but I never have much luck pumping unless DS is nursing the other BB (and I have tried drinking water, looking at pictures of DS, thinking "milk", and other stuff). Would a PIS be more effective in getting the milk out if I'm trying to pump without DS?

[shirsty]

Thanks for your advice Majorgal. I think we're still in growth spurt mode unfortunately, but he isn't feeding off both sides every time today and this morning I was able to pump about 1.5 oz, feeling pretty good about that. Thanks for posting your schedule too. I think I'm just going to try pumping the times when he's satisfied with one side and see how that goes.

[Lindzee82]

I read and was told by a lactation consultant to wake my son, Matthew, up every 2-3 hours to feed. I thought it was to help them get back up to birth weight and Matthew was already above his birth weight 4 days after birth. I am just not sure what the reasoning is for the every 2-3 hour feeding thing and not quite sure when we can stop doing this schedule and let him wake on his own to eat. Matthew is 11 days old and is soooo hard to wake up when he is sleeping and feeds poorly in the middle of the night. I would love to just let him sleep. But how will that affect him and my supply? I am just so confused and am having a really hard time with this whole being a mom thing!

Any help would be greatly appreciated! Thanks!

[happy1nuv]

lindzee ... nic had jaundice, so i think we woke him maybe that first week. once his levels were normal, i lived by the you-never-wake-a-sleeping-baby rule (and still do). he made his weight back by the 2 week appt, so weight wasnt an issue ... nic never ate well unless he wanted to, so why fight nature, kwim? (of course, he STILL doent go too long between feeds of his own accord, so...)

:)

[Lindzee82]

happy1nuv - Thanks for sharing your experience. I think tonight I might try to go 4 hours. We will see.

[Sebski]

Question for the pro's...

My DS went from nursing round the clock most of last week (growth spurt) to only nursing now for about 10-12 min per boob at each nursing session. Sometimes he doesn't even want the 2nd boob and falls asleep after only about 10 min on the 1. Is this ok? He's waking about every 2 hours to feed. I'm worried that he's becoming dis-interested in BF... he's 16 days old.

And yes, I was the new mom posting last week with worry over whether it was normal for DS to nurse round the clock and whether he would ever slack off. However, now that he has, I'm worried that there's something wrong. Can't win I guess can ya? ;)

[NYN]

lindzee: i stopped waking my dd up after the first week and my supply never suffered and she gained well.

erika: are you pumping to alleviate b/c of engorgement? i am surprised that you can't pump if you are engorged. i don't have a manual pump so i can't answer your question but i doubt the electric pump will be of use to you if you aren't able to express while you're engorged. you're probably better off not getting into a "pumping to alleviate" habit anyway. sometimes if i'm really full and dd is sleeping i get in the shower under hot water and try to hand express a little to make myself more comfortable but if DS is sleeping longer stretches at night you'll find that your supply will regulate w/in a few days (same once he starts waking up again - i know it b/c DD's sleep has been so on and off lately).

sebski: DD never nursed more than 10 mintues at a time and always on one breast. as long as your DC is growing fine then it just means that you have a very efficient eater. ;)

[Marisa]

Lindsey -- if he's gaining that well (back to birth weight at 4 days! :) It's perfectly normal for a BF baby to take up to 2 weeks!) then I would say that you can start letting him dictate his own feeding schedule. My one caveat would be that at this young age he probably still shouldn't be doing more than one 4-5 hour stretch of sleep (hopefully at night, so you can all rest!). If you find him going more than 3 hours during the day, I would try to rouse him and offer the breast. Not only for weight gain, but also to help him begin to figure out that daytime is the best time to be awake and to eat, and nighttime is the best time to sleep. :)

Seb -- it's pretty typical, actually, for babies to be kind of mellow for a bit after a big growth spurt. I'd say that you're also seeing the result of that spurt a little -- he may not need to eat as long in order to be able to get the same amount of milk, because he's just that much bigger and stronger now.

[Koala_Gurl]

Sebski - DD would seem to hibernate after a growth spurt (sleep all the time.) Sounds like everything is normal! :)

[celina]

BM Storage questions…

1) If I have multiple containers of pumped BM, can I combine them when it comes time to warming milk and feeding it to my DD? Or do I need to heat one, feed it to DD, then heat the next one and feed it to DD?

2) If I have multiple containers pumped BM, can I combine them in a single container and then freeze them?

I know these are weird questions, but for some reasons I thought you couldn’t combine different BM sessions. Don’t know where I heard that, but it stuck with me.

:confused:

[mollyeilis]

I think you can refrigerate and combine milk for 24 hours? And then freeze. But don't freeze then add more. Just refrigerate.

As for using multiple things of milk, I don't know, but if you really were feeding them to baby one after another, I just don't see what the big difference would be if you just combined them. Though how you're going to combine blocks of milk, I don't know. :)

Oh and the other "argument" against putting them altogether to heat up would be if she wasn't as hungry as you thought. Then you may have wasted much more milk than you would have done heating them seperately.


Writing "heating" so many times reminds me I never have heated breastmilk. The times we ever used the EBM were for teething times, when the ice-cold milk was what was desired! Weird!

[Dreshny]

Celina: Yes and yes. Though as Molly said, you may want to feed it to her in smaller increments so you don't waste milk.

[shushyk]

HI! my son is 6weeks. I just got a pump last week and I hardly get ANYTHING out. I mean really nothing. Less than 2oz (total). Any suggestions? It takes me so long to fill up one bottle. Brings me to my next question
is it ok to add BM to frozen BM? because it takes me so long I can't manage to fill up the amount of oz we need, it takes me 2 or 3 days. (I am not pumping ALL day)

Also when should I be pumping? I am a SAHM so I feed on demand, its hard to figure out when to pump.

Thanks for the help!

[mollyeilis]

I think "they" say to NOT add fresh to frozen. You can add fresh to fresh for a day, but not 2 or 3 days, and they say to not add to frozen.

Are you drinking lots and lots of water? The days that I didni't drink enough were lower pumping days, when I was pumping.

No other advice for pumping, as I've lost almost all memories of those days. :) (I'm at home too and finally realized I had no use for the frozen milk)

[moderngal]

is it ok to add BM to frozen BM?
do you mean to then feed in a bottle? or do you mean to re-freeze? I think if you defrost BM and add some fresh for one full bottle to feed right away, that is ok. I don't think you should add to what you have already frozen.

you can pump anytime really. your breasts are never empty, even if they feel that way.

[mollyeilis]

you can pump anytime really. your breasts are never empty, even if they feel that way.


Ain't that the truth!!! :D

[celina]

Here’s my situation,

Sometimes I only pump 1 ounce, but later that evening I can pump 2 ounces. I would hate to “waste” a container for just 1 ounce. I would like to add the 1 ounce to the 2 ounces and freeze them together.

On the same note, if my husband has to give her a bottle, is it ok to combine an ounce that I pumped this morning with an ounce I pumped last night and warm it together? (So it's not frozen BM - I've yet to freeze any.) She never eats less than 2 ounces in a feeding.

Thanks for the replies ladies. :)

Oh, and how long can BM stand in the fridge? And if I choose to freeze it, it has to be within 24 hours?

[newyorkgirl]

celina, I think adding 1 oz to 2 oz over 24 hours is fine, I do that sometimes when I'm not pumping enough for one bottle in one session. As a general rule, I keep bm in the fridge for about 4-5 days. I think "they" say the max is 8 days, but I've kept bm that long and it smelled a little funny - don't know if it "went bad" or if it just picked up the smell of something in the fridge.

newyorknovia,you're probably better off not getting into a "pumping to alleviate" habit anyway.Do you mean, because my bbs will think there's demand when there really isn't? I know what you mean there because sometimes I feel like my supply is all over the map and I think it contributes to the frequent plugged ducts I get. The problem with the nights is that DS will sleep through the early morning feeding and my BBs will adjust, but once they adjust, he'll decide he wants to wake up to eat again. Then, when my BBs start making more milk, he goes through a phase of sleeping through it. So I go through phases of oversupply, then not having enough milk to pump in the morning (which is when I usually pump for DS's daily bottle), then it's back to oversupply. So I figure, if I just pump on the nights when DS sleeps through his feeding, it might be easier than if I try to get my body to adjust to this on-again, off-again night feeding. I can get an ounce or so with the Isis when I'm engorged, but I know that if I'm pumping with DS on the other BB, I usually get 4-5 oz. So the Isis isn't as effective on its own, and I stay engorged. I was just wondering whether an electric pump would be more effective in getting the milk out.

Plus, I'm starting to pump for a freezer stash with which to dilute solids, so maybe finding a good condition electric pump isn't a bad idea.

[mollyeilis]

There is no True answer with pumps. For some, the Isis is a million times better than the $300 Medela kit (or however much it costs). For other it's not. Only way to know for yourself is to buy one and try it out...

[moderngal]

celina~ I definitely do that (add fresh milk to milk I pumped yesterday, etc). And as for heating up combined milk- I think it's a-ok. I do it everyday- DS gets a 6 ounce bottle that may be 4 ounces from one pump session and 2 from another or something like that. Of course, my son is growing horns. ;)
EBM can stay for about a week in the fridge- I think 7- 10 days actually.

newyorkgirl~ I don't get nearly as much milk with my hand pump as I do with my Ameda PY. I actually didn't even get as much from the Medela hospital pump as I do with my APY. I definitely recommend it!!

I have a question about traveling with milk... we are going to a wedding in NYC next weekend. It's about a 2 hour car ride and my mom is coming with us to watch DS while we're at the rehearsal dinner and the wedding. We've called the hotel, but they say they don't have refrigerators in the rooms. So is a cooler with ice good enough to keep my EBM cool for later use when my mom needs it? Should we buy a little fridge?

[ladybug0525]

moderngal - I know the hotel doesn't offer fridges but sometimes they will bring one up to your room, just a thought. I have gotten a fridge brought up to my room many times. I travel a lot with work and always put BM on ice and it seems to work fine, my son hasn't grown anything weird. I usually just refresh the ice before I to bed and then again in the morning.

[mollyeilis]

Does the hotel have a mini-bar? They might not think of that when asked about a fridge. :) We just open the mini-bar, take out whatever we please, and put whatever we want chilled in there. Replace when leaving, no one's the wiser. :D

[albuquerque]

Can I barge in and ask a question? I'm new at this, can anyone tell me if I should be worried that my almost 3 wk old exclusively breastfed DD occassionally has green poop? Mixed in with the usual breastfed orangy poop, or sometimes a diaper that seems almost all greenish-gray?

And as long as I'm asking questions--probably there isn't any new advice that I didn't already get in my "newborn tummy troubles" thread, but just in case--DD has sporadic stomach pains that seem to be excruciating for her. There are the fussy cries, the hungry cries, and then there are these times when she's perfectly calm, then you hear a little stomach-growl noise or a fart and she is instantly shrieking, shrieking like no other cry she makes, totally inconsolable. She cries harder than I ever did in labor. This has been going on since she was about a week old, maybe even before. The ped says this is young for colic, but I don't know what else to think. Often this happens while she is feeding, but not always. There are good days and bad days (today is a bad day), and good nights and bad nights. On bad days/nights, she has the pains but we can work through them, I try various things and manage to minimize the frantic crying. On the bad days/nights, the pains come in waves and she will cry, with few moments of letting up, for hours regardless of what I do to try to help her. In the last week she's been spitting up more and more, and today she "spit up" so much, and it looked so curdled, that I can't really call it "spit up" and I feel like I have to call it vomit.

The little "tricks" I try to help her: nursing, dancing/jiggling her around, putting her on her tummy across my knees and patting/rubbing her back, pedaling her legs, tummy massage, burping in every conceivable position.

I have tried: cutting out dairy, cutting out chocolate, drinking telio tea (on ped's advice--I've never heard of this in the US but it is supposed to soothe the stomach and the ped said she would get some through the breastmilk, is this responsible for the green poop? supposed to be made from something like lime leaves and to have properties similar to chamomile), not waking her to feed her (on ped's advice--when she sleeps she occasionally sleeps up to 4-5 hours), feeding her small amounts and then putting her in a sitting position for 15 min afterwards (also ped's advice, seems to conflict with not waking to feed, but since the ped told me this she hasn't slept long enough for that to be an issue).

Should I worry about the greenish poop or have other BF moms seen this? Anybody have any new ideas on what I can do to help the pain? Could this be a serious medical issue (if so, what? and what do I do?), or will she outgrow it if we just give her time?

TIA, if anyone can help....

[Marisa]

al - green poop can be caused by a number of things... it's not always a red flag, in fact, it's rarely a truly serious problem.

- In my case, it was caused by the extra iron in the prenatal I was taking. When I stopped, Joey started having yellow poop again.

- It can be caused by a foremilk/hindmilk imbalance -- when baby is not getting enough of the fatty milk at the end of a feeding. Since your dr. recommended that you do shorter feedings, I'd say this is a possibility. You can try offering just one side for an entire feeding, if you're not already (feed, burp, back on the same side). You can also try block feeding, offering the same side for every feeding within a two- or three-hour block of time. That ensures that she really empties the breast and gets to that fatty milk.

- It can be a dietary sensitivity. How recently did you cut out dairy? It can take up to two weeks for it to work its way out of your system, so be aware of that. Also, you may have to just watch for 'hidden' dairy in different foods, if she's extra-sensitive.
My son was about 3 weeks old when I started cutting out both dairy and soy from my diet. (They are similar in protein structure and babies who are sensitive to one are often sensitive to the other.) He was rashy and uncomfortable when I would have dairy, but he was gassy and screamy when I switched to all soymilk and soy ice cream. I wound up switching to rice or nut milks in my tea and cereal.

Do you have a sling? One thing Joey loved at this stage was to be bundled into the sling and briskly walked around -- the bouncing seemed to remind him of the womb as well as helping work the gas out. If you have a ring sling, you can actually put her in upright on your shoulder, as if you were going to burp her, and then hold her there with the pressure on her tummy (and the sling makes it relatively hands-free, too, so you can look online or make a sandwich or something :)).

[JillyB]

I was just coming in here to ask about green poop too! My DS is 4 months old and has had some green, spinach-like poop for about the last week. Before, he's always had yellowy-brown, seedy poops. But it's not always green...sometimes, it's "normal". He had his 4 month shots last Tuesday, and we gave him a little Pedicare for his stuffy nose last week. Those are the only things that I can think of that are "different". I haven't done anything out of the norm either (besides eating too much turkey on Thanksgiving :) ). He seems perfectly fine, and the green poops don't seem to bother him at all (no pain, excessive gas, rash, or anything). One of my relatives told me that the "drainage" from his stuffy nose could cause the green poops. Is this true? Should I worry about it, since he seems perfectly fine?

sidenote...Never did I think I would ever type the word "poop" so many times!!

[albuquerque]

Thanks, Marisa. I have a NoJo Babysling, I think it's a ring sling. I tried putting her in it but I couldn't seem to figure it out, and she screamed--she was having a bad night so I have no way of knowing whether she was reacting to the sling or something else. I was too stressed and she was too upset to do a lot of experimenting, but she seemed almost bent in half down there. Do you have any easy operating instructions?

[newyorkgirl]

albuquerque, I'm with Marisa on giving it a bit of time to let your body work the dairy out of its system. It does take a while. Whenever I lapse and have some milk or ice cream, DS gets the green poop and tummy troubles right away. But then it takes about a week to go back to normal. I would also suggest bundling baby up in a sling or swaddling - for some reason, this either helps them feel better or makes them forget about their tummy troubles. DS was swaddled for pretty much the first eight weeks of his life. :)

JillyB, is your DS drooling a lot? Some days when Bennett is just a leaky faucet, I notice his poops get greener (although not cooked-spinach-like).

[JillyB]

newyorkgirl - Yes! He has been drooling a lot lately! He was passed around so much over Thanksgiving, and his "comfort" while being handled by all of the new faces was sucking on his hands and drooling. I've been wondering if he's getting ready to start cutting a tooth or something, since he's been drooling more. Can this affect poop? Who knew I'd become obsessed with poop?!?!? Ha!

[NYN]

erika: yes, that was what i meant in regards to pumping to alleviate but if you are doing it to add a pumping session in, then ignore what i said. like mollyellis said, everyone reacts differently to pumps (you and i have a mutal friend who just bought the isis after using the medela and she says she never got so much from one pumping session). that said, if it were me and i had a little money to burn, i'd go ahead and by the ameda PY. only b/c when i am engorged and i pump w/ it i get 4 or 5 oz. in a matter of minutes. but don't kill me if you buy it and it doesn't work for you, HAHA. i know that when i was trying to pump a little to build a stash for a wedding i was going to that i didn't want to go to, i barely got any milk out. however, when i was pumping to go w/ DH and DD to an event where I wanted to have a few bottles w/ me in case i didn't have a place to nurse, i pumped w/ zero problems. it's totally psycological in my case.

[pgbg]

albuquerque/JillyB My DS had about 2 weeks of green poop around 3-4 weeks of age. He seemed otherwise fine and my ped said it was normal, something about quick transit (of the BM, I guess). He only just now started drooling a lot (also on the fam during Thanksgiving!) but doesn't have the green poop anymore. So I don't think that helps, but hopefully it will help you not worry too much! Oh, and his ranged from the spinachy-green to green-grey also.

[Dreshny]

JillyB: (I'm the resident green poop expert in these parts ;) ) My DS had seriously green (yes, like spinach) poop for a grand total of six whole weeks, beginning right after he turned 3 months old. At first I thought maybe it was my diet, but after cutting out soy and peanuts and seeing no difference (he doesn't seem to have a problem with dairy), I was alarmed enough to take him to the ped, who said DS was one of the healthiest-looking babies she'd ever seen, and she wasn't concerned. And then, of course, it continued for several more weeks.

My dad, who's a doctor, said the green color is from bile, and the green poop is probably just from the baby's digestive system maturing.

So try not to worry too much about it, okay? It's nearly always normal, according to my dad and my ped.

[JillyB]

Thanks for the green poop reassurance!!! :D I knew ya'll would be able to help me out!!! Thanks again!

And I call the green poop the "sneaky" poop...DS lets you know pretty loudly when he has a "normal" poop. Ya know, the kind that lets everyone in line at Target know exactly what he's just done. But the "sneaky" poop surprises me sometimes. I go to change what I think is just a wet diaper, and "whoa!" there's the "sneaky" poop. :p

[mollyeilis]

And I call the green poop the "sneaky" poop...DS lets you know pretty loudly when he has a "normal" poop. Ya know, the kind that lets everyone in line at Target know exactly what he's just done. But the "sneaky" poop surprises me sometimes. I go to change what I think is just a wet diaper, and "whoa!" there's the "sneaky" poop. :p

Ooh hey I'm SO excited you just wrote that! It goes perfectly with what I was going to say.

Since we CD, and in the early days I could barely move, quite often the dipe didn't make it to the pail. Also, I'd get a chance to see it all again later while washing the dipes (we didn't get those early poops off the dipe, just trusted our washer to take care of it). So I saw many a poop hours or days later.

And one thing I noticed was that sometimes/often a formerly normal colored poop would change to green, given time and oxygen!

So it makes total sense that what it likely an "old" poop, one that has been sitting there, breaking down in composition, and perhaps getting a bit of air as baby moves his legs and such, that the poop ,might change color.

So green poop does NOT mean it came out green. I saw enough of that to say that very firmly. :)


Alburqurque, you had your baby!!!! How was birthing in Greece?

Anyway, I think it's the NoJo sling that can be tricky for shorter women. Are you on the shorter side? Something about the pedding making it impossible to tighten up enough?

But if baby was already having a bad night, yeah, trying something new usually isn't going to go over very well. :) Many babies respond negatively to slings when the slings are new to the mother (or father). So what you do is you get baby used to them. Try to find a time when she's in a relatively good mood, have yourself all ready to go out, get baby into the sling, and walk ourside. Don't dawdle indoors, babies know when you're inside and dno't tend to like it. :) So get outside for a walk, being ready to call it quits and go inside if she continues to hate it. Don't give up, keep at it. Each 10 minutes you have that sling on makes you that much better at it. And the better you are at it, the more confident baby will be about it!

As for the pains, I don't know if E had what you're describing, but something that got me through the beginning was the realization that EVERYTHING is new to them! They've never ever had that pain before. THey have no way to put it into context, to know if it will go away, to know what it is. All they know is it HURTS. It's like the pains I had at the end of pregnancy...those deep pokey twinges that I assumed were my cervix doing something....never had 'em before, didin't know if they were here to stay, didn't know exactly what they were...and every time I'd react HUGELY. Yelping, holding myself, being scared....no context. And yet I could go talk to a friend and find out what they were...unlike a little baby who can't type yet. :)

So I don't know if they are the same, but remembering the above is what got us through. Congratulations on the new one!

[Sarah]

we are going to a wedding in NYC next weekend. It's about a 2 hour car ride and my mom is coming with us to watch DS while we're at the rehearsal dinner and the wedding. We've called the hotel, but they say they don't have refrigerators in the rooms. So is a cooler with ice good enough to keep my EBM cool for later use when my mom needs it? Should we buy a little fridge?
__________________

Is it fresh milk or frozen? If it's fresh, it'll be fine to be drunk(?) that night if it's kept in a mini cooler with ice packs, IMO.

[moderngal]

Is it fresh milk or frozen? If it's fresh, it'll be fine to be drunk(?) that night if it's kept in a mini cooler with ice packs, IMO.
Fresh. I plan to use what I pump at work on Thursday and a little extra I pump throughout the week.
A cooler will be easiest for me. Thanks. :)

[jengen]

Hi! I'm not a mom yet, but due in 2 weeks and have lurked on this thread, as I plan to BF...you ladies are so helpful and such a wonderful resource! :)
Anyway, I found out last week that I tested positive for Group B Strep. I've been reading up and have heard that the antibiotics they administer can lead to some women developing thrush and having problems with BF'ing. Are there any steps I can take to try to prevent this from happening to me (ie- eating yogurt in the days before delivery, etc)? Any advice? I know BF can be a challenge in the beginning as it is and would like to ward off any other potential issues if I can.

[Marisa]

jengen - welcome! :) We'll certainly do everything we can to help you through the rough first couple of weeks! :)

You can start taking probiotics now -- also called 'acidophilus' -- available in capsule form where vitamins are sold. Start by taking 1-2 caps a day, and up it to 2 caps, 3 times a day while you're trying to actively counteract the antibiotics. You can also eat yogurt with active cultures, and try to avoid sweets when possible -- yeasties thrive on sugar.

[jengen]

Thanks, Marisa!! :)

[pgbg]

This may be a stupid question, but...I know everyone says you can't overfeed a breastfed baby. But does that apply to EBM in a bottle? That's just something I wonedered, because I'm not sure if he eats as much from me as he does when he takes a bottle. Actually, my main worry isn't that I'm overfeeding DS, rather I'm concerned that he's not getting enough during the day at daycare. Last night I was running late at work, so DH gave DS a bottle (5-6 oz BM) around 6:45 or 7 or so. I got home around 7:30, and DS was still up, so I decided to see if he'd feed b/c I was so engorged. He ended up eating for a while on one side. Then around 12:30 DH gave him another bottle and he gulped down 6 oz very quickly and the bottle was empty. Oh -- he'll be 3 months on Friday and is probably around 12 lbs something. He was 10 lbs 10 oz at his 2 mo WBV (25% for wt but 75% for ht). He seems to be thriving and getting bigger everyday. Should he be getting more during the day? I starting bringing 6 oz bottles instead of his usual 5 and he seems to eat it all (he usually has three bottles at daycare and eats 4 other times a day from the breast). Should I make them 7 oz? Do you think he ate when I got home just b/c he missed me? (but he wasn't just sucking for comfort...it seemed he was really chowing down)
Any advice would be great! And let me just add that this board has been a lifesaver for these 3 months -- there's no way I'd be able to still be breastfeeding without the info/support I got at the beginning. So thanks!!

[Marisa]

pgbg -- yes, I would say that breastmilk in a bottle is probably a little different than directly breastfeeding, and it *would* be possible to give a breastfed baby a little too much milk at once that way. Though the repercussions wouldn't be the same as 'overfeeding' a formula-fed baby, of course.

The way a bottle is designed, as baby swallows one mouthful of milk, the next mouthful is pushed out of the nipple and into baby's mouth. This causes baby to swallow again, which causes more milk to push out, which causes baby to swallow again, which.... you see where I'm going with this? :D So it's not uncommon for a bottle-fed baby to seem like they 'guzzle' their bottles... there probably isn't much choice, even with a 'slow-flow' nipple.

I don't know how much control you have over the feedings at daycare, but it's always better to offer less milk over a longer period of time, to give baby the chance to feel that he's not hungry anymore. (You know how you eat something too quickly, you don't feel that you're full until after you've gorged yourself? :))

As for the evening feeding, it's really really common for babies his age, in daycare or at home, to want to nurse all evening long. It's called cluster feeding, and each and every one of us has experienced it sometime in the first few months. It's his chance to connect with you, as well as a time when milk supply is lower (for most women, typically). Kellymom has some good info on cluster feeding:

http://www.kellymom.com/babyconcerns/fussy-evening.html\

I wouldn't say that that necessarily means he's ready for bigger bottles though.

Oh and -- three months marks another big growth spurt. So see if this new feeding pattern lasts for a few days, then he might mellow out again after the spurt has passed. :)

[dziner]

Hi, I was wondering if Sarah or any other moms of two (or more!) who BF could help me.

I BF DD for a year. I now have a newborn son and am BFing him as well. I am certainly glad I chose to nurse DD for as long as I did, but as we all know, BFing in the beginning STINKS. Several of my friends with two have assured me that having two little ones gets easier, but I have realized that all of them FF. I am reliving that awful feeling of being trapped like I did the first time around, only this time I have a demanding toddler on my back. Once again, each day seems endless and turning a corner feels like a lifetime away, and I am feeling pretty depressed. I guess what I am asking is for your experience the second time around...how did you get through the first tough few months where baby is nursing 12x a day or more and you already have a child to deal with?? Any words of wisdom are most appreciated.

[maggieb]

dziner: I didn't FF!! :D No words of wisdom, but it does get better. I promise. Just put one foot in front of the other every day. These early months will fly by.

[newyorkgirl]

pgbg I SAH, so DS isn't in daycare, so I can't help you there, but I do know that DS tends to overeat when he drinks EBM from a bottle (because he has a tendency towards spitting up afterward, esp. if he eats fast). The way I combatted this was to try and simulate BFing when bottlefeeding. We use the Dr. Brown's #1 nipples (we switched from Avent) because I discovered they are really, really slow, and DS has to work harder to get at the milk. That said, he still manages to hoover it down, so what I do is I let him suck-swallow for a few swallows, then I pull the bottle nipple out a little bit for him to catch his breath, then reinsert the nipple for a few more suck-swallows. I can't remember where I read it, but that way, he should take about 15 minutes or so for his feeding.

I was also just thinking - maybe another way to gauge his tummy capacity is to do a weigh-feed/nurse-weigh at your ped's or LC's office, then fill your bottles for daycare accordingly?

[ellybelle]

Just popping in to congratulate my daughter on figuring out and sticking to breastfeeding for 2 years! I never expected to be an extended nurser, but my daughter had other plans. ;) I'm hoping that nursing her through the winter will keep her safe from all those nasty bugs that go around when it gets cold.

[deliciousjones]

yay ellybelle (and ellybelle jr)! two years is awesome!

~

i have a question. i read in another thread that at 1 year, a child should be drinking 20 oz of formula or breastmilk. i don't think my daughter (11 months) is getting that much. she nurses great in the morning and so-so before bed. she will sometimes nurse before and after naps during the day (i always try, it only sometimes works) and she is not interested in a bottle at all. she prefers her sippy cup of water, although she probably only gets 3-4 ounces of water per day.

so i guess i'm looking for guidance on how to get her to drink more during the day and before bed.

also, can i give her breastmilk in the sippy, since she seems to like that better than a bottle?

~

on a sort of unrelated note, our pediatrician suggested that we start giving her sips of whole milk (cold, in a cup) at 11-11.5 months and then at 12 months, the whole milk would replace the formula that we were supplementing with (1 bottle per day although now she's not taking that bottle). does that sound about right?

[1_mommy]

dziner i feel your flustration! my dd is 2 and ds is 7 weeks. the first few weeks were really so hard, especially on the days that ds wanted to eat non stop. i had to call and ask for help from framily a couple of times. i try to find ways to entertian dd while nursing, reading a book, watching a video with her, give her some color crayons and her coloring book.
it does get a little easier, but i won't lie, i am finding at 7 weeks it is still really hard to do it. especially when dd is begging for attention and wants me to just hold her.
i wish i had some really good words of wisdom for you, but know that you are not alone in the flustration. this mom thing sure can be hard

[chloechloe]

ARGHHH I am up for the second night in a row. I have no idea what is going on. DD is comfort nursing for HOURS so tonight I broke her latch, she cried and now we are no longer in bed, she is playing. I can't handle 6 hours or more of comfort nursing, it just isn't fun. I would like to think it is from teeth, but she has ten and did comfort nurse but not like this. She is fourteen months and she is getting molars, and also has had lots of poops tonight. Please advice me on what to do to stop this sucking, it is really making me tired and grumpy, not to mention my husband.....

[Marisa]

Yeah, elly! It's so funny now to think back on the 'old' days and now to know that you guys made it past age two. If there's one thing I learned it's that your expectations will constantly change when you're a parent. I remember telling my DH when he asked how long one breastfed a baby, "I think until age one?" :rolleyes:

chris -- It's hard to quantify oz. when she's partly nursing, partly bottlefed, so keep that in mind. Absolutely try the sippy.... I was just thinking yesterday (since Joey was sick and not entirely interested in nursing) that if he decided to stop before age two I'd continue to pump and give him a sippy, keep him getting the benefits, kwim?

When I was reading yesterday in order to post good info in that other thread, I came across the info that whole milk should be added gradually, that babies who were switched completely from formula or breastmilk at 1 year were at more risk of being iron-deficient (cow's milk being rather low in iron). If she's tolerating it and you don't think that she would be sensitive, you can follow your ped's advice for introducing it.... I'm hesitating here but I don't have any hard facts to back me up -- just my own anecdotal evidence. I can look around and see if there's anything written on the subject but... I'm pausing because my mom always talks about how she discovered my cow's milk allergy, and it was the fact that I began getting ear infections when she started giving me whole milk at around 1 year. I don't know what the evidence is actually linking the two, but I'll look around. Since I know Rachel's ears have been a problem, that's the first thing I thought of just now.....

chloe -- I completely sympathize with your situation! Joey was just getting his molars for the last two months, on and off. I thought I would go insane. What finally got me a little break was giving him some Tylenol before bed and/or overnight, when it got really bad (I try to hold off on the Tylenol unless it's really bad!) -- and I have to admit that I actually slept on the couch one or two nights, on a weekend when my husband didn't have to be up early the next day. When my DS realized that it was only daddy in the bed with him, he actually went back to sleep pretty easily (I was listening - in disbelief! - on the monitor). It's not something that worked all the time, but it was a great mental health break for me!!

[deliciousjones]

that babies who were switched completely from formula or breastmilk at 1 year were at more risk of being iron-deficient (cow's milk being rather low in iron).

She wouldn't be switching completely - only replacing the formula (which is 1 bottle per day, 3-4 days a week). I'm going to keep nursing morning and night and during the day when she's willing. We've worked too hard to make this work, so I'm not anxious to stop anytime soon!

Do kids lose interest in nursing only to gain it again? Is it worth it to keep trying to nurse her before and after each nap?

[Marisa]

Oh, definitely, Joey lost interest around a year, maybe 14 months? But it comes and goes -- there have been factors that have led to him wanting to nurse more, like when he was sick last spring, or getting more teeth this summer (he got 8 in like, 2 months, poor guy)...

As much as they say it's unlikely for a baby under age 1 to 'self-wean' -- that it's more likely a 'nursing strike' -- I also am coming to believe that it's unlikely that a child under age 2 would consciously entirely want to wean as well (barring some outside push like mom's pregnancy, something like that). This is based on my own experience with an almost-two-year-old as much as anything else, of course. :)

But it's not all or nothing, you know? This is what people are talking about when they say that their child nursed until three or four years -- they'll slow it down over time, to where the child is down to nursing once a day, then once every couple of days. For someone looking for a definitive "we're done!" moment, it could be frustrating, but ideally with child-led weaning it would be a sort of gentle realization -- hey, it's been a week or more since DC nursed!

Anyway, my mom's here to help me with Sicky McSickerson, so I can't waste this time on the computer all day.... :D

Oh -- Chris -- I was Google-Scholaring 'ear infections' and 'cow's milk' and found a few things -- no time to read through them right now...

http://www.co-allergy.com/pt/re/coallergy/fulltext.00130832-200202000-00004.htm;jsessionid=DNLHFplySnxf7cc701qv3kUvtxYPS CgdLmEdXePPHX25nSLidMDX!1438815361!-949856145!9001!-1#P29

The link between allergic rhinitis and otitis media. Doyle, William J. Current Opinion in Allergy and Clinical Immunology: Volume 2(1) February 2002 pp 21-25

The abstract seems to link allergy in general (non-specific to cow's milk) to recurrence of ear infections... since cow's milk can be allergenic to infants, though, it follows that it would be a factor...

These two cites keep coming up, but I'm not finding full text:

64 Juntti H, Tikkanen S, Kokkonen J, et al. Cow's milk allergy is associated with recurrent otitis media during childhood. Acta Otolaryngol 1999; 119:867-873.
[Context Link]

67• Tikkanen S, Kokkonen J, Juntti H, Niinimaki A. Status of children with cow's milk allergy in infancy by 10 years of age. Acta Paediatr 2001; 89:1174-1180. On retesting at age 10, many children with previously documented cows milk allergy have lost their sensitivity to the antigen, but retain a high risk for otititis media.
[Context Link]


(I don't know if this is even interesting to anyone else, LOL... :))

[maggieb]

Congratulations Elly!!!! I can't believe it's been two years already. Just thinking back to those early days and the struggles and here you are now. Yippeeee! Sofi loves her mama's milk!

[HollyMN]

Hi - Caleb has his 4 month appointment next week, and we'll probably discuss solids. I was planning to wait until 6 months or so. Is there anything I can read beforehand so I'll know what I'm talking about? What are the benefits, etc.?

[Marisa]

Holly -- the new AAP guidelines state that it's best to exclusively breastfeed until 6 months, so that's a big deal -- if the American Academy of Pediatrics says so, then I'd hope that your dr. would be taking that seriously. :)

A quote from their policy statement:

In the first 6 months, water, juice, and other foods are generally unnecessary for breastfed infants

Apart from that, there's a ton of good info on Kellymom:

http://www.kellymom.com/nutrition/solids/delay-solids.html


--- but hopefully your ped will be up-to-date on the latest recommendations, so it won't even be an issue. ;)

[LexyLou]

Poop Question-

I know it's virtually impossible for breast fed babies to be constipated but DD's poop is looking really different these past couple of days and she's REALLY fussy...even more so than usual.

She didn't poop for a day and then past two days she's still had the yellow mustard color but it's been really sticky and really hard for her to get out.

Then this morning she had a runier poop but it was a really dark brown with some black specks in it and chuncks of the yellow mustard.

Is this normal?

[1_mommy]

another poop question:
how long is normal for bf babies to go without a poopie diaper?

[Marisa]

Alexis -- are you doing any supplementing at all? Have you had anything different to eat in the last few days?

Honestly, as long as the texture is right (can be anything from liquid to almost like peanut butter) then there can be a wide range of variations in color, and it's still normal.

1_mommy -- how old is your baby? It's typical for newborns to poop frequently -- with every feeding, even -- but as they get older they can start going for a few days at a time without a poop. It was a little bizarre when my DS first went about 5 days, I think he was 4 months old... but on day 5 he had a huge 3-diaper poop (we just kept putting them under him and replacing them as they filled up -- yikes!).

Breastmilk is easily digested and very efficient -- there may not be much waste leftover afterwards, esp. as baby's digestive system matures.

My son didn't go back to a once-a-day schedule again for months, until he started eating solid food on a more regular basis.

[JillyB]

Thanks everyone for the green poop help! :D

HollyMN - On the topic of solids, we recently took our DS for his 4 month appointment. Our ped said that he'd like us to start DS on cereal sometime before 6 months. I questioned him on this, and his answer was so DS can learn to "accept" a spoon and swallow "food" before introducing "real" solids. Does this make sense? I don't know if that's really a benefit or not, but it was his explanation for recommending cereal before 6 months. Of course, this is all new to me, so I'm still trying to figure out what we are going to do. And I'd love to hear what the experts in here have to say!

[HGMorgann]

If you really want your son to accept a spoon, then give him a spoon to play with before he turns 6 mo. You could even put some breastmilk on a spoon and feed it to him, if that is truly a concern.

He does not need solids prior to 6 mo. Marisa posted the AAP policy statement above which I 100% agree with. I agree even more with the stuff she posted from Kellymom:-) The biggest reason I would wait is that his stomach is just not ready for solid food at between 4-6 mo. I would follow his cues: sitting unassisted, no tongue thrust, ect, as well. For some babies, that might be delaying solids even past 6 mo. For us, we started a bit early - 5.75 mo. She had all the signs for readiness and then some. We skipped rice all together and introduced banana first.

[majorgal]

You can introduce a spoon in so many other ways. There does not need to be food on it.

I planned on waiting until Aidan was 6 months, but I started at 5 1/4. The 40+ ounces of BM he was getting just started to not cut it. But, I also looked to the other signs--zero tongue thrust, sitting up unassisted extremely well, showing avid interest in food when I was eating, etc.

We did start with cereals and now he gets cereal and fruits and/or veggies three times a day...that's in addition to about 40 ounces of BM. We don't plan on introducing proteins until 8-9 months.

[ihearttx]

Help!

This morning I woke up and my left breast was slightly engorged and it appeared that my nursing tank had been pressing on it in a weird position. So I fed off that breast, but noticed it hurt..a lot. It hurt on the underside of the breast. Very tender and sore.

I applied a warm compress and took some advil and as the day has gone on, the pain has gotten less, but now that area is slightly pink and warm to the touch.

Is it possible that my nursing tank clogged a duct and now the clog has passed but the area is turning red? Or is this the beginning of mastitis?

I have been EBF since she was born..3 months ago..and have not had any issues like this until now.

Any thoughts?? I don't feel bad otherwise but am really nervous now that the area is pink.

[mollyeilis]

On the topic of solids, we recently took our DS for his 4 month appointment. Our ped said that he'd like us to start DS on cereal sometime before 6 months. I questioned him on this, and his answer was so DS can learn to "accept" a spoon and swallow "food" before introducing "real" solids. Does this make sense?

No, it doesn't make sense.

What others said about a spoon is good.

But you don't have to get him used to eating off a spoon held in front of him.

We exclusively nursed Eamon until he tackled (big strong breastfed kid) me for my organic apple one day. He's really never been fed from a spoon offered to him, except when my husband is being weird. He's now 18 months old, never had purees, never had anything from a jar, just eats basically what we're eating (except when we're eating egg or dairy). We put it on a little plate, he dumps it onto his highchair tray, and eats what he wants. Simple.

We were going to wait until he was at least a year, per our naturopath's suggestion (our only medical-type person), but he did the tackle and let me know in no uncertain terms that he'd like a big crunch from the apple. (oh, he got his first tooth at about 5.5 months, so by 11 months could crunch pretty well LOL)

[1_mommy]

1_mommy -- how old is your baby? It's typical for newborns to poop frequently -- with every feeding, even -- but as they get older they can start going for a few days at a time without a poop. It was a little bizarre when my DS first went about 5 days, I think he was 4 months old... but on day 5 he had a huge 3-diaper poop (we just kept putting them under him and replacing them as they filled up -- yikes!).


ds is 7 weeks. i have been so used to atleast 5 diapers a day, and now he has had 1 poopy diaper since saturday. (he went almost right after i posted)
he has plenty of pee diapers, just thought that he should have more poop.

[Dally]

ihearttx--It is possible to get a plugged duct from the tank's elastic. I get this about every other week. Keep massaging it, especially when DD is nursing. Massage toward the nipple. Other things you can do:
--apply heat to it before nursing
--nurse more often on the affected side (but don't ignore the other side)
--Soak the affected area in warm water while massaging
I'm sure there are some other things I'm forgetting, if anyone else wants to jump in.

Nursing with massage really helps. I often get plugged ducts now that I am back at work and pumping. When I go home, my DD nurses them away--sometimes in just one evening.

If you start to get a fever or have more pain, I would definitely call your dr.

I hope you feel better soon!

[Lindzee82]

What is the best way to heat breastmilk? I am thinking that I will have to just run it under hot water...but I am afraid that I either wont get it hot enough or will get it too hot. Is it better to heat it while it is in the Gerber storage bag or in the Avent bottle when running it under hot water? I think we are going to attempt a bottle tomorrow just to be sure DS can do it since I have an appointment on Monday and my mom is babysitting. I am very very nervous!!

[ihearttx]

ihearttx--It is possible to get a plugged duct from the tank's elastic. I get this about every other week. Keep massaging it, especially when DD is nursing. Massage toward the nipple. Other things you can do:
--apply heat to it before nursing
--nurse more often on the affected side (but don't ignore the other side)
--Soak the affected area in warm water while massaging
I'm sure there are some other things I'm forgetting, if anyone else wants to jump in.

Nursing with massage really helps. I often get plugged ducts now that I am back at work and pumping. When I go home, my DD nurses them away--sometimes in just one evening.

If you start to get a fever or have more pain, I would definitely call your dr.

I hope you feel better soon!


Thank you Dally! I am just worried because this has never happened before. Tonight I'm going to wear a much looser bra and try to avoid sleeping on my stomach. I just hope it goes away because I am so scared of infection.

Has yours ever turned pink like I am describing? The pain is a lot less than this morning so hopefully that is a good sign.