Breastfeeding Help and Support

[solongtogo]

sebski: I supplement DD and AF has yet to return...I don't think there is any proven way to get it to come back while BFing

[Dreshny]

And I do all 7, but got AF back at 7 months PP. :rolleyes:

[LILRTL]

And I do all 7, but got AF back at 7 months PP. :rolleyes:

That figures, huh? ;)

[chloechloe]

I nursed on command (alot) and I got AF three months pp, and she has been pretty regular since, and DD is 15 months old and I still nurse 6-10 times a day!

[Sebski]

Thanks ladies. I have to do the testing sooner rather than later... my mother started menopause at 33 and my sister, who is 31 and has been TTC for over a year now, has just been diagnosed as 'pre-menopausal' by her doctor. Since we plan on having more children, my doctor suggested testing me to see where I fall since this is a hereditary problem and I'll be turning 30 in a couple of months. They need my cycle to return in order to conduct a 'day 3 test' along with a couple others. I've been torn about what to do... stop BF and get tested when AF resumes, or continue BF and then hope that there's nothing wrong. There might not be anything wrong at all, and I risk ending a great BF relationship... ugh.

[miel]

Sebski

I've heard that very good nutrition and lots of protein can make it return. It seems to be the case that women who are in developing countries very rarely get their periods because they breastfeed all the time but I got mine pretty fast because I do eat very well and eat alot. I would try just pigging out on good healthy food and see what happens.

[miel]

p.s. I heard this from a med student who was studying this at Harvard Medical school...just a student but it might have some empirical backing.

[prudies]

miel - I had to laugh. I also eat very well, and AF stayed away until a few months ago. But hey, that's just my own experience.

[miel]

Yeah, maybe! I know my cycle is still longer. Are you still bf-ing Prudies? I am...and really wondering how one does the weaning thing....

[Allegra]

Miel, FWIW, I eat very well, BF on demand, never suplemented, co-sleep and my DD is 13 months old. Have YET to have AF. (yay!) May she stay away a long long time!

Allegra

[JATTNJ]

Thank you SOOOO much for your replies....it really helps to know that i am not the only one dealing with this. It is really important to me to try and reach one year of ebf (I was bf until i was 3!!)....I just want to make sure that ds is well-adjusted, ok,etc. etc....you understand!?!?!!
I am going to buy the "right start" bottle and try the sippy cup trick...I will update on how it all works out...thanks again!!!!

[catmom]

My 9.5 month old has recently developed some bad nursing manners, and I don't know how to handle it. While she's latched on, she'll pull way back on the nipple, stretching it out as far as it will go, and it really hurts. She'll also sometimes twist side-to-side while she's doing this. The problem is that most of her nusing these days is done at time when I want her to go to sleep, so if I keep taking her off and telling her "no," I'm afraid she won't go to sleep. She is the worst about this in the middle of the night, when I really want her to just chill out and go back to bed. When I have tried taking her off and telling her "no," the little stinker just grins at me. My nipples are sore all the time now, and I'm starting to think I might wean her at 12 months if she hasn't stopped doing this, and I was hoping to go past that.

[Cosmogirl]

Thanks Marisa! I guess I'd better brace myself for some fun coming up...:p
I already BF him on demand, usually, when he wakes up, and then before his nap. So 2 times in about 1 1/2 hour. Still, each time, he empties both side. I guess my night are about to be distrubed...
Any other thing I could do to increase my supply? Can I really offer him more then that? I mean, I still need time to produce the milk KWIM??

[krbb]

My son will be four weeks tomorrow. The past couple days he will latch on suck a little then come off and start crying. It seems to be more on one side than the other. I have a quick letdown on this side, could this be the reason? Any other ideas on why he is doing this?

[newyorkgirl]

krbb - You just answered your own question! :) A lot of babies, especially when they're still very young, have a hard time keeping up with a fast letdown and will gag/choke/sputter to keep up. Or, like your DC, pop off and refuse to nurse, then cry because he/she is hungry. What you can do is either pump or hand-express until letdown is established and then latch baby on.

[prudies]

miel Are you still out there? I'm still breastfeeding, and I also wonder how weaning is going to go. Although lately he's not so interested in nursing in the morning. The quicker he's done nursing, the sooner he can go hang out with daddy, you see. :rolleyes:

[LexyLou]

Ok Ladies,

DD is 3.5 months old. This past weeks she's been bobbing on and off the breast often and getting very frustrated. She pulls my nipple a lot, acts like she's not getting any milk but when I pull her off and hand express it shoots out so I know there is still milk in there and she gets super fussy. I have always had a good supply and fast flow so I'd be very surprised if I'm drying up....I can feel my let down and I know it happens about 1 minute after she starts sucking but I do think the length of the fast flow has slowed down...but tonight she flipped out.

I was trying to nurse her before bed and she was bobbing furiously, pulling on my nipple, her hands and arms were going spastic and she would start to cry hysterically. I tried putting it back in her mouth and holding her head closer but just couldn't seem to "get it"...she would suck suck and then pull off and scream. I changed sides and same thing so finally I gave her a 3 ox bottle of EBM and she latched on and took it peacefully and fell asleep!

She only gets a bottle of EBM twice a week at most...but could she be prefering the fact that the bottle comes out in a steady flow?

What can I do to get her back to be comfortable on the breast? I don't want to lose her yet.

[newyorkgirl]

Today marks 6 months. Yay, me! Yay, Bennett! Right?

Well, yes, I'm thrilled and relieved. There were times I really didn't think we were going to make it.

At this point, I really need some encouragement to keep me going. I'm still getting plugged ducts on average once or so a week. So I still have to use warm compresses and saline soaks pretty frequently. And I'm still swabbing myself with GSE and all-purpose nipple ointment everytime after nursing. And I'm taking everything - probiotics, omega-3 and vitamin C supplements, ibuprofen when I'm plugged up, and I just started evening primrose oil. It's frustrating that I can't just feed and go, that BFing still isn't easy. This past week, my plugged duct was pretty persistent and both DH and I were afraid I was going to get mastitis. We don't have child care set up, family lives far away, and DH has a pretty demanding job. So if I get sick, it's not a pretty sight.

At the same time, I'm constantly worrying about supply and whether I have enough and whether Bennett is growing enough (or whether his growth has been limited by the amount of BM I've fed him). FWIW, he is a happy baby, sleeps well and has wet/poopy diapers regularly, but of course I still worry.

DH and I talked about weaning (I brought it up in a fit of frustration). He's all for it and doesn't want me to get sick. Plus, he knows how frustrated I've been. But that really wasn't what I wanted to hear. I understand why he said what he did, and I'm not upset. I just wanted him to insist that I keep going and that he would totally support me.

I want to keep going, and I know it would be really difficult to transition Bennett to formula. Heck, he won't even take frozen BM!

I went to a class at the local breastfeeding center, but it ended up being more of a discussion group so I didn't get to ask questions/voice concerns and get them answered specifically. I don't know whether this merits arranging another consultation with the LC (and the cost!), or if she's just going to think I'm a worrywart.

Anyway, so I'm turning to you guys. Please, help me to keep going! I really want to make it to 1 year! :)

[NYN]

erika, congratulations! i've told you so many times but i am seriously so impressed w/ you - i don't think i would have been able to do it, seriously.

it sounds to me like you really want to hit the year mark. i think your concerns are legitimate. have you gone to any of your local LLL meetings? i don't know if every meeting is like this but mine is great b/c there is always an LC and at least two leaders in attendance and you always get to ask your questions. even when you know the answers, like you said, you just need someone to support you and help push you forward.

congratulations again!

[moderngal]

krbb that definitely sounds like a strong letdown to me. my ds did the same thing around that age. check out http://www.kellymom.com/bf/supply/fast-letdown.html

Lexy Marisa can correct me if I'm wrong, but I'm almost certain that babies as young as Ella do not wean themselves. Bottles definitely are easier to suck, so she maybe is being lazy and not wanting to work as hard at the breast. What size bottle nipple do you use? Maybe a slower one that she has to work harder at would help? I would just keep giving her the breast and not offer the bottle for awhile.

newyorkgirl congrats on 6 months!! that's great. :) BF'ing has been relatively easy for me, so I don't have any advice for you- but you've done really well in spite of your challenges. I hope you can continue. :)

[Marisa]

Alexis -- I agree, it's really unlikely that a baby that young would start to wean on her own. In a situation like that it's usually something else that's bugging them.

How is she feeling? Any colds/etc. in your house right now? Could her ears be bothering her? Did you eat anything different that could be bothering her tummy? It sounds like she might have been uncomfortable in some way, whether it's a tummyache, an uncomfortable position, something like that. I've even had the same thing happen to me when Joey was little, and I discovered the elastic on his shoes was too tight. Things like that.

It's hard, but try to keep in mind that one of the main reasons that babies 'suck down' bottles like that is because that's the way the nipple is designed. When she swallows, more milk is forced out, so she must swallow again, and the cycle repeats. A baby would have to physically turn her head to avoid taking the bottle, and at that point in the feeding process she may be just too tired to fight it, KWIM?

Anyway, keep an eye on her, see if it happens again. As a one-time event, I don't think it will mean the end of your nursing relationship.


Erika -- I really admire what you've done in order to meet your BFing goals. It's not every mommy who'd stick it out through what you're going through. You have a strong constitution. :)

Along with the plugged ducts, you also have a very real concern that a lot of breastfeeding mommies share. You can't see the intake in oz., so it's hard to feel like he's really getting 'enough'. However, you also know what to look for, and it sounds like he's exactly where he should be as far as diapers/temperament/overall health.

Since you've mentioned already that Bennett is sensitive to soy, just try to keep in mind that you're really giving him the best possible start by not exposing him to any possible outside allergens. If you can make it to a year without having to give formula, or without it being the bulk of his diet, he will be so much less likely to develop more serious allergies later in life.

... I'm being paged, so I'd better stop rambling there. But hang in there, we're all rooting for you, and try to find some more help in person. Will your insurance cover a LC visit (maybe partially)? Maybe if you get a dr's note? Mine covered one postpartum visit, but I'm not sure if there was a time limit as to when it could be used.

[LexyLou]

Thanks ladies...her reflux has been getting worse. We are going in next week for her battery of tests (x-ray, bloodwork, stool test). I have a feeling that's why she's having issues at the breast because the issues started when she seemed to be in more pain too. I hope I find out more from the Dr. soon.

On another fun note-I have strep throat...I get it a lot. I'm going in today to get antiobiotics. What are the safe antiobiotics to take while breastfeeding?

ETA: Found the info on Kelly Mom!

[oshannon]

Hey, ladies -

I'm sure you all have addressed this somewhere earlier, but I'm not quite awake enough to try to read through all 250+ pages, so I'll ask you to forgive me.

My son, who is one week old today(!) latches on well, but only spends about 10 minutes nursing before falling off to sleep. Despite the fact that he's had plenty of wet and dirty diapers and is back up over his birth weight, I'm still freaking out about this.

New mom jitters or should I be concerned?

[Marisa]

oshannon -- Congrats! :) Sounds pretty normal to me. The first week or two, they can be SO sleepy. Just keep counting diapers. The fact that he's up over birth weight already at only a week (BF babies can take 2 to get there) is a very good sign. :)

If you're concerned, try offering the same breast for a full feeding -- i.e., nurse for 10 min, stop to burp, then offer the same breast again. If he does take any more after that, he'll get the fattier hindmilk, and if not, you're still doing ok.

[newyorkgirl]

Thanks, ladies. I'm just a little down because I know that I want to go a full year, but I just haven't felt a lot of support for it. I'll feel better soon. :)

[LeslieR]

newyorkgirl, congrats on 6 months! I know what you mean about not thinking you would make it. Yesterday was 5 months for us. I haven't gone through as much as you have, but I'm still battling the yeasties-no mastitis lately (knock on wood). The only thing that seems to work is putting the Nystatin on twice a day. If I get lazy about it, sure enough my nipples start to get red and a touch sore.:rolleyes: I don't know why it's so easy for some and so difficult for others, but for me it's always been easier to keep going than to quit. I'm too lazy to make bottles!:p I hope you can get some additional support so that you can make it to your goal of one year!

[Natrat80]

I don't post much in here, but I try to read a bit everyday! DD is almost 7 months old and we're still going strong. I'm beginning to worry that she'll never learn to eat solids....but that's a topic for another thread! ;) I'm just thankful she still wants to nurse!
oshannon My DD never nurses for longer than 10 minutes. It used to freak me out because ALL the books say that's not long enough. I used to time her every nursing session, which only made me more nervous because she nursed about 5 minutes on each side on a good day. I think you DS is doing very well-over birth weight and having enough wet/dirty diapers. But I totally understand your concern. Just trust your body and try not to worry so much. Congratulations!
newyorkgirl I don't know your whole story, but it sounds like you've really worked hard to make it to 6 months. Way to go! Take one day at a time and I bet you can make it to a year. I think my DH would say the same thing yours did if I told him I wanted to wean. So before DD was born I told him that if I mentioned giving up BFing before a year to remind me of all the reasons why I wanted to nurse her. I bet your DH just wants to support you... ..tell him that you really want to make your goal of a year and I bet he'll encourage you to keep going.
LexyLou Sorry about your DD's reflux. I hope that the tests reveal what's going on. As far as the bobbing on and off goes, my DD went through that and still does it randomly. I think it could be caused my lots of different things, but I don't think its a deal breaker if you KWIM. When my DD went through a mini nursing strike ( around 6 weeks ) I tried to avoid the bottle at all costs. I wondered if she preferred the steady flow/less effort of bottlefeeding so I decided to stay away from the bottle until the strike past. I had to pump to relieve engorgement for a few days because she didn't nurse very well but we made it through and survived. Hope things are going better this evening.

[magdesilver]

Quick question- My DD had to have a CT Scan (and be sedated for it) this morning and I couldn't BF her for 4 hours prior to the scan. So, I fed her at 5 a.m. (scan at 9 a.m.). Anyhow, when she woke up she was kind of loopy and crying/irritable and wasn't interested in BFing, and then she fell asleep until 2:30. I did BF her right at 2:30 and then again at 3:30 and then she fell asleep again and is STILL sleeping. I'm definitely full, but not at all uncomfortable/engorged. I know it's typical for babies to not be hungry after being sedated, but assuming she wakes up to eat at some point do you think my supply will be affected by this one-day thing? Assuming she goes back to eating normally tomorrow? My pump is all packed away and I never got a great response from it anyway, but I don't want to risk my supply. Anyone have any info? Should I wake her to feed? She's 8 1/2 months old and normally does NOT sleep through the night (wakes 1-2 times between 6 pm and 6 am).

[magdesilver]

Of course, as soon as I posted this she woke up to eat! I think things will be fine (well, as long as she doesn't wake up at 3 a.m. ready to go for the day.....)

[2002BeachBride]

Hey Mag:D

just wanted to post to say glad she woke up to eat and I hope all is well:)

Jen

[pixiecat]

Sorry if this has been posted before... but I have a quick question (that now seems kind of silly, sorry!)

My best friend and I (both bfing) are going for a much needed "mommy" day at the spa... do the "toxins" that they say they release during massage going to affect our milk?

Thanks!

[Marisa]

Julie, that's a good question, and one I haven't seen much written about. I have read that rapid weight loss can result in higher levels of toxins being found in mother's milk, but I can't imagine it would be significant after only one massage...

Let me look around a little and see if I come up with anything. :)

[hope0805]

Too much water???

Is it possible to drink too much water, such that it would adversely impact your milk supply? I have been upping my water intake with the hopes that it would help (to about 175 oz a day, with most consumed while at work from 8:30 - 5:30) and now a woman at work tells me over lunch that she thinks it could actually be hurting my supply. Has anyone ever heard of such a thing???

[x-posted here and on moms with pumps]

[Marisa]

According to Mother Food (my new fave book, LOL):


...if mothers drink far above their thirst they see a drop in milk supply... As soon as the excess fluid has been worked out of her body -- it can take up to a week for the kidneys to work out extra fluids -- milk production will pick up.

Generally, drinking 8 cups of water a day is a good guide, but you should drink to thirst and adjust according to what works for you and your body.

[hope0805]

Thanks Marisa.

8 cups ... hmmm, that is only 64 ounces???!!!

I ALWAYS have consumed way more than that, probably at least double that amount. Perhaps I just should go back to drinking what I drank before (about 3 liters, or 150 ounces) and not worry about increasing it to up my supply ... sounds like I was already drinking more than they recommend for healthy BFing.

[AlisonCO]

Hey Marisa - according to LLL, how much weight "should" an exclusively BF'd baby gain per week on average for the first 4 months? My 4 month old had her WBV today and gained 19 ounces in 7 weeks and grew 1.25 inches. Kellymom said 4-5 ounces per week and 1 inch per month. The ped said that she is very healthy and discouraged solids until 6 months so this is ALL coming from me. She is nursing well and often during the day and eats 1-2 times overnight. She is very alert and happy, responds to our voices, grabs toys etc - I KNOW in my head that she is doing well, but it is still nagging at me a bit. Here are her weights since birth:

birth - 6-10
day 2 (leaving the hospital) - 6-6
day 5 - 6-13
1 month - 8-15
2 months + 1 week - 11
4 months - 12-3

Thank you!!!

[Cosmogirl]

Is it possible that a kids has growth spurt that last longer then 48 hours but are not as bad? For the second time in his life DS has had a period of several days in which he eats like crazy, but didn't really wake up at night. This period stopped yesterday, and since he eats a LOT less then the previous days.

Any thoughts???

[newyorkgirl]

Hello ladies! Just wanted to thank you again for your words of encouragement. I think I'm just going to take it one week at a time. That way, I can say to myself, "If it gets too hard, I can always wean next week." And hopefully, next week will never come. :)

I did suck it up and make an appointment to see my LC today. She took one look and said, "Omigosh, I wish you'd come to see me sooner!" Yes, I have thrush (again!) and she also thinks I have some form of mastitis, although not the seriously icky kind where you feel like crap. She said, Get thee to the OB right away! Well, no, she didn't exactly say that, but I'm to go see him and get scripts for an antibiotic and Diflucan.

She also had a couple other solutions that didn't include total weaning. After being done with the prescriptions, I can try phytolaca to prevent a future infection. And, also, if my breast continues to give me problems (and it's always the right one and not the left one) she said I could wean the right one and continue feeding with the left one. That seems strange to me, and makes me worried that relying on the one good breast would cause that one to be susceptible to problems as well, but she seems to think not.

Anyway, if that doesn't work, then we can talk weaning, but perhaps trying these solutions will bring me a couple more months of fulltime BFing before we have to consider weaning as an option.

So yay! for LCs. :)

[dbers]

I have a question about pumped milk. How can you tell if it's gone bad? I sent a bunch of frozen BM to daycare with Alex today - and when I got home with the dirty bottles, I noticed that one of them spelled terribly! It was really gross. The other one smelled fine. The teachers didn't mention anything to me, but they did say that she was quite cranky today (not sure if this started before or after her first feeding). Does this mean that batch of BM was bad? It was stored with all the others :confused:

[newmommy]

Hello ladies! Just wanted to introduce myself:
Today is our first day home, and I'm breast feeding DS....and it's going pretty well. I went into this thinking that I'd give it a shot, and hope for the best.....dh and I are jotting down every feeding session/length/side/ and time.
So far he latches on well------very aggressive!!! I have such sore nipples, my Dr. prescribed me APNO(anyone ever heard of it?) Anyways he averages anywhere from 10,20 or 30 minutes each side! Sometimes he even goes back for dessert!!! Anyways I'm glad to have found this thread, and I'm looking forward contributing!!

Oh, and has anyone else used APNO???

[moderngal]

Chicken- haven't heard of Apno, but wanted to say congrats on your DS. :) I went into it feeling the same way as you and 8 months later we're still going strong. :) It's really the best thing I've ever done. Good luck!!

dbers- sometimes mine is like that, too. I think it may pick up other food odors. I don't know though. I don't think it's really "bad" if it's in there a short amount of time, but maybe just not as tasty as usual, KWIM?

[AlisonCO]

And, also, if my breast continues to give me problems (and it's always the right one and not the left one) she said I could wean the right one and continue feeding with the left one. That seems strange to me, and makes me worried that relying on the one good breast would cause that one to be susceptible to problems as well, but she seems to think not.

newyorkgirl - I just wanted to let you know that I nursed my son on one breast from when he was 2 weeks old until he was 14.5 months old. I had mastitis that turned to an abcess that turned to another abcess and on and on. I had to have surgery and the incision was right around my nipple so I couldn't nurse or pump so I let it dry up. My son did great with the super boob and I never had a problem with the "good" boob. Also just wanted to let you know that this time I have had no problems with either breast so in case you were hoping for more kids, it doesn't necessarily mean you will have the same issues next time. If you want more details let me know - hang in there, you are doing such a great job!

[lil_nance]

For those of you that do/did a "dream feed" at what age did you stop and let DC sleep through the night. DS is almost 6mo. Currently I feed him around 7ish put him to bed, wake him for a feed between 11-11:30 and then he sleeps until 7 or 8 in the morning. I'm wondering if we can drop the late night feed. Also we are starting solids this weekend and don't know if that will change things or not.

[Natrat80]

lil_nance I think I stopped the dream feed around 4 months. All babies are different, so I think you'll just have to try it to find out if he's ready to drop it or not! I'd say at 6 months he'd probably be okay without it. (Says the mom of the 7 month old that still wakes up at night to nurse :rolleyes: )

[Allegra]

ok maybe not so much a BF question but this seems the best place for it. My DD is 13 months old. She is still almost 50-70% breast fed. She likes food ok but doesn't eat very well with me. Anyway, she has been experiencing really hard dry BM which have been causing her no small amount of pain as they move through her system. I BF on demand but I'm wondering if our "push" for her to eat more solids is causing the other problem? I think my supply may be dropping a bit - AF has not yet returned but DD has been much fussier at the breast this past couple of weeks. (no teeth on the horizon that I can tell) Thoughts? We've been trying to make sure she drinks water with every meal - prunes have been our best solution to date but poor kid - who wants to spend their lives eating prunes??

Allegra

[NYN]

erika: the week-to-week thing...that is what i did my first 10 days of catie's life, when i was pumping every hour on the hour b/c she would not take my breast. i would pump (which i HATE doing and at that time i was so hormonal that i hated it even more) i would tell myself "i will do this for one more day. tomorrow i will allow myself to quit if i still want to." of course that day never came. :D

regarding the feeding off of one breast only thing: i have a friend who claims that her right breast dried up at 7 months PP. i personally think she just didn't "use" it enough b/c she was always saying how much easier it was to hold her DD onto her left breast to nurse but that is irrelevant. point is that she fed off of the left side only from 7 months to 13 months and didn't have any problems. didn't look lopsided either which would be my only concern.

diane: i don't think she would have taken it if it was spoiled. what did it smell like exactly? i can never tell...

nancy: we just stopped doing it about a month ago (DD is now 5.5 months) but then she started waking up to feed at 3am!

allegra: wasn't there an issue w/ her being possibly anemic? is she taking iron supplements? that is the only thing i can think of considering she still BF so much. are you still giving her cereals? i hear those are constipating...(just throwing ideas out there since my DD doesn't eat solids yet).

[Brink]

Question - I've been back at work for just over a week and we are having major issues with BFing. DD is 3 1/2 months old and we have done great up to this point with her latch. We really struggled this weekend and I ended up giving in several times and giving DD a bottle of EBM. The weeknights are even harder since she has been getting a bottle all day long. She isn't really sucking anymore, she is biting down and thrusting with her tongue. When I am trying to BF, I can see her tongue almost coming out by her lower lip. We don't use a pacifier, we use our pinky finger so I can really feel the difference on how her suck has changed. It used to be a very forceful pulling and now she is chewing on my finger between her gums - which is the same thing that she is doing when trying to BF. I've tried laying her down on my lap instead of the boppy to have gravity help and that seems to have helped a little, but not much.

Since I don't have a choice but to give her bottles at daycare, is there anyway to make the transition back and forth between bottle and breast easier? I'm really frustrated and feel like I'm back at the beginning all over again.

Also, if I do decide to give in and just pump, how badly will that hurt my supply? I really want to make it to six months and don't want to give in, but I also don't want to become resentful when we have such a short time together in the evenings and I spend it fighting with her to latch on.

Help.....

[Marisa]

Alison -- LLL also mentions the 4-5 oz. per week gain. But also keep in mind that your DD was on the 'petite' side when she was born, and she managed to nearly double her birth weight in less than 6 months (a general rule is that they will double their BW by 6 months, and triple it by a year -- so she might only be 19 pounds-ish by her first birthday). Is she starting to get distracted during daytime feedings? (very common starting around 3-4 mos)... If you're not already, feeding her exclusively from one side at a feeding might give her more access to fattier milk. Other than that though, she's meeting all the signs on the checklist for 'slow gainer' as opposed to 'failure to thrive' -- and the dr. says it's fine -- so I'd have to concur. :)

Val -- it's certainly possible -- anything goes when it comes to growth spurts, with some babies! Other things that could make him want to nurse more frequently - is he getting a tooth? (He may sleep so soundly that it doesn't bother him at night, but it's more painful during the day.) He may also have a little cold coming on, nursing more frequently can be one of the earliest signs, and we don't even put 2+2 together until Joey actually starts getting sniffly. Then it's like, 'ohhh yeah!' :)

Erika -- I am SO glad to hear that you had a good experience with the LC! It sounds like a wonderful plan that you've got there, and it really sounds like you're going to have the support you need to push you to meet your goal.

Diane -- you'd probably have to have smelled it at the time it was thawing to tell that it was bad, if that really was the case. But it also could have just been something in your milk the day that it was pumped -- a different type of food you don't normally eat -- that changed the smell a bit. Obviously unless you kept a strict food diary you'll never know.... In general, it's pretty hard to get a baby to accept milk that's truly spoiled, so I'm guessing that since she took the bottle, and since she wasn't ill afterwards (from drinking spoiled milk), then the crankiness may have been unrelated.

Chicken -- congrats on your new baby! :) It sounds like you've got your standard-issue newborn there! The first few weeks are spent just figuring things out and hanging in there from one day to the next (and one feeding to the next sometimes!) Take advantage of any help that people are offering to you (besides feeding the baby, of course!) Nap when your baby naps, and learn how to nurse lying down if you can, it's the best! :)
I've never had APNO ( = All Purpose Nipple Ointment) but I know that it can be terribly effective, especially postpartum. If you've had antibiotics in the hospital, that can increase your chances of getting thrush in the early weeks, and that on top of your typical new-nursing-mom soreness can really be uncomfortable.

Allegra -- my son was very much the same way with solids, and I'd have to say that he didn't take to eating real 'meals' until he was probably closer to 15 months. When my DS was your DD's age, he was also diagnosed as being anemic, so I stepped up his iron-rich foods and mixed a little iron-fortified cereal with his yogurt, but that was the only cereal he got. Otherwise he was totally on 'table foods'. I don't know if that's something you're already doing, but if your DD can eat more of the 'regular' foods (we just gave DS bite-size versions of our meat, chicken, veggies) she might have a better time with it than if she's eating baby food?

Brink -- what kind of nipples are you using? Can you try a different bottle nipple, i.e something like the Playtex ones with the 'natural latch'? It may help. Can you rearrange your plans this weekend to plan a bit of a 'nurse-in', where you just try to work on her latch? (Preferably when she's not actually hungry, so she won't be mad and you won't get frustrated.)
I won't lie to you, it would be harder to keep your supply up while pumping, but it definitely can be done. You would have to keep to a routine of pumping both at home and at work, and you might have to take some supplements like fenugreek to encourage your supply to stay strong. I think your goal is absolutely reachable, though, and this is just a bump in the road IMO. :)

[newyorkgirl]

AllisonCO - So you're saying that you had issues with your first child and that didn't recur with the second child? You're BFing off both breasts for the second child? If so, that's really good to hear, because I am very worried about that. I just keep thinking, Gosh, if I have so many problems now (and what if I have to have surgery to drain an abscess), how am I possibly going to breastfeed any future children?

Chicken - I know ALL ABOUT APNO! :) I've been using it nonstop since about two months postpartum. All purpose nipple ointment is something concocted by Dr. Jack Newman (who's a great resource for bfing moms). You can find the original composition of APNO by googling Dr. Newman and all-purpose nipple ointment. But you can also make up an OTC version of it to use, which is what I use. And that is two parts Polysporin (antibiotic), two parts Lotrimin AF (antifungal) and one part 1% hydrocortisone ointment (to help reduce inflammation, but make sure to get the ointment and not the cream). Apply sparingly on the nips after nursing. It's useful in the first couple months because you get cracked nips and this can help prevent future infections. The only warning I would give you is - if you find yourself using it quite often, stop mixing in the hydrocortisone ointment. The hydrocortisone weakens the skin a little bit and too much use (plus nursing) can make for pretty raw nips.

[AlisonCO]

THANK YOU Marisa!

So you're saying that you had issues with your first child and that didn't recur with the second child? You're BFing off both breasts for the second child? If so, that's really good to hear, because I am very worried about that. I just keep thinking, Gosh, if I have so many problems now (and what if I have to have surgery to drain an abscess), how am I possibly going to breastfeed any future children?



Yes - I had only one case of mastitis and that turned into an abcess so I didn't really have recurrent issues. I was probably not as aware as I am now about it so maybe I delayed going to the doc last time. This time I did start to get mastitis (in the bad boob) when DD was small and I was very proactive in treating it and it did go away. I have had a few plugged ducts but because I know what to do I am able to get rid of them quickly. I am feeding on both sides this time and DD actually prefers the "naughty" boob:) If you need any support in terms of feeding on one side etc, please let me know!

[Cosmogirl]

Thank you Marisa. It is not the first time he does this, and the other times, I was never able to link it to something, thus the question. I think he has "been working" on his teeth for a while now, I don't know when they'll come out officially, but he sure has red cheek often!

[BeachBum]

I could use a comfort nursing pep talk. :o

DS is 4mo. and is a huge comfort nurser. I SAH, so usually I don't mind, but it has gotten me down lately. We moved him to the crib in his room Jan 1 (he's been napping there for 2 or 3 weeks before), and he is waking every 2 hours or so at night, and every 30 min during a nap. Thus far, I have been getting up every time with him. Just a couple of minutes on the boob and he goes back to sleep, but I'm so tired.
Today, I left him there to whine for a few minutes before I went in, and the poor little guy had rolled onto his side and was "nursing" on his lovey--whining. It broke my heart!
Am I going to create a boob monster that will still be doing this when he is two if I keep nursing him at night so often? If he is, should I just suck it up and figure that is part of being a mom? Should I make DH go in at night instead and hope that DS doesn't get worked up into a full blown cry?
Commiseration? pep talk? advice? anyone?

[LeslieR]

BeachBum, I don't have any advice for you at all, but just wanted to let you know you're not alone. Up until recently, DS was waking up several times a night to nurse. I would go to him and find him with his face up against the bumper rooting around.:( I know he doesn't need to nurse every single time he wakes up now that he is bigger, so I've made some "rules" for him. I start his bedtime routine at around 6 and he is almost always asleep by 6:30. He typically wakes up to nurse between 1:30 and 3. If he wakes up before 1:30, I don't go to him unless he is crying (real crying with tears-which never happens, he mostly just lays there and whines). Last night he woke up two times before 2am and I just let him fuss it out. He put himself back to sleep both times after about 20 minutes or so. It's hard (for me) to listen to, so I turn the monitor down to the lowest setting until I know he's back asleep.:o He will typically wake up again around 5 and I will go to him again at this point (in hopes that he will sleep a little longer! lol). I can almost always get him back to sleep so I stick with it. I've been struggling with the whole 'nursing to sleep' thing, but it's all I know how to do right now, so I'm sticking with it. DH has tried going in there to soothe him and it never works.:rolleyes: You never know, it might work for you guys, though. This will probably sound silly, but my problem was that I never "knew" it was okay to just let him fuss it out when he would wake up. I thought I needed to go in there every time. I don't think I ever knew when to make the transition from 'baby needs to eat every two hours (or when baby wakes up)' to 'baby doesn't need to eat that frequently at night'. Does that make sense?

[newmommy]

Thanks ladies :D

NewYorkGirl: My APNO was a pre-mixed version...and it's cream. I don't have any refills remaining, so can I get it online? If so, can you post the link?

So it's perfectly safe for DS right? I don't have to wipe it off prior to BF, am I right about that?


Question: How long can I let the baby sleep between feedings at night? Last night he slept for four straight hours, and I didn't have the heart to wake him......should I be waking him to feed????:confused:
TIA!!!

[Marisa]

Chicken -- as long as you're seeing a steady gain and he's having plenty of wet/poopy dipes, there should be no reason to wake him at night to feed. Enjoy the rest! :)

[HGMorgann]

I have a stomach bug and cant keep anything down. Is there anything I can do to help keep my supply up? Pretty sure DD had it yesterday - but thankfully it was much lighter than my version and I EBF yesterday.

[newyorkgirl]

Chicken - it sounds like your APNO was the prescription version, which can actually be pretty costly, if I remember correctly. If you want refills of that, you will probably have to go back to your doc. For the over-the-counter version, I don't know of anywhere you can get it pre-mixed. I do the mixing myself at home. I just buy a big tube of Polysporin, a big tube of Lotrimin and half a big tube of Cortizone and mix it all up.

ETA: Yes, it's safe for BFing. As long as you don't slather it on, it will pretty much be absorbed by the next time your DC nurses. I never wipe it off.

[newmommy]

Thanks ladies!!! I called the LaLeche League as well, they recommend waking a sleeping baby after three hours....but I agree, he's has one or two wet/poopy diapers per feeding......so if he'll let me sleep, who am I to stop him, right?;)

[Marisa]

Chicken -- LLL also recommends 8-12 feedings in a 24-hour period, if that helps you keep track better. If he's going for one longer stretch of about 4 hours at night, be sure to offer the breast a little more often during the next day to be sure to get those 8-12 feedings in.

Waking him to eat more like every 2 hours during daylight hours may also have the benefit of helping him sort out his days and nights as well, a problem many newborns experience. As I'm sure you're coming to realize. :)

[jengen]

Quick question - I thought I read that babies become more proficient at emptying the breast as they get older...my DS has nursed 20 mins on each side for each feeding since day 1. He will be 4 weeks old tomorrow and the last few days he has started the pulling/tugging routine after about 15 mins...almost like there is nothing left in there, so I have been switching him to the other side at that point. So, am I robbing my kid of 10 mins of feeding or is he getting better at eating more quickly? He doesn't seem to miss the 10 mins and is going back to sleep,

[Marisa]

jengen - it sounds like you're reading your DS's cues properly. Babies often fuss/wiggle/tug like that when they're looking for another letdown, so I think you're right that he may be looking for the milk to flow more quickly again. If switching him to the other side is working, then keep doing it! :)
15 minutes is plenty of time to get at the fatty hindmilk, and at 4 weeks he's already had a big growth spurt and is already starting to cut back on the time he needs to get enough milk. :)

[lorialys]

jengen I agree with what Marisa said!! My son does this all.the.time! He also takes 20 minutes on each side, at least. And he's 12 weeks. Some babies just take longer than others. He may get more efficient as time goes on, or he may not. I dunno! (wow, that was helpful of me ;) )

I actually have a question. DS is going through a growth spurt right now, I think. But my question is only slightly related to that. When he was younger, I used to be able to read his hungry cues much better. If he was sucking on his fists, rooting on my shoulder, bobbing towards my boobs when he was on my lap, he was obviously hungry! I could even pick out a hungry cry sometimes. Well, since he's gotten older, discovered his fists, etc. he's seemingly stopped giving me hunger cues altogether. His fists are in his mouth every waking moment of the day it seems, since they are so interesting to him now. So I can't use that as a sign. I haven't noticed him root in quite awhile, do babies lose that reflex along with the other newborn reflexes? He'll still do the bobbing for boobies thing if it's been a long time since he nursed, say in the morning. He hardly ever cries out of hunger anymore (except for the past day or so, just because he's going through the growth spurt, but even then it's not well distinguished between his fussy cry), even in the morning after waking from 10-11 hours of continuous sleep he's just cooing and playing in his crib, not crying "give me milk now!!" LOL.

I guess what I'm asking is, is this normal for hunger signs to dissipate as he gets older and needs fewer feedings and is generally a happier baby? Do older children show the same signs of hunger as the really young babies, or are there other things I should be looking for? I'm feeding him every 2 1/2 to 3 hours during the day (before growth spurt). After the spurt is over, should I wait longer until he really starts to show me some of the signs I was used to before?

[Dreshny]

My DS doesn't often cry out of hunger anymore, but he knows he always gets fed before and after naps, and I think that's enough for him nowadays (it comes out to every 2-3 hours or so, sometimes more often.) If he does get hungry, he'll let me know! He'll suck on my chin or ear or elbow or knee or any available body part (LOL!), and if I still don't get the message, he cries.

[newmommy]

So what is considered a "feeding"??? Both sides, or just one???
If it's both sides he's had six feedings and it's 8:45pm.......if you count one side then it's been 14......okay I think I answered my own question...but please add any info.


I just pumped for the first time, and I think we're going to try to give him a bottle at his next feeding...just to see what happens. He refused to take a bottle in the hospital so I'm not sure this will work.........

There just seems to be so much to know with BF....it seems a tad overwhelming.....although I must admit he's taking to it like a champ :D

[Mickey&B]

If he does get hungry, he'll let me know! He'll suck on my chin or ear or elbow or knee or any available body part (LOL!), and if I still don't get the message, he cries.


I was just going to say the same thing :D

[Marisa]

Chicken -- a "feeding" would be based on the length of time, not whether he took both sides. You can feed entirely on one side, and that would still count. I did that a lot in the beginning, because I had an oversupply and that helped slow it down a little. So count the feeding from the time he starts until the time he seems to be done. Try not to watch the clock, I know it's the only way to "quantify" the breastfeeding since you can't count ounces, but it really shouldn't be so stressful. :) Just go with the flow, as they say. :)

It's fine if you want to begin pumping now, but it's actually recommended that you don't give a bottle until around 3-4 weeks. This gives you the best possible shot at making nursing work; before this and your baby may get nipple confusion. Of course, it's your decision, but holding off until 3 weeks will not mean that your baby will never take a bottle. I actually started pumping the first day home, but I saved the milk to give his first bottle at 1 month.

[Natrat80]

HGMorgann I had a bad stomach bug over the holidays. I breastfed DD the whole time, even when I was too weak to pick her up. We were at my parents house and my dad brought her to me to eat and then helped me switch sides! Anyways, I just tried to drink as much as I could even though I didn't want to. Then I nursed DD whenever she wanted (which I usually do anyways) and throughout the night (which I don't usually do) to keep my supply up. Hope you are over the bug soon!

[newmommy]

Marisa-
Thanks a bunch!!!! DS HATED the bottle last night---------so we're sticking to BF since it's working (to my surprise!)

thanks again!!

[Ole Miss Bride]

Okay, y'all, I need some help. My kid is 3.5 weeks old, and he sucks at breastfeeding. Seriously. Everything started out really well -- good latch and all -- but over the past week, he's become really lazy about it. He does not want to open his mouth wide enough for me to get him on well, so I'm constantly shoving my breast in his mouth, and it doesn't seem to work so well. Or on the rare occasion he will latch well, he ends up pulling back toward the middle of the feed and taking only the nipple into his mouth, which hurts like a biatch.

What is the deal? Why is he doing this? How can I get him to latch better? The kid just won't open his mouth, so I have no idea how one works with that situation.

I think I have a too-forceful letdown, as he often comes off the breast coughing at first (and there's a ton of gulping at the beginning of each feeding), so I'm wondering if that's part of our problem.

It's getting to where I dread BFing him because of the discomfort. I'm not about to give it up, but I do wish it would get better. I am so, so tired of taking him off and trying to relatch him, all to no avail.

Thanks for any help, y'all.

-Betsy

[magdesilver]

Besty, It sounds to me like you have an overactive let-down. I had the same thing when DD was a newborn. That is why he pulls back on the nipple- he has more control over the flow that way. One thing you can do is hand express or pump a little before you latch him on, so that the first spurts don't overwhelm him. Another thing that I did that really worked for us was one sided feedings. That helped slow down my supply a little. I only fed DD on one side per feeding session until she was about 5-6 months, now we do both sides most of the time with no problems.
Here's the Kellymom section on OALD:
http://www.kellymom.com/newman/02colic_in_bf_baby.html#fastletdown

And the babycenter BF board info on it:

Gravity can be your friend here. Try nursing in a reclining position. For example, you can latch baby on in cradle hold & then lean back into a nice pile of pillows behind you so that your baby is pretty much above the breast. Gravity will slow the let-down this way.

Give your baby an "escape route." By nursing side-lying, your baby can let the extra milk dribble out of the mouth instead of gagging on it & gulping extra air in the process.

Nurse on just one side per feeding. Emptier breasts make milk faster. There is a negative-feedback loop going on, and you actually want your breasts to get the message to slow down on production. Also, your baby will only have to deal with the first, most powerful let-down once if you only feed on one breast per feeding.

Use the same side for two feedings, then switch to the next side for the next two feedings. Same idea as above: fuller breasts will make less milk, so you're taming the overabundant supply.

Here are some links on oversupply & forceful let-down:

Too Much Milk
http://breastfeeding.hypermart.net/toomuchmilk.html

Oversupply - Too Much Milk
http://www.breastfeeding-basics.com/html/oversupply.htm

Finish the First Breast First
http://www.lalecheleague.org/llleaderweb/LV/LVSepOct95p69a.html

Let-Down Reflex Too fast?
http://www.kellymom.com/bf/supply/fast-letdown.html

[Daniel's Kitty]

Has he had his 3 week growth spurt yet? Ben was constantly pulling back then and he would wind up with just my nipple.

I had to pinch my whole breast down fairly flat and shove. I also had to pump a little if I got engorged or he would not eat that well. I found out that if I would tease him with my nipple till he openned his mouth well and then shove it, we had an okay latch. But I would keep my finger at the ready to break the latch.

Once gets a little bigger he should be able to handle your let down better, we wound up taking DS to the doctors cause he was always spitting up at first at it was just my let down.

I am guessing that you will get a lot more responses, but that sounded like my experiences to some extent.

[JillyB]

I have a stomach bug and cant keep anything down. Is there anything I can do to help keep my supply up?
Me too...ughhhh...I was so sick yesterday, and I'm really hoping that it was something I ate and not a virus. *knock on wood* DS seems perfectly happy and healthy. I feel much better today, but I'm not having very "productive" pumping sessions here at work today (or yesterday). I know that I need to drink more water and try to eat something, but I don't *want* to.

Natrat80 - Thanks for responding to this question!

Stomach "issues" don't affect Momma's milk, right? As in, nothing "bad" is passed onto baby, right?

[Dally]

Betsy--My DD did the same thing until she was about 8-10 weeks old or so. I did not have overactive letdown, but my DD was small and I think she just found it easier to have just the nipple in her mouth. I totally empathize--it was very painful. :(

With the help of an LC, I did a few things:
1) Whenever she did this, I delatched her (breaking suction with my finger), and then made her relatch correctly. Sometimes I had to do this several times a feeding. I won't lie, it was frustrating and difficult to keep doing it (and sometimes I didn't bother). But it does teach the baby--and that's important not just for the pain, but to ensure the baby is getting enough milk.

2) I used nipple ointment to help my sore nipples after every nurse. My midwife made me some, but I'm sure it wasn't too different from Lansinoh.

3) If one side or the other became extremely painful, I gave it a few hours (once 24 hours) rest from the baby, and just pumped. The baby got the other side. I say this with caution because I think it might have affected my supply on one side. But I can't say for sure.

In any case, eventually my DD started latching great and the pain went away. Hang tough; it'll get better!

[HGMorgann]

Jillyb Hope you and your little one are feeling better...or that your little one stays better! It only lasted 24 hours here. I called my LLL leader after posting and she said its fine to nurse and to try to nurse as much as you can.....for me, as much as I could, wasnt much...but she said that was fine. Today, I am able to drink a little and DD seems happy - a little fussy, but thats OK. We actually think she got it first - but all her symptoms were vomitting once and spitting up and lots of bowel movements. I truly believe that BF protected her from getting a full fledged version.

My supply is super low, but I am nursing frequently. Tomorrow I will eat lots of oatmeal:-) Doing BRAT today - but only could stomach 1/2 banana so far.

[JillyB]

HGMorgann - Thanks! I'm trying to do the BRAT diet too, but I've only been able to stomach some rice and toast. But I feel MUCH better. And I'm trying to drink plenty of water. And does the "Hokie" in your sig mean you're a VA Tech grad? Ughhh...I'm a Mountaineer! And I grew up just down the road from Tech in Princeton. ;)

[HGMorgann]

Yep. I am a VT grad. :-D Glad to hear you are feeling better:-)

[Sebski]

I've started a freezer stash but have a question about # of oz's to freeze in. The hospital sent me home w/ a huge case of Avent BM storage bottles but they are 4oz increments... the bag says to only freeze 3.5 in order to leave room for expansion.

I want to use these bottles since I have about 150 of them - no lie. But is it stupid to store BM in such a little amount? How many oz do you freeze?

[Marisa]

Seb -- I always stored in the 4oz. bottles, until I ran out of both bottles and room in my freezer. :) When he got bigger I would defrost two at a time if we were going somewhere.

[Brink]

Marisa - thanks for the advice on my trouble with BFing and going back and forth between EBM and breast. I ended up changing nipples to one that says it "promotes proper latch". I also got the slow flow to make her work harder. I also stopped using my bobby and lay her direct on my lap and kinda lean over her. This seems to have helped with gravity. While not perfect, it is getting better. I was so releived to hear her swallowing last night while BFing. Thanks for the support!

[Sarah]

Yo, where can I get those bottles the PIS comes with? DD seems to have lost 2 of mine, and I'd like more.

[BeachBum]

But is it stupid to store BM in such a little amount? How many oz do you freeze?

Well partly I think it depends on what your building your stash for. I SAH, so for me small amounts work best. That way if he is just missing me, my mom can give him a little bit to help him relax without wasting a "whole" bottle. IIf he does need a meal, she can just defrost more.
You will also want to remember that your breast milk changes as your baby grows, so you will not want to have too big of a stash that could become outdated.
Also, you might want to consult with kellymom.com to see the estimated number of ounces that XX aged babies eat. That might also help you make your decision.

[Kiley]

Sarah,
I got mine at Target - the Medela feeding/storage set (http://www.target.com/gp/detail.html/601-0130413-4008951?_encoding=UTF8&frombrowse=1&asin=B000056J90)($18.99). Otherwise, you could probably get them where the pumps are sold or online.

[lady1297]

Seb-my sil always froze in 4 oz segments (she needed them because she worked). She said they defrosted quicker and easier for her DH. So, another reason not to worry about small amounts!

[LexyLou]

I usually freeze in 2 and 3 oz bags. Some are 5 oz or 4 oz but in general 2 to 3 that way I can unfreeze only what I need and not waste others. Like two 3 oz for a 6 oz bottle or a 2 and a 3 for a 5 oz, etc..


Okay, I was looking at a formula feeding chart and it said that around 4 months FF babies take like 6-7 oz per feed. I've been giving DD 5 oz when I give her EBM. She always seems hungry after but I don't want to over fed her since she has reflux and is a spit up queen. Is 6 oz a good amount for a 4 month old or should I stick to 5 oz?

[deliciousjones]

My daughter is only nursing 4-5x per week and while I'm completely happy to keep this up, I'm wondering if that'e enough to make nursing worthwhile? My goal is to keep it up as much possible through cold & flu season.

Another question which I'm hesitant to ask in here since the general consensus seems to be that I'm intentionally causing harm to my child by offering her formula -- but now that she's 1 and still takes one bottle (as opposed to whole milk in a cup during the day) before bed (on the nights that she doesn't want to nurse), should I be giving her formula in that bottle, or whole milk?

[cc8]

I'm hesitant to ask in here since the general consensus seems to be that I'm intentionally causing harm to my child by offering her formula

deliciousjones - FWIW, I do NOT think any mom causes her DC ANY harm by feeding formula. As a baby, I was BFed for a few months and then switched to formula. And my mom is a pediatrician. Of course, there is so much more awareness now about "breast being best" but IMO there is NOTHING wrong with offering your DC formula.

[Marisa]

the general consensus seems to be that I'm intentionally causing harm to my child by offering her formula

Wow, whoever's telling you that... it'd be like me saying that whoever switches cold turkey to whole cow's milk at a year is UNintentionally causing harm, due to the issues with anemia that are more likely to come up with such a switch.

Offering a combination of whole milk and formula is a fantastic way to go about it, it gets her body used to the whole milk while still providing her with a complete nutritional package (formula). Since she's still so young I really don't see what the issue is.

I'm under the impression that one of the main motivators in switching entirely to whole milk at age 1 is the cost of formula. If that's not an issue for you, then what's the big deal?

Finally -- there are 'toddler' formulas on the market these days from all the big companies. They acknowledge that it might be better to have babies continue to drink this enriched and fortified concoction. Of course, 'toddler' formula has more corn syrup and stuff, so I wouldn't use it, I'd stick to the regular stuff. But the fact that it exists, that's relevant to your situation.

As for only nursing what works out to less than once a day... well, that's a very natural way to wean, IMO. And it does help -- any contact her saliva will have with your Montgomery glands will tell your body about the germs in her environment, and your body will begin producing antibodies that she'll start getting the next time she nurses.

[Dally]

Sarah--http://www.mybreastpump.com (http://www.mybreastpump.com)has medela pump parts at very reasonable prices. You can buy bottles separately from the kit.

[ellybelle]

Wow, whoever's telling you that... it'd be like me saying that whoever switches cold turkey to whole cow's milk at a year is UNintentionally causing harm, due to the issues with anemia that are more likely to come up with such a switch.

Offering a combination of whole milk and formula is a fantastic way to go about it, it gets her body used to the whole milk while still providing her with a complete nutritional package (formula). Since she's still so young I really don't see what the issue is.

I'm under the impression that one of the main motivators in switching entirely to whole milk at age 1 is the cost of formula. If that's not an issue for you, then what's the big deal?

Finally -- there are 'toddler' formulas on the market these days from all the big companies. They acknowledge that it might be better to have babies continue to drink this enriched and fortified concoction. Of course, 'toddler' formula has more corn syrup and stuff, so I wouldn't use it, I'd stick to the regular stuff.

I continued to supplement my DD with formula for several months after she turned one, gradually moving her to milk only (well, and breastmilk) by 2. This was partially on the advice of her ped, as I "beefed it up" a bit with an extra 1/2 scoop of powder (she was only 10th percentile in weight at her 1 year WBV). People looked at me like I was weird or doing something wrong at times when I gave her formula, but I didn't let it bother me. It was also quite convenient -- I could take a bag of the powder anwhere, and just mix it with bottled water!

FWIW, Similac toddler formula uses lactose rather than corn syrup as a sweetener. Of course, the cheapest thing to do is just use regular Target or Costco formula!

[newmommy]

Good News!!!

DS has gained 3oz this week, and Dr says that he thinks BF is going just fine, and not to worry about waking him for night time feedings :D
I'm so relieved!! Thanks again ladies!!

[moderngal]

Sarah-- Target and BRU sell Medela replacement parts. If you can wait for shipping, breastfeedingworld.com has them and has great customer service.

Lexy-- C-man took 6 ounces in his bottles at 4 months and was good with that until about 6.5 months or so.

Sebski-- I also freeze in smaller amounts. I thaw 2 if I need to make a full feeding, and then just one if we're doing a small bottle or mixing with solids.

Chicken-- good for you!!

[Jaycee]

Just thought I'd let you all know that LLL has just started an online forum using the VBulletin format just like we have over here. They just launched it today. Here's the link if anyones interested..

http://lalecheleague.org/vbulletin/

[LeslieR]

How cool is that? Another place to become addicted to! lol Thanks for posting the link, Jaycee!

[Jaycee]

No prob..see ya there :)

[girlygirl]

Does anyone know if it's safe to take the Ricola Herb Drops? The herbs in it are - elder, horehound, hyssop, lemon balm, linden flowers, mallow, peppermint, sage, thyme, and wild thyme. TIA!

[lorialys]

Thanks for the answers to my feeding cues question ladies. I appreciate it!

[NYN]

here is a page on what herbs are safe/unsafe:
http://www.kellymom.com/herbal/index.html

i didn't have time to read up on the ones you posted but i know off the top of my head that sage has been known to decrease milk supply.

[newmommy]

Oh no! :confused:
I just looked up a med my Dr prescribed me yesterday(I have been having headaches since DS was born) and she asked me to take them until tomorrow...and if there isn't any relief in sight, I have to go back in. Originally she thought it was high BP, but turns out it's just hormonal....now I'm worried because I've taken 3 pills since yesterday.....

Tell me, I asked my OBGYN several times if it was safe for DS....should I call my pedi????? :confused: :confused:

TIA

[newmommy]

I'm sorry, I forgot to add that the category stated that studies have not been done yet....but that the reason for the usage should outweigh the risks......:eek: What does that mean!!! Am I harming DS???? My OBGYN said it was perfectly safe.........oh man, what do you all think?

[newmommy]

Okay here is some info I found.....please please give your honest opinion.....I'm thinking of not taking anymore....
Breast-feeding—

For butalbital: Barbiturates such as butalbital pass into the breast milk and may cause drowsiness, unusually slow heartbeat, shortness of breath, or troubled breathing in nursing babies.
For acetaminophen: Although acetaminophen has not been shown to cause problems in nursing babies, it passes into the breast milk in small amounts.
For caffeine: Caffeine (present in some butalbital and acetaminophen combinations) passes into the breast milk in small amounts. Taking caffeine in the amounts present in these medicines has not been shown to cause problems in nursing babies. However, studies have shown that nursing babies may appear jittery and have trouble in sleeping when their mothers drink large amounts of caffeine-containing beverages. Therefore, breast-feeding mothers who use caffeine-containing medicines should probably limit the amount of caffeine they take in from other medicines or from beverages.

[newyorkgirl]

Chicken - I think Marisa (or maybe someone else too?) has a copy of the Hale book on medications and nursing mothers. In the meantime, I found his forum, which you can search.
http://neonatal.ama.ttuhsc.edu/cgi-bin/discus/discus.cgi?pg=topics&access=guest

[Marisa]

Chicken -- acetominiphen and caffeine have been considered safe in normal doses, but I would be a little concerned about the Butalbital, for its sedative effects. Since your baby is so young, any that did transfer through your milk would have a stronger effect on him than it would a younger baby. Hale gives it a category L3, which is moderately safe, but your baby is less than 2 weeks old.

Watch him for sedation, and don't take anymore if you're not comfortable doing so. Try using regular Tylenol (acetominiphen) or ibuprofen for the pain. If it is hormonal, perhaps it will resolve itself without meds as your body returns to normal postpartum. It won't be much longer, esp. since you're breastfeeding (which eases the return to normal hormone levels).


ETA --meant to say -

When they say "the reason for the usage should outweigh the risks" -- it would be something like, if your pain is such that you're having trouble functioning, that it's affecting your mental state, that you can't care for yourself/your baby, then you should consider using the med. The benefit of having your symptoms relieved would outweigh the possible risk of sedation.

I still think that if you're uncomfortable, you should discuss alternatives with your dr, though. It won't make you feel better to have less pain and more anxiety!! :) You know what's best for you and your baby, trust your instincts. :)

[newmommy]

Yup I spoke to the pedi, she said that it's fine to take the med for a brief amount of time.
Although we agreed that I'm not comfortable so I've decided to drink coffee after a couple of feedings....caffeine has always helped my headaches....so we've agreed that 2/3 cups spread out throughout the day would help my headaches and have little to no affect on DS.....Marisa, do you agree that this is a good plan??? You are a wealth of knowledge!!!

[Sarah]

Another question which I'm hesitant to ask in here since the general consensus seems to be that I'm intentionally causing harm to my child by offering her formula -- but now that she's 1 and still takes one bottle (as opposed to whole milk in a cup during the day) before bed (on the nights that she doesn't want to nurse), should I be giving her formula in that bottle, or whole milk?

I would go with either toddler formula or whole milk. I don't think it matters that much. Formula does have extra good stuff, so maybe if you can afford it, use that, but it's kind of a hassle, right?

[NYN]

so we've agreed that 2/3 cups spread out throughout the day would help my headaches and have little to no affect on DS..
FWIW, i drink way too much coffee everyday (i would say 4 cups on average) and my DD has never reacted to it one way or another.

[EJM]

Chicken: Have you tried just regular Advil? I too take migraine medication, but have not had it since I was pregnant (exactly a year ago). It fell into that "no major studies have been done" category and I wasn't comfortable putting the baby at risk.

When I asked about the medication in this thread a few weeks ago and breastfeeding, Marisa looked in Hale's book and found that Imitrex (search back a ways and you'll find the post) might be ok. I had a bad reaction to that, but it might work for you. I normally don't get much relief from Advil, but it is better than nothing and seems to be more effective since I got pregnant. I've been going to acupuncture for additional relief.

Oh, I also drink 2-3 cups of coffee a day and my DD has never had a problem with it.

[newmommy]

Oh great!!! Thanks!!!
In the hospital they prescribed prescription strength Motrin....and it didn't do a thing for my headache. I haven't taken any meds today, I took a nap and had a cup of coffee....and no headache :D

Thanks everyone for the support!!

[HGMorgann]

I was so happy today! I was 3 women NIPing at the mall this afternoon! Apparently in front of Old Navy is the PLACE to NIP! Thats where I always nurse her too at the mall;-)

[sunni76]

ChickenI'm glad the caffeine worked! I have been nursing for almost 10 months now, and I drink a cup or 2 off coffee everyday, doesn't really seem to affect DD. I did without while pg, but I just couldn't do it anymore;)
I looked up butalbital in a reference we use at work (I'm a pharmacist), and it does say potential toxicity with breastfeeding. Plus, that's just nasty stuff, I would say stay away from it if you can! maybe a better option would be Midrin? I looked up the combo of drugs in that and they say limited data, but probably compatible, so at least that's better than the butalbital. Plus, there is no caffeine in Midrin (still is acetaminophen though), so you could always just use it as a last resort if your cup of coffee doesn't work. HTH:)

[Toonces]

Marisa ~ Do you know if it's safe to take Clomid while BFing? My DD is 15 months old and still approx 95% BF. AF has returned, and I am ovulating but very late in my cycle. My LP is also short - only 9-10 days. We're TTC#2 and my OB mentioned Clomid but said she wouldn't give it to me if I'm BFing. I did a little research on the Internet and found that it's either okay, or not researched enough. Do you know what Dr. Hale's stance is? I checked the Dr. Hale mssg board that was posted above, but couldn't find info on Clomid. TIA!!!

[HGMorgann]

Clomid According to Hale, it is L4 - Possibly Hazardous. It also may dry up your milk supply.

Over on the mothering boards - TTC while Nursing - moms use Vitex for short LP and late O. I don't have any research on hand though. We used Vitex instead of Clomid to conceive DD.

[Toonces]

Thank you, HGMorgann! I'll have to check out Vitex. I've heard of it before but haven't looked into it yet.

[newmommy]

Sunni, thanks so much for looking that up for me : )

Well the caffeine has done the trick, and I have been taking a short nap every afternoon, and it seems to be working. I did have a headache when I woke up, but I'll deal :)

Oh, how much water should I be drinking??

I still can't get over the fact that I'm breast feeding....I honestly didn't think It'd work or that I'd like it!!! Even my best friend can't believe that I've stuck with it.

I don't feel comfortable BIP, and I'm not even sure how long I'll continue, but for now, it's so rewarding to see DS's little face look up at me when he's content...it's such a loving act....okay, am I being too corny or what :D

Here is a question that I'm not sure if it's appropriate or not....but what about intimacy with DH?? How is that handled(pardon the pun) while BF? I'm sure it'll come up, and I kind of would like to know what the norm is.....and if it's not appropriate for this thread, by all means, tell me(in the nicest way possible ;) )

[Marisa]

Chicken -- I'm happy for you that it's been working out so well! It sounds like you're really a 'success story' so far! :)

It's hard to get used to the idea of nursing in public. I probably didn't do it until he was several weeks old and I felt like I really had the hang of stuff. I did nurse him at "Mom's group" meetings, but that seemed different, because we were all new moms going through the same thing.

Intimacy might be a bit of a challenge at first, just because your body may not feel 100% back to normal for a time. But that could likely be the case whether you're BFing or not -- just make sure that you're resting, eating right, taking care of yourself, sleeping whenever possible. That will certainly help get you in 'the mood'!

As for the BFing part, it *can* actually cause you to be dryer than usual, so definitely use enough lube and take it slow the first few times. It may take some getting used to. I also found that it was much better once my cycles returned, but since we were cosleeping, exclusively nursing for a long time, etc, that wasn't until after my baby was a year.

And as for the water, drink to thirst, try for 8 cups a day but don't force it. It's good to be well-hydrated, but we were just discussing a couple of pages ago that you can be *too* hydrated as well, and that can be bad for your production. Don't overdo it! :)

[newmommy]

Thanks Marisa, you've been so helpful!! I love this forum!! It's so wonderful to get feedback so quickly!!

I'm learning to mellow out a bit when it comes to the length of time DS nurses at each session...today was the first day that I didn't really "force" the second breast...I figure that when he's hungry he'll let me know...if not we'll be back in approximately 1 hour!

My parents came over today and told me how much fuller DS's face has become!! Obviously, I'm doing something right ;)

[newmommy]

So DS's diaper had a different colored stool---more of a green color...is that okay? It's been yellow and seedy every time, this is the first time it's changed color....

[HGMorgann]

Chicken, its probally fine. His last meal probally was more just the first milk that isn't as fatty - thus the green poop. Try to make sure he finishes the first side before going to the next at each feeding so he gets all of the fatty hindmilk, and then the next feeding start him off on the side that he finished on from the previous feeding and his poop should go back to yellow seedy. My DD had off and on spurts of greens and its just normal now for her to have a green one every once in a while. Does that make sense? I'm not very articulate tonight;-)

[angelgirl8]

just got home from the hospital yesterday with one of our twins. i've been breastfeeding both (although they are getting some supplementation...especially the twin in the NICU). my milk finally came in at about 3AM.

a few hours ago, i noticed a huge, painful bump under both of my armpits. i tried getting in a hot shower and massaging the bumps but nothing helped.

it really hurts and it even hurts to move my arms!



anyone know what this is? can it be a clogged duct? i'm not engorged at all, but i definitely have milk.

i called my doctor and she thought it was inflamed breast tissue. should i be using ice? will this mess with my supply and stuff?

also...should i continue to pump right now? i'm supposed to be pumping right now for my baby in the hospital, but i'm afraid to create more milk if it will make the bump worse.

[lil_nance]

YEAH! Connor is 6mo old today. I originally planned on BFing for only 6mo. Thanks to all your support, LLL, and BFing just generally being better than I expected, we are going to continue. I'm not sure how long we'll BF but for now we're just taking it day by day. And my boy loves the mommy juice. :D We were at the ped last week, he's 18lb 8 oz (started at 6lb 11oz). I EBF except for a tiny bit of supplementing that first week when we were getting started.

[MrsTazlvr]

I never thought I'd end up in this thread. I wasn't able to BF DD#1 and never thought I would BF DD#2. Well DD#2 is 2 1/2 weeks old and has been BF like a champ. I am so proud of her and of myself for even trying it again this time. My question is this:

When DD latches it hurts like hell for the first minute to minute and a half and then I am fine. How can I prevent the latch from hurting? Any tips? I literally hit the ceiling when she latches and it makes me dread the initial start of each BF session. Thanks. :)

[Dreshny]

angelgirl: Congratulations on the twins! Either call the LLL Manhattan hotline to find out which leader is on call tonight (the number is (212) 794-4687) or call Beth, the leader for the UWS (she's really, really nice, and her number is (212) 799-1894.)

There's actually a LLL meeting on Tues. at 2:00 at Beth's apt. The info is on the website (www.lllmanhattan.com.)

[nancy drew]

mrstazlvr congrats on bfing #2!! heres to a long and healthy bfing relationship :)

i remember when nursing dd it hurt like a mofo when she latched on. once she was latched and nursing i was fine, but man. that hurt. i thought i had thrush, and asked my dr about it at my 6 week checkup but she said it was just normal "getting used to bfing" pain. it did get better on its own, so even if none of the following help at least know that most likely it will get better for you soon.

*try using lanolin cream after each feeding. theres no need to wash it off before nursing. it can help with chapped or dry nipples.

*let your boobs air-dry after nursing.

*get some "soothies" nursing pads from BRU or your local pharmacy. they are gel pads that cool and soothe your nipples between feedings. it may help out with latch pain.

*make sure she has a good latch. sometimes latching on wrong can be painful to mama. her mouth should be open wide, bottom lip out, lots of boob and nipple in her mouth.

im sure the other ladies have some great advice too. keep up the great work!!!

[Marisa]

angelgirl - it is totally normal! You actually have milk-producing tissue from your armpits to below your breasts. It is likely just engorged/enflamed tissue, as your dr. said. I had the same problem, although mine started when I was pregnant. I imagine that it's engorged there even though your actual breasts are not engorged because it's probably harder for the milk to move out of that area.

You can try warm compresses, definitely definitely continue to pump! Those babies need their milk, and you need to keep your supply up! :) If you find that the swelling in your armpits worsens, you can use cold cabbage leaves on just those areas to 'inhibit' your supply in that area. Don't do it more than once or twice, and don't apply to any other part of your breast -- it really could affect your supply negatively. It ultimately was the only thing that helped me when my milk came in and I couldn't put my arms down.


Nancy -- congrats on reaching 6 months! You know, I couldn't say so at the time of course, but I always hoped you'd have this kind of experience and decide to keep going for a while. Every day you continue is great for both of you. :)

[portlandbride]

I posted over in the pumping thread a few days ago about my decrease in supply. Well, today I found out the reason for my decrease in milk production though...

I'm pregnant:)

It's a bit of a surprise, as we weren't not trying but we weren't trying either.
I'm very sad to be losing my milk production already. Does anyone have any success stories of BF through a pregnancy? My DD is only 8 months old and I wanted to go at least a year.
My plan as of right now is to keep pumping and as long as I am getting a bottle's worth a day I will continue to pump. I will also continue to BF when we are together.
Any recommendations on how to introduce formula? I don't even know when to give it to her. She seemed satisfied this weekend just BF, will it be obvious when she wants more?

[newmommy]

DS was up most of the night, the reason?
3 poopie-----yellow/seedy diapers!!!! :D
It was so frustrating because I didn't expect that would happen!!
I had 4 hours of sleep:( , and poor dh, tpday is his first day back to work!!!!!!



Also DS does this new thing when he is aggrivated----- he starts to shake his head back and forth and doesn't latch----instead he cries, anyone seen this?

[Marisa]

Brandi! Congratulations! :D Although you're seeing a drop in supply already, you may find that you don't really "dry up" -- or if you do, it may not happen until later in your pregnancy.

Get a copy of "Adventures in Tandem Nursing" -- it's available on Amazon, or ask your local library if they can find a copy for you through interlibrary loan (if they don't already have it).

Although the name implies that it's about nursing two babies at once, it really has some terrific information about nursing through a pregnancy. You will likely find a lot of the info you need in there.

This page on Kellymom may help too:
http://www.kellymom.com/nursingtwo/faq/16milkchanges.html

It suggests that you will know when your supply is really dipping when she seems to be increasing her feedings, or when she ups her intake of solids (if you're currently giving solids).

You might also find this page interesting:
http://www.kellymom.com/nursingtwo/articles/bfpregnancy_safety.html


Chicken -- some of that fussing is just normal newborn stuff -- it goes away gradually as their nervous system matures. Right now his movements are a little impulsive, he doesn't have a ton of control over them sometimes. But the behavior you describe sound like a "late" hunger cue -- meaning, he might be hungry and frustrated already when he gets to the breast. Try watching and getting him on a little sooner. A lot of babies do that 'fussing' when they're trying to get the letdown to come faster.

[newmommy]

Thanks Marisa, the funny thing is, I don't wait for him to cry at all...once he starts showing me signs, it's on the boob he goes! Funny enough he doesn't do that head thing until mid way---one time I figured out that he wanted to suck sans milk....and the paci worked like magic.

Now I've read that I should use my nipple instead of a paci, but he seems to get too annoyed when he gets the milk he doesn't want....

Thanks again ;)

[HGMorgann]

Chicken, at some point, when she was still wee-bity, my daughter would get soooo mad if she just wanted to comfort suck and milk came out. So we introduced the paci. It was earlier than recommended by LC's - however I just made sure her latch stayed good and that she nursed frequently. Right now, you could try to get him to suck on a clean pinky finger. Dh was my DD's paci for a while:-)

[celina]

I have a cold (sore throat and nasal drip). Is there anything I can take that won't hurt my milk supply?

Thanks. :(

[shellbell516]

I've always had a fast let-down and we have delt with that ok. My DD is almost 5 months old. There are times that she'll pop off and milk will spray everywhere. This happens when I don't feel extremely engorged as well as when I am engorged. I usally try to catch it in a burp cloth until the spray stops, but sometime we go through this pattern several time during a feeding. Will it always be this way?

[Marisa]

Celina -- the Tylenol cold products are generally safe. Try to stay away from products with pseudoephedrine -- an alternative would be the active ingredient phenylephrine, which also works to clear nasal stuffiness. I believe that I bought some Sudafed with this active ingredient, it's not too hard to find.

If pseudoephedrine is the only thing that brings you relief, try to take it as sparingly as possible. I used to reserve it for right before bed, so I'd be sure to get a couple of peaceful hours of sleep.

Robitussin and other cough remedies with the active ingredient Dextromethorphan are also considered safe.


Michelle -- I had a similar problem with my son until he was about 6 months old, I think. Once he became more active and started spacing his feedings a bit more during the day, my body began to adapt. You can also try -- if you're not already -- feeding on one side exclusively for one feeding. I did this for many months. In a few days your body should start to respond and lower the production to meet the demand.

[newmommy]

Yay or nay on MSG?

[Marisa]

From kellymom.com

Can I eat foods containing MSG (monosodium glutamate)?

Human milk normally contains free glutamates (avg. of 22 mg/100g milk). Breastmilk levels are only modestly affected by moms ingestion of MSG. [FSANZ 2003, IFICF 2001, Stegink 1972]


www.kellymom.com is an awesome site run by a IBCLC, it usually has quick answers to all kinds of questions on drugs, diet, pretty much anything that comes up, really! :)

[newmommy]

THANK YOU THANK YOU THANK YOU!!!
You're the best!!! We just ordered hot and sour soup!!!

[Marisa]

THANK YOU THANK YOU THANK YOU!!!
You're the best!!! We just ordered hot and sour soup!!!

YUM! I just realized how hungry I am... LOL, time to stop playing online and go look for some lunch!

[EJM]

I think DD is coming down with a cold, and I wanted to see if kellymom suggested anything to help get over it more quickly and avoid a nursing strike. Anyway, I'm reading along and find this:

"Sometimes moms are advised to limit or discontinue breastfeeding because milk increases mucus production. This is not good advice for two reasons:

1. You are not a cow and your milk is not a dairy product.........."

For some reason that made me LOL. Thanks kellymom for clearing up any confusion! :p

Does anyone here have any other suggestions for nipping her cold in the bud?

[Marisa]

For us, steam really helped (sit in the bathroom with the door closed, shower on hot) -- and when Joey did have "strikes", he would still nurse a bit when he was quite sleepy.

[shellbell516]

Marisa - thanks! We have been doing one side nursing from the beginning, but I'm pumping at work both side at the same time. Maybe I'm confusing my body?

[portlandbride]

Marisa
Thanks for the support! I will definitley look at those kellymom resources. I went to Barnes and Noble today to buy the Adventures in Tandum Nursing book but they didn't have it. I guess I will order it.

[nancy drew]

I posted over in the pumping thread a few days ago about my decrease in supply. Well, today I found out the reason for my decrease in milk production though...

I'm pregnant:)

It's a bit of a surprise, as we weren't not trying but we weren't trying either.
I'm very sad to be losing my milk production already. Does anyone have any success stories of BF through a pregnancy? My DD is only 8 months old and I wanted to go at least a year.
My plan as of right now is to keep pumping and as long as I am getting a bottle's worth a day I will continue to pump. I will also continue to BF when we are together.
Any recommendations on how to introduce formula? I don't even know when to give it to her. She seemed satisfied this weekend just BF, will it be obvious when she wants more?
congrats!!

i did nurse my daughter throuhg my pregnancy, though she was just shy of a year when i found out i was pregnant. i didnt switch to formula, since she was older, i had to use rice milk since she is allergic to dairy and soy milk. so what i did was nurse her as often as she liked, but keep a cup of rice milk handy while she was playing. sometimes when she signed "milk" (her way of asking to nurse) i would offer her the cup of rice milk instead. sometimes she took it but usually she didnt want it. especially at first, she just wanted to nurse. i never really pushed the rice milk, but i wanted to get her accustomed to the idea of it. over the course of a few months she would take the rice milk and drink some, then drink all. soon we were nursing only at naptime and bedtime. eventually that just hurt way too much (7 or 8 months?) and i cut it to bedtime only. and then i cut that to 5 minutes only, again due to the pain and because i wasnt sure anymore that i wanted to tandem nurse. it was a fairly mutual process, i think. if she had been extremely upset by any of it i would have continued to nurse her, but she seemed fine with it all so it worked for us.

so my advice is to go slowly. if she takes bottles or sippies, maybe try mixing 3/4 EBM and 1/4 formula for a while, then even out the ratio, then switch to formula. but you want to get her accustomed to the taste. and you have time, so if she hates the formula then when she is 1 year she should be ok on whole milk (unless she has dairy allergies).

oh, something that happened to me that i read about in "adventnures in tandem nursing" was that while nursing my daughter during pregnancy i had these "get OFF me!!!!!" feelings that were really strange. it was like i wanted to just delatch her and put her down and run away. i had no clue that would happen, but i was happy to read it was totally normal. after learning that, i could just sit in the glider and deal with those feelings rather than let them get the best of me.

good luck!

[dziner]

Coming to you all for advice...

I have an 8 week old DS. He pretty much nurses every two hours during the day. Question one...when will he be able to go longer?

Question two...last night he was difficult to settle (most nights that's the case) and finally conked out in the swing from 9-12. Nursed at 12, and I was completely exhausted so we both fell asleep. Woke up at 1:30am with back and neck aches from having him on me in an awkward position. Tried to move him to PNP and he just got pissed. Dealt with screaming baby for a half hour, no matter where we tried to put him to sleep. Ended up nursing again at 2am just to calm him down...and we both fell asleep. Same thing happened again until I nursed him at 5am. It can take an hour to get him back to sleep after he wakes and it is truly draining, and then he's up again a couple hours later for a repeat scenario. If we both fall asleep and I try to move him, forget about it.

How do you get your DC to settle down after nursing if you don't co-sleep? I am desperate to stop being the human paci. I don't know if he's truly hungry or if I am just resorting to nursing b/c nothing else will quiet him.

[1_mommy]

How do you get your DC to settle down after nursing if you don't co-sleep? I am desperate to stop being the human paci. I don't know if he's truly hungry or if I am just resorting to nursing b/c nothing else will quiet him.
__________________

i think at times i am still my ds human paci and he is 3 months old.
i am sorry i don't have any advice, we have resorted to letting ds sleep in the swing at night because he will sleep all night that way. i am not a big fan of doing this. but this mama was really sleep deprived the first 2 months, and since going back to work i really need my sleep.
there are still nights that ds wants to nurse all night long.

[newyorkgirl]

Hee! My DS is 6 months old and sometimes I *still* feel like a human paci!

Sorry. I know it's frustrating.

The only advice I have is maybe let your DS sleep in a swing. Or you can swaddle your DS and nurse him until he falls asleep. Perhaps he may be easier to transfer to the bassinet/crib that way.

I understand if you're against cosleeping. We had DS sleep in his own crib from Day 1, but there were nights when we would just bring him to our bed and "nap nurse." It was just easier than going back and forth and waking up each time.

I think until DS was around 4 months old, we just did whatever was necessary to get him to sleep.

Good luck!

[sunni76]

angelgirlCongrats! We have a few of the same friends over in LJ, and I know everyone was concerned with how you were doing. I'm glad to hear you are home. When is the other baby coming home?

[nancy drew]

dziner are you willing to give him a paci? stella never did the paci thing but nathan does. it took some effort (a long car ride sucking on my finger led to him accepting the paci) but now the paci is my savior. to get him to sleep, i nurse, swaddle (miracle blanket plus an outer swaddle since he breaks out of the mb), plug him in, and he falls asleep (naptime only, nighttime takes a lot more effort which may include rocking, bouncing, walking, singing, more nursing, some fussing, more walking, etc.). if you cant get him to take a paci, can you try using a finger in his mouth as a paci? after he is done eating and is just comfort nursing, you can "bait and switch" with your finger, or delatch and wait til he fusses then stick a finger in his mouth. i found that if i held my finger upside down so my fingertip was touching the roof of his mouth he was happy, otherwise notsomuch. i never tried that with stella and i wonder if it would have saved me hours of comfort nursing.

[dziner]

Thanks for your replies. nancy, we are total paci addicts with this kid since the last thing on earth we need is to have Ava wake up when he's screaming at 2am! I know you can relate. He generally needs it to fall asleep, but we are in the same boat...daytime is much easier than nighttime. Although he really is a light sleeper during the day and starts to howl if I leave the room he's in! The only nap he'll take in the PNP is the first of the day; after that he has to come around the house with me in the carseat or swing. At night we just cross our fingers and pray he'll sleep someplace, although I am pushing for the PNP for good habits' sake. But it is sooo hard to get him back to sleep after he wakes up at night. I just dread it. I'm so damn tired.

[lil_nance]

We recently dropped our 11pm "dream feed". DS has been STTN for 10-12hr for the past 3 nights. I love the extra sleep but I'm waking up in the morning engorged and sore. How long before my body will regulate itself out again?

[newyorkgirl]

lil nance - It shouldn't take more than a couple days. I found I wouldn't be engorged, but I would be very full. The problem comes when they STTN one night, and then not the next night, and then STTN again. :)

Forgot to say - congrats on making it to the 6-month mark! And I'm glad you are going to continue. :)

[MrsTazlvr]

Moms of 2~ How do you take care of both kids when the younger one wants to nurse and the older one needs tending to also. DH went back to work today and here is the scenerio I dealt with a few times today.

Allie (2 year old) woke up at 7:30 but played in her room until she really got noisy and woke Daniella (2 1/2 week old) and me. I had to get Daniella up and change her diaper before going into Allie's room. Daniella ended up peeing as I was putting a new diaper on her she I had to change her, take the wet sheet off the bed (I was changing her on my bed), etc. Once I finished that I had to go into Allie's room because she had been up and alone for over an hour and was starting to cry for me. I changed her diaper while Daniella laid on Allie's bed screaming for food. By the time we all got downstairs, I had to find something for Allie to eat so she would be occupied so I could nurse Daniella. Poor Daniella was frantically wanting to nurse by this point and I felt terrible.

Fast forward to after naptime. I got both of the girls to go down for a nap at close to the same time (miracle of miracles). I even got to take a nap, too. Well when we all woke up around the same time I had the same problem again- Daniella had to be changed, wanted to nurse, Allie needed to be changed, and she wanted a snack. I repeated the steps above- Daniella diaper, Allie diaper, Allie snack, nurse Daniella, but of course Daniella was starving by then. Does the baby just always get the short end of the stick right now? Is there an easier way? I hate when she frantically wants to nurse, but I can't leave Allie with a poopy diaper for 30-40 minutes while I nurse. And I have to get her occupied with something before I can even nurse Daniella- snack, breakfast, video, etc. Help!!! :confused: Thanks.

[newmommy]

what about burping??? ds rarely burps............should I burp him longer/wait until he does?

[AlisonCO]

Mrs. Tazlvr - Here are some things that helped me to make the scenarios you mentioned easier: A couple of times a week I make up snack bags of things my DS likes and put them in the fridge and pantry (grapes, strawberries, goldfish, cheese cubes, pretzels, raisins etc) that way if DS needs a snack and DD needs to eat, he can pick something out in a few seconds - also I try to do fresh diapers before naps so that most of the time they do not need a fresh one right when they wake up - I fill up a milk sippy for DS the night before and then in the am do a water, milk and OJ sippy so they are ready when DS is thirsty - I know it sucks to lose those few minutes of sleep, but I get up as soon as I hear DS stir so I can pee and brush my teeth and get breakfast #1 ready (dry cereal and a banana) then I can nurse DD while he snacks and we read or play and then when she is done, we both eat a real breakfast. DD is now 4 months and much more predictable so those times like you mentioned don't happen as often as I can usually predict when she will wake up. :)

[Marisa]

Chicken -- can you have DH give it a shot? My husband was always good at coaxing a burp out, even when I couldn't. I think men aren't afraid to 'whack' a little harder. :) Other than that... unless he's visibly uncomfortable, don't feel like you have to work too hard at it. There's not going to be air bubbles in your breast the way there would be in a bottle. :)


Cori -- I haven't been there yet, but imagining a newborn with my son the way he is right now, I can't picture being able to do it without a sling of some sort. Even if you can't nurse in the sling right away (it takes practice!), you can still keep the newborn close and snuggly and content while you tend to the older one for a few minutes. Of course it wouldn't always work if D is frantically hungry, but it might buy you a few extra minutes when she's just awake and chilling. :)

[MrsTazlvr]

Thanks, Alison. The idea of getting snacks ready in advance is a good one. I guess there isn't much I can do about the diaper issue because today Allie had a poopy diaper right after her nap and Daniella ALWAYS has a poopy diaper since she is BF. I am sure I'll get better organized as I get more used to having 2 and things will get better. I think the key will be planning ahead. Now that I have experienced a day with both of my girls alone, I can see where improvements need to be made. ;)

Marisa~ I had the Nojo with Allie and she didn't really like it. I just bought an Ellaroo for Daniella, but I still need to figure out how to comfortably get her in it. So far she has cried in it, but I know I need to adjust it more. I'll have to get one of my slinging friends to show me how to use it. I never used a sling in the newborn position with Allie, only the hip carry or kangaroo carry. Slinging Daniella is a great idea though if I can get the hang of it. Thanks. :)

[krbb]

I have been stressed out the past couple of days about DS's weight. He was 9lbs4oz when we left the hospital. Two days later he was already at his birth weight of 9lbs11oz. Then three days after that he was 9lbs14oz. He had thrush, still has it, so we had to go in again 4 days later, they weighed him with his clothes on and who knows what in his diaper and he was 10lbs5oz. The next week he had his two week check up and was only 10lbs4oz (with only a diaper) so the Dr made us come back two weeks later which was Friday. He was 10lbs13oz so gained 9oz in two weeks. The Dr said it was good but not great and we have to go back again in another two weeks. He still has the thrush so I am not sure if that is affecting him. He has about 4-5 poopy diapers and more than that for wet. He was gaining so well at first so now I am so worried. My MIL,